"Witcher" - this was the first of the stories I read that I'd seen first in the form of adaptation on the show It was also the first published piece that started the whole thing in 1986.
Him claiming the Law of Surprise as a joke in the show makes no sense at all, having just seen a demonstration of its power. Ew, making a joke of it? And yes, I agree it's especially dumb after they just solved the problem the previous "joke" had made...
Heh, yeah, Nenneke and Calanthe are the strong women done right, as opposite to the StrongWomanTM cliche sprouting in every movie and book now...
But I can't believe the show chose to omit the "go fuck yourself" joke, which was hands down the best part abut the story. Probably because it makes Geralt look fallible (in a silly, not tragic way).And that's why it was there in the first place and why they should have kept it, grr. I don't even care much and it's still disappointing how the show apparently broke exactly the parts that were good and made the original stand out. (So, what the first wish
( ... )
And yes, I agree it's especially dumb after they just solved the problem the previous "joke" had made...
I'm atually not sure why they couldn't have just stuck with the book's way of doing it? The joke felt pretty out of character and was, as you say, just generally dumb.
Heh, yeah, Nenneke and Calanthe are the strong women done right,
Agreed, and I loved them both, unsurprisingly. (And thought the show did a pretty good job with Calanthe.)
So, what the first wish was in the show, then? No twist at all? Geralt means "Fuck off!" and he really says what he thinks he says?
It wasn't very memorable, so already has started to fade, but I think his first wish -- which he speaks when it looks like there is no djinn/the djinn is a dud, or if it exists, that Jaskier is its master, so it's also not meant as a wish -- is for Jaskier to shut up, which causes Jaskier's condition that they need to search for a healer for. Or at least that's what I think happens...
Wow, your translation is really good! :D I mean, I can't judge how it reads,
( ... )
I'm atually not sure why they couldn't have just stuck with the book's way of doing it? The showrunner/whoever-(un)wrote-this felt the need to prove themselves for the payroll? :P
It wasn't very memorable, so already has started to fade "... : the show's review". XD
is for Jaskier to shut up, which causes Jaskier's condition that they need to search for a healer for. Hm, that's actually not so bad idea, aside of that there was no need to coming up with ideas in the first place, especially at the cost of existing ones... Also, this makes a need for coming up with a new reason to why the djinn ran away.
Probably even more so now after having watched the TV show, which definitely should be enjoyed on that level :)Fight & bath scenes + Jaskier being cute, as I hear, yeah. :D Come to think of it, while I think the books leave much to demand
( ... )
The showrunner/whoever-(un)wrote-this felt the need to prove themselves for the payroll? :P
Maybe they cut it for time? (it kin of is an entire subplot, that needs to happen, and then Geralt needs to show off what he thinks he's doing, and then the punchline. On the other hand, the episode had a whole bunch of Ciri related things that could've gone elsewhere, so I dunno.
Also, this makes a need for coming up with a new reason to why the djinn ran away.It's actually not clear in the show that it did run away. It's not immediately malevolent, so it doesn't need to be banished -- before I read the story, I figure the wind and things associated with the djinn were just it doing its magic, not a threat in itself. And it's only shown to be destructive once Yennefer tries to trap it, which also kind of made sense. (But, yeah, the book way hangs together better/makes more coherent sense, as well as being FUNNIER
( ... )
As I see it, they made a mistake by advertising it as adaptation and especially a faithful adaptation. They should have just said up front they're doing something spin-offy, "our story in the Witcherverse blah blah", and everyone would be happy, even the fandom. So, basically a honest calling fanfic a fanfic.
