Perfect Slytherinjana_chOctober 29 2014, 02:04:28 UTC
Albus is such a perfect Slytherin that, if he indeed was a Gryffindor, he had to have been Sorted there at his own insistence. A cunning, ambitious Slytherin can get away with a lot if he’s publicly identified as a brave, bold Gryffindor. My story “Sal’s Hat” has been halted for a considerable time because I haven’t been able to write eleven-year-old Albus’s conversation with Salazar’s yarmulke when it, unlike Godric’s hat, refuses to accede to his request
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Re: Ravenclaw Manqueterri_testingOctober 29 2014, 03:38:32 UTC
As to Albus's sorting... it's totally obvious he should have accepted the Hat (or yarmulke's) recommendation and gone to his heart's home--well, his head's home--of Ravenclaw. He'd have done absolutely no harm to anyone continuing on getting more and mroe academic awards
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Re: Ravenclaw Manquejana_chOctober 29 2014, 20:09:23 UTC
Ravenclaw Albus?
Nooo, nasty evil Albus can’t belong to MY House! We’re all rational and abstracted and harmless. It’s true we never actually accomplish much, but we have such fun analyzing things. And we never mean it personally! Really, anyone who gets offended doesn’t have the proper perspective.
What's the difference between being pompous and being pedantic? If you're pompous, you want to be recognized as right, like a Gryffindor. If you're pedantic, you want to get the information right, like a Ravenclaw. If you're wrong and someone corrects you, you must grit your teeth and thank him politely, because it means you'll never make the same mistake again. No one likes being shown to be wrong, but Ravenclaw has its own rules.
You're right, of course, that us 'Claws make terrible Slytherins. When I was young I liked to imagine that I would be a Slytherin when I grew up, but I really don't have what it takes.
Re: Ravenclaw Manqueoryx_leucoryxOctober 30 2014, 03:02:11 UTC
But what would he have turned out like as a Ravenclaw? He wouldn't have developed that manipulative side so much, would have concentrated on abstract things, actually achieved understanding of the depths of magical theory, instead of just enough to form the basis for not-so-well thought out plans. Overall, caused less damage.
Re: Ravenclaw Manqueterri_testingOctober 30 2014, 06:51:18 UTC
Heh! You-all have inspired me to go back and re-read the great Albus-is-a-closeted-and-denying Slytherin easay (Swythyv), and hir correspondant Jodel's Dumbledore-is-really-a-Ravenclaw one.
But really, Dumbledore as a Gryffindork??! Seriously, Jana, when do we see his fault as being going off half-cocked? If he did succeed in conning the hat into placing him into that house, ON HERMIONE'S GROUNDS THAT AMBITION COULD BEST BE SATISFIED BY THAT PLACEMENT, he totally disgraced himself with his housemates, waiting for some conspicuous act of un-self-serving action to redeem is tendencies to brood, plot, and issue explanations of why he hadn't acted in a crisis....
The only placement for which Albus would have been worse-adapted than Gryffindork is Hufflepuff. Catch him cooperating as one among equals!
Re: Ravenclaw Manquejana_chOctober 30 2014, 07:54:21 UTC
I totally agree that Gryffindor is not an appropriate House for Dumbledore. If he in fact *was* a Gryffindor (which is not proven just because Hermione "heard" he was), he could only have gotten there by requesting it specifically and having the Hat accede. My premise in "Sal's Hat" is that, while Godric's hat takes requests, Salazar's yarmulke does not unless it's a choice between two Houses that are equally appropriate--such as Hermione in any House but Hufflepuff (she's loyal enough, but she doesn't make friends), or Severus in any House at all
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Re: Ravenclaw Manqueterri_testingOctober 30 2014, 14:14:19 UTC
Avoiding unwanted pregnancies and land wars in Asia--snerk! As you say, there's a time for that philosophy. But Albus clearly takes satisfaction in understanding things better than anyone else, and he feels no especial interest in acting on his understanding...
What a hardship--having to reread children's lit. But bear in mind you can go pre-Victorian too--at least half of Albus's family is Pureblood, so his voice will be influenced by that.
(But that photograph seemed all Victorian/Edwardian, so maybe Kendra's Muggle background counted for more....)
