Interesting proposal...
Read a post by @ishie about the dire lack of female characters in TBBT which, rightly, gave her an OMG RAGEFACE:
Have we ever actually seen a female character who has lines and a name who isn't just a walking shell around some ladyparts? Like, every woman the guys deal with (that I can think of at the moment) is either someone they want to sleep with, someone they are sleeping with, someone who wants to sleep with them, or someone who gave birth to one of them. And that seems pretty much it for the value they carry within the show's universe.
So true, so true! This was my response:
I am SO ready for a strong female presence in TBBT that isn't a feministfail, too! But I'm trying to think of shows I've watched where a guy and a girl were in a solid, committed friendship without having to deal with sexual tension. The problem with not having the sexual tension is that good stories depend on conflict to generate interest. Sexual tension is an easy, universal, if lazy, source of conflict.
So far, off the top of my head, I thought of:
HIMYM: Ted/Lily. They've been friends since college, but almost since their first meeting, Lily was off the market b/c of her immediate hook up with Marshall. Still, throughout the development of the show, they have had their own relationship, apart from Marshall. One moment I clearly remember is when he finally expressed to her how hurt he was when she broke up with Marshall right before the wedding and ran away to San Francisco. He said that she didn't just break up with Marshall, but she broke up with Ted too, and she needed to make it right not only with Marshall, but with him. That really deepened the relationship for me.
Veronica Mars: Veronica/Wallace. She, the underdog, gives the new guy at school a chance, and a strong partnership emerges. They see each other through some good times and a lot of bad times. She was totally a BAMF on the outside, but he saw through to the marshmallowy center of goodness in her. They were never into each other, as far as I remember. No sexual tension, but it wasn't an asexual relationship either. They saw each other go on dates, commented on each other's attractiveness, and were still best friends in a non-Xander-crushing-on-Buffy way.
Though I know the on-again-off-again, will-they-won't-they tension creates conflict, and stories need conflict to move and grow. But can we have conflict between females and males that doesn't have to have a cheap, sexually superficial taint? Can sexually available females be strong and worthy of male partnership, without having to be sexual partners?
Part of me is wondering, is this even a good question to be asking? The deepest of friendships requires the giving of yourself: your love, trust, passions, pains. Can women and men share that without wanting to take it to a sexual level? Because if it doesn't happen IRL, then why should we expect to see it in our stories?
I used to really believe that the answer to this question was Yes. Men and women can get over their hormones and be partners without the sexual tension. But I'm beginning to wonder if it's only possible when it is clear that at least one part of the party must be somehow sexually unavailable. For example, Ted/Lily can have a relationship without the sexual tension because Lily is and will always be sexually unavailable because of Ted's relationship with Marshall. In contrast, Lily/Barney have a relationship, but she's always been fascinated with his sexual freedom (and ability to be kinky), but she's unavailable because of her relationship with Marshall and her semi-disgust at his sluttiness. I don't get the feeling that Barney would be sexually unavailable to Lily. IMO, I don't think Barney/Marshall is strong enough of a relationship to make Lily unavailable in Barney's eyes.
Until the culture around us realizes that sexual love is not the highest apex of love, then no, I don't think we're going to stop evaluating the mate-worthiness of the people around us, and so, sexual tension will continue to shape and define our relationships. BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THERE CAN'T BE DEPICTIONS OF FEMALES IN OUR CULTURE'S STORIES THAT AREN'T FEMINIST FAILS. So come on, TBBT! I'm rooting for you!
Have we ever actually seen a female character who has lines and a name who isn't just a walking shell around some ladyparts? Like, every woman the guys deal with (that I can think of at the moment) is either someone they want to sleep with, someone they are sleeping with, someone who wants to sleep with them, or someone who gave birth to one of them. And that seems pretty much it for the value they carry within the show's universe.
So true, so true! This was my response:
I am SO ready for a strong female presence in TBBT that isn't a feministfail, too! But I'm trying to think of shows I've watched where a guy and a girl were in a solid, committed friendship without having to deal with sexual tension. The problem with not having the sexual tension is that good stories depend on conflict to generate interest. Sexual tension is an easy, universal, if lazy, source of conflict.
So far, off the top of my head, I thought of:
HIMYM: Ted/Lily. They've been friends since college, but almost since their first meeting, Lily was off the market b/c of her immediate hook up with Marshall. Still, throughout the development of the show, they have had their own relationship, apart from Marshall. One moment I clearly remember is when he finally expressed to her how hurt he was when she broke up with Marshall right before the wedding and ran away to San Francisco. He said that she didn't just break up with Marshall, but she broke up with Ted too, and she needed to make it right not only with Marshall, but with him. That really deepened the relationship for me.
Veronica Mars: Veronica/Wallace. She, the underdog, gives the new guy at school a chance, and a strong partnership emerges. They see each other through some good times and a lot of bad times. She was totally a BAMF on the outside, but he saw through to the marshmallowy center of goodness in her. They were never into each other, as far as I remember. No sexual tension, but it wasn't an asexual relationship either. They saw each other go on dates, commented on each other's attractiveness, and were still best friends in a non-Xander-crushing-on-Buffy way.
Though I know the on-again-off-again, will-they-won't-they tension creates conflict, and stories need conflict to move and grow. But can we have conflict between females and males that doesn't have to have a cheap, sexually superficial taint? Can sexually available females be strong and worthy of male partnership, without having to be sexual partners?
Part of me is wondering, is this even a good question to be asking? The deepest of friendships requires the giving of yourself: your love, trust, passions, pains. Can women and men share that without wanting to take it to a sexual level? Because if it doesn't happen IRL, then why should we expect to see it in our stories?
I used to really believe that the answer to this question was Yes. Men and women can get over their hormones and be partners without the sexual tension. But I'm beginning to wonder if it's only possible when it is clear that at least one part of the party must be somehow sexually unavailable. For example, Ted/Lily can have a relationship without the sexual tension because Lily is and will always be sexually unavailable because of Ted's relationship with Marshall. In contrast, Lily/Barney have a relationship, but she's always been fascinated with his sexual freedom (and ability to be kinky), but she's unavailable because of her relationship with Marshall and her semi-disgust at his sluttiness. I don't get the feeling that Barney would be sexually unavailable to Lily. IMO, I don't think Barney/Marshall is strong enough of a relationship to make Lily unavailable in Barney's eyes.
Until the culture around us realizes that sexual love is not the highest apex of love, then no, I don't think we're going to stop evaluating the mate-worthiness of the people around us, and so, sexual tension will continue to shape and define our relationships. BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN THERE CAN'T BE DEPICTIONS OF FEMALES IN OUR CULTURE'S STORIES THAT AREN'T FEMINIST FAILS. So come on, TBBT! I'm rooting for you!