I confess that I find the Russian/Slavic fantasy I've read to take itself a little TOO seriouslyHah, that's more like the high fantasy trait than "Slavic" fantasy - from the old fans POV. :D That's funny, actually, because when we look at it in context, the books origin was just this - it aimed at taking the fantasy (as Poles of 80/90s knew it) off its high horse. At that time and place it was fresh - Tolkien and ethereal Elves all around, suddenly there comes in a fantasy where beer and guts are spilled equally, and people talk (local!) Villagese instead of Elven. Of course, inspiration and popularity did their thing, so this approach was original maybe for a few months. Meanwhile, the western fantasy and creative writing in
( ... )
I confess that I find the Russian/Slavic fantasy I've read to take itself a little TOO seriously Hah, that's more like the high fantasy trait than "Slavic" fantasy -
No, I actually don't think the thing I'm talking about is a genre-specific thing. But maybe I shouldn't have used the term "Slavic fantasy" -- I don't mean it in the Witcher sense where it's specifically Slavic in flavor(/soul), just as a broader origin term, since I've noticed it in Russian fantasy I've read but it seems to me Sapkowski is similar
( ... )
I don't mean it in the Witcher sense where it's specifically Slavic in flavor(/soul), just as a broader origin term This is how I understood it too, I didn't think/know "Slavic fantasy" as a genre is a thing, hmm...
And there was the guy who "continued" Tolkien's books by focusing on the Hobbits and the Orcs and making the humans all grubby mercenaries and ignoring the Elves, I think -- very well known in Russia for a time; I even read a few.Perumov? Haven't read him, though
( ... )
That's the one :P Is he known in Poland, too? (I did read the first 2 books or so, because I wanted to see what it was like and also wanted more Middle-Earth, but I can't say he's a good author, or does much of anything original with it. I mean, it's fanfic, basically, but very self-important fanfic.
but in Poland "Slavic mythology" outside of the most academical circles is an uncommon idea My sense is, the same in Russia -- it's folktales and stuff, not Myth
( ... )
Is he known in Poland, too? I think he might be more known ~20 years ago than now, though it always was a niche popularity, just among fantasy fans. I think in recent weeks I've seen someone mentioning him on some forum as an example of "retelling from bad guys POV". (Might or might not be a Polish forum, though. *scratches head* You know, one of those "can't remember what language I read it in" cases. o_______o)
Because I feel like sci-fi WAS seen as a legitimate genre in Russia (and I assume Poland, if Lem was as popular there as he was in the USSR?)I confirm, for the whole paragraph. On one hand sci-fi was "plaything", on the other side it was "still better than fantasy" and easier to associate with Big Themes. However, there also always was that shift of the perspective waiting behind the corner - sci-fi = plaything, but good sci-fi = actually mainstream, and then it usually was called "alegorical", "surrealistic", "grotesque" and such; anything but the genre name. Lem was maybe the only author regarded as a top tier writer while
( ... )
but good sci-fi = actually mainstream, and then it usually was called "alegorical", "surrealistic", "grotesque" and such; anything but the genre name
I concur for Russia, except that "fantastika" was a respected enough name in itself -- because it was assumed to stand for "allegory", "surrealism", etc.
On the other hand, there are works that I would map onto fantasy that definitely never got called that, like Master i Margarita (I mean, how is that not the same genre as Good Omens?) -- because there wasn't even a name for it. (I should've asked, actually, what is fantasy called in Polish? Because in Russian it's "фэнтези, so you can tell it's of very modern vintage
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fantasy that definitely never got called that, like Master i Margarita (I mean, how is that not the same genre as Good Omens?) Exactly.
what is fantasy called in Polish?Mostly copied English with Polish mixed in. A typical bookstore or library has a section/bookcase/whole wall of "fantastyka" (so, speculative fiction in general), and within this there are recognized (more in discussions and reviews than physically on the shelf) those three main ones, with sub-subgenres
( ... )
I'm not sure about modern shelving, but to my mind, in Russian, "fantastika" would be just a shorter way of saying "nauchnaya fatastika" (the official way of saying it) and would not, I think, include fantasy. I think it is abbreviated as NF, but I might be making that up... And your subcategorization makes me realize I have no idea how to say "horror" in Russian as a genre, or whether it's even a thing...