Re: Ravenclaw Manqueioanna_ioanninaOctober 30 2014, 16:27:19 UTC
I can believe Albus tricked the Hat to put him in Gryffindor (where he did not belong) and that Albus there learned how to use Gryffindors for his purposes and to look down at everybody less litterate than himself. (I don't see Dumbledore as a great master of logic and consequences.) And from there can originate his praise for those (ambiguous) who "did it too" - who tricked the Hat like Albus and managed Gryffindor, even if their right house would be something else.
Gryffindor Albus.nx74defiantNovember 2 2014, 21:26:59 UTC
If he was in Gryffindor young Albus would have been as unpopular as Hermione.
But young Albus had more self-confidence than Hermione. He wouldn't have been crying in the bathroom. So instead he looks down on everyone else and learns to use them.
Re: Ravenclaw Manqueoryx_leucoryxOctober 30 2014, 19:45:19 UTC
BTW I don't think Salazar would call his head-covering a yarmulke. That's Yiddish, from Polish or Ukranian origins (maybe going back to Turkish). Though I have no idea what term a Spanish Jew would have used.
Sal's Languagejana_chOctober 31 2014, 03:45:44 UTC
That’s what I thought myself, and in the story I use the word ‘kippa.’ But duj, my fandom expert on matters Jewish, told me that kippa is modern Hebrew. ‘Yarmulka’ is Turkic or Aramaic and pre-dates Salazar’s time; it is not necessarily exclusive to the Ashkenazim. If the Sephardim had a word that was entirely their own, it is long lost, but ‘yarmulka’ is apparently the closent to an ‘authentic’ word we have.
If you have more solid information I’d be glad to learn it.
Re: Sal's Languageoryx_leucoryxOctober 31 2014, 18:16:52 UTC
Well, Livejournal won't let me link, but if you google yarmulka etymology, the first few pages should include a link to a 4-page article by Daniel D. Stuhlman from 2008. He traces the origins first to Latin amulcia and the diminutive form armulcella, becoming German almutz and aremutz, apparently as a head covering of a priest. From there one gets the Slavic forms. The Turkish yağmurluk meant 'rain-hat'. Jarmulca as a specific Jewish head covering can so far only be seen from the late 19th century
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Re: Perfect Slytherinoryx_leucoryxOctober 31 2014, 13:59:26 UTC
As Terri says, no he is not a perfect Slytherin, but he has some appreciation of Slytherin methods. He does have a bit of 'don't just do something, stand there' to his typical action plan.
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Nooo, nasty evil Albus can’t belong to MY House! We’re all rational and abstracted and harmless. It’s true we never actually accomplish much, but we have such fun analyzing things. And we never mean it personally! Really, anyone who gets offended doesn’t have the proper perspective.
What's the difference between being pompous and being pedantic? If you're pompous, you want to be recognized as right, like a Gryffindor. If you're pedantic, you want to get the information right, like a Ravenclaw. If you're wrong and someone corrects you, you must grit your teeth and thank him politely, because it means you'll never make the same mistake again. No one likes being shown to be wrong, but Ravenclaw has its own rules.
You're right, of course, that us 'Claws make terrible Slytherins. When I was young I liked to imagine that I would be a Slytherin when I grew up, but I really don't have what it takes.
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But really, Dumbledore as a Gryffindork??! Seriously, Jana, when do we see his fault as being going off half-cocked? If he did succeed in conning the hat into placing him into that house, ON HERMIONE'S GROUNDS THAT AMBITION COULD BEST BE SATISFIED BY THAT PLACEMENT, he totally disgraced himself with his housemates, waiting for some conspicuous act of un-self-serving action to redeem is tendencies to brood, plot, and issue explanations of why he hadn't acted in a crisis....
The only placement for which Albus would have been worse-adapted than Gryffindork is Hufflepuff. Catch him cooperating as one among equals!
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What a hardship--having to reread children's lit. But bear in mind you can go pre-Victorian too--at least half of Albus's family is Pureblood, so his voice will be influenced by that.
(But that photograph seemed all Victorian/Edwardian, so maybe Kendra's Muggle background counted for more....)
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But young Albus had more self-confidence than Hermione. He wouldn't have been crying in the bathroom. So instead he looks down on everyone else and learns to use them.
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If you have more solid information I’d be glad to learn it.
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