I don't think I've heard the fantasy subgenres referred to in Russian at all...
or so unimportant in English that it got no popular English names is fantastyka bliskiego/dalekiego zasięgu (sci-fi of the short/long range
I actually have heard the English terms "far future SF" and "near future SF", but in my experience that's the kin of thing you find in blurbs and reviews, not as official subgenre categorization.
Btw, fandom as a word has been in use here for at least ~30-40 years, but back in the day it meant speculative fiction fans in general - people that read the genre,
( ... )
And your subcategorization makes me realize I have no idea how to say "horror" in Russian as a genre, or whether it's even a thing... Huh, that's actually surprising. Russia has such horror potential it could be for horror what Scandinavia is for crime. It could easily grow own subgenres. Taiga gothic... :)
"far future SF" and "near future SF" Ah, thanks! I was sure it must be a thing, just apparently too little discussed to find names easily.
(and dislike both manifestations of this thing, as you know.) In Polish we call it "smrodek dydaktyczny" (didactic stenchie?) and it's a name much older than Internet. ;)
Heh, true! And I'm sure creepy stuff gets written (I don't read horror, so I wouldn't know), and there's some tradition of it, e.g. Viy, which scared the hell out of me as a child, when my mother would read the stories aloud.
I had to click around a long time in Wiki categories before finding a name for the genre: literature of horror, but it sure doesn't seem to be used much in everyday conversation.
"smrodek dydaktyczny"
Heh! I understand it with Russian, actually, because -- and I feel like we might've talked about that already? -- "smrad" is used in Russian, too, as an archaic sort of word). Although I don't know that it would be used with a diminutive, I've definitely not heard that.
"I mean, technically it has no vampires in it, and technically it isn't exactly imperial either, more like time jumping everywhere, but trust me, it still makes better imperial vamps than 'Yekaterina's Fangs' ever got close to." "...You know, I kind of hoped for the bar set somewhat higher. Also, I almost managed to forget it, thanks a lot..." "Oh, come on, it's not like we can have everything on the 'White Nights' level, can we?"
"For the record, I'm really glad we finally got something, anything else that Yakut spooks again, but how do we call it now? Evenk spooks? It's just one book, it doesn't make a genre." "Have you seen how it's selling? Just wait a year... This said, it's still as much Yakut spooks as it gets, so why bother with new names, everyone will know what you mean." "So, what, are we going to say whenever something like this comes up 'It's Yakut spooks, but with no Yakut spooks'?" "Well, when you put it like this..."
"It's not taiga gothic, it's tundra gothic. There's only some
( ... )
It was also the first published piece that started the whole thing in 1986.
Him claiming the Law of Surprise as a joke in the show makes no sense at all, having just seen a demonstration of its power.
Ew, making a joke of it? And yes, I agree it's especially dumb after they just solved the problem the previous "joke" had made...
Heh, yeah, Nenneke and Calanthe are the strong women done right, as opposite to the StrongWomanTM cliche sprouting in every movie and book now...
But I can't believe the show chose to omit the "go fuck yourself" joke, which was hands down the best part abut the story. Probably because it makes Geralt look fallible (in a silly, not tragic way).And that's why it was there in the first place and why they should have kept it, grr. I don't even care much and it's still disappointing how the show apparently broke exactly the parts that were good and made the original stand out. (So, what the first wish ( ... )
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I'm atually not sure why they couldn't have just stuck with the book's way of doing it? The joke felt pretty out of character and was, as you say, just generally dumb.
Heh, yeah, Nenneke and Calanthe are the strong women done right,
Agreed, and I loved them both, unsurprisingly. (And thought the show did a pretty good job with Calanthe.)
So, what the first wish was in the show, then? No twist at all? Geralt means "Fuck off!" and he really says what he thinks he says?
It wasn't very memorable, so already has started to fade, but I think his first wish -- which he speaks when it looks like there is no djinn/the djinn is a dud, or if it exists, that Jaskier is its master, so it's also not meant as a wish -- is for Jaskier to shut up, which causes Jaskier's condition that they need to search for a healer for. Or at least that's what I think happens...
Wow, your translation is really good! :D I mean, I can't judge how it reads, ( ... )
Reply
The showrunner/whoever-(un)wrote-this felt the need to prove themselves for the payroll? :P
It wasn't very memorable, so already has started to fade
"... : the show's review". XD
is for Jaskier to shut up, which causes Jaskier's condition that they need to search for a healer for.
Hm, that's actually not so bad idea, aside of that there was no need to coming up with ideas in the first place, especially at the cost of existing ones... Also, this makes a need for coming up with a new reason to why the djinn ran away.
Probably even more so now after having watched the TV show, which definitely should be enjoyed on that level :)Fight & bath scenes + Jaskier being cute, as I hear, yeah. :D Come to think of it, while I think the books leave much to demand ( ... )
Reply
Maybe they cut it for time? (it kin of is an entire subplot, that needs to happen, and then Geralt needs to show off what he thinks he's doing, and then the punchline. On the other hand, the episode had a whole bunch of Ciri related things that could've gone elsewhere, so I dunno.
Also, this makes a need for coming up with a new reason to why the djinn ran away.It's actually not clear in the show that it did run away. It's not immediately malevolent, so it doesn't need to be banished -- before I read the story, I figure the wind and things associated with the djinn were just it doing its magic, not a threat in itself. And it's only shown to be destructive once Yennefer tries to trap it, which also kind of made sense. (But, yeah, the book way hangs together better/makes more coherent sense, as well as being FUNNIER ( ... )
Reply
I confess that I find the Russian/Slavic fantasy I've read to take itself a little TOO seriouslyHah, that's more like the high fantasy trait than "Slavic" fantasy - from the old fans POV. :D That's funny, actually, because when we look at it in context, the books origin was just this - it aimed at taking the fantasy (as Poles of 80/90s knew it) off its high horse. At that time and place it was fresh - Tolkien and ethereal Elves all around, suddenly there comes in a fantasy where beer and guts are spilled equally, and people talk (local!) Villagese instead of Elven. Of course, inspiration and popularity did their thing, so this approach was original maybe for a few months. Meanwhile, the western fantasy and creative writing in ( ... )
Reply
Hah, that's more like the high fantasy trait than "Slavic" fantasy -
No, I actually don't think the thing I'm talking about is a genre-specific thing. But maybe I shouldn't have used the term "Slavic fantasy" -- I don't mean it in the Witcher sense where it's specifically Slavic in flavor(/soul), just as a broader origin term, since I've noticed it in Russian fantasy I've read but it seems to me Sapkowski is similar ( ... )
Reply
This is how I understood it too, I didn't think/know "Slavic fantasy" as a genre is a thing, hmm...
And there was the guy who "continued" Tolkien's books by focusing on the Hobbits and the Orcs and making the humans all grubby mercenaries and ignoring the Elves, I think -- very well known in Russia for a time; I even read a few.Perumov? Haven't read him, though ( ... )
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That's the one :P Is he known in Poland, too? (I did read the first 2 books or so, because I wanted to see what it was like and also wanted more Middle-Earth, but I can't say he's a good author, or does much of anything original with it. I mean, it's fanfic, basically, but very self-important fanfic.
but in Poland "Slavic mythology" outside of the most academical circles is an uncommon idea My sense is, the same in Russia -- it's folktales and stuff, not Myth ( ... )
Reply
I think he might be more known ~20 years ago than now, though it always was a niche popularity, just among fantasy fans. I think in recent weeks I've seen someone mentioning him on some forum as an example of "retelling from bad guys POV". (Might or might not be a Polish forum, though. *scratches head* You know, one of those "can't remember what language I read it in" cases. o_______o)
Because I feel like sci-fi WAS seen as a legitimate genre in Russia (and I assume Poland, if Lem was as popular there as he was in the USSR?)I confirm, for the whole paragraph. On one hand sci-fi was "plaything", on the other side it was "still better than fantasy" and easier to associate with Big Themes. However, there also always was that shift of the perspective waiting behind the corner - sci-fi = plaything, but good sci-fi = actually mainstream, and then it usually was called "alegorical", "surrealistic", "grotesque" and such; anything but the genre name. Lem was maybe the only author regarded as a top tier writer while ( ... )
Reply
I concur for Russia, except that "fantastika" was a respected enough name in itself -- because it was assumed to stand for "allegory", "surrealism", etc.
On the other hand, there are works that I would map onto fantasy that definitely never got called that, like Master i Margarita (I mean, how is that not the same genre as Good Omens?) -- because there wasn't even a name for it. (I should've asked, actually, what is fantasy called in Polish? Because in Russian it's "фэнтези, so you can tell it's of very modern vintage ( ... )
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Exactly.
what is fantasy called in Polish?Mostly copied English with Polish mixed in. A typical bookstore or library has a section/bookcase/whole wall of "fantastyka" (so, speculative fiction in general), and within this there are recognized (more in discussions and reviews than physically on the shelf) those three main ones, with sub-subgenres ( ... )
Reply
I'm not sure about modern shelving, but to my mind, in Russian, "fantastika" would be just a shorter way of saying "nauchnaya fatastika" (the official way of saying it) and would not, I think, include fantasy. I think it is abbreviated as NF, but I might be making that up... And your subcategorization makes me realize I have no idea how to say "horror" in Russian as a genre, or whether it's even a thing...
I don't think I've heard the fantasy subgenres referred to in Russian at all...
or so unimportant in English that it got no popular English names is fantastyka bliskiego/dalekiego zasięgu (sci-fi of the short/long range
I actually have heard the English terms "far future SF" and "near future SF", but in my experience that's the kin of thing you find in blurbs and reviews, not as official subgenre categorization.
Btw, fandom as a word has been in use here for at least ~30-40 years, but back in the day it meant speculative fiction fans in general - people that read the genre, ( ... )
Reply
Huh, that's actually surprising. Russia has such horror potential it could be for horror what Scandinavia is for crime. It could easily grow own subgenres. Taiga gothic... :)
"far future SF" and "near future SF"
Ah, thanks! I was sure it must be a thing, just apparently too little discussed to find names easily.
(and dislike both manifestations of this thing, as you know.)
In Polish we call it "smrodek dydaktyczny" (didactic stenchie?) and it's a name much older than Internet. ;)
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Heh, true! And I'm sure creepy stuff gets written (I don't read horror, so I wouldn't know), and there's some tradition of it, e.g. Viy, which scared the hell out of me as a child, when my mother would read the stories aloud.
I had to click around a long time in Wiki categories before finding a name for the genre: literature of horror, but it sure doesn't seem to be used much in everyday conversation.
"smrodek dydaktyczny"
Heh! I understand it with Russian, actually, because -- and I feel like we might've talked about that already? -- "smrad" is used in Russian, too, as an archaic sort of word). Although I don't know that it would be used with a diminutive, I've definitely not heard that.
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"I mean, technically it has no vampires in it, and technically it isn't exactly imperial either, more like time jumping everywhere, but trust me, it still makes better imperial vamps than 'Yekaterina's Fangs' ever got close to."
"...You know, I kind of hoped for the bar set somewhat higher. Also, I almost managed to forget it, thanks a lot..."
"Oh, come on, it's not like we can have everything on the 'White Nights' level, can we?"
"For the record, I'm really glad we finally got something, anything else that Yakut spooks again, but how do we call it now? Evenk spooks? It's just one book, it doesn't make a genre."
"Have you seen how it's selling? Just wait a year... This said, it's still as much Yakut spooks as it gets, so why bother with new names, everyone will know what you mean."
"So, what, are we going to say whenever something like this comes up 'It's Yakut spooks, but with no Yakut spooks'?"
"Well, when you put it like this..."
"It's not taiga gothic, it's tundra gothic. There's only some ( ... )
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LOL! It's very meta-meta-meta but hugely amusing XD
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