I really loved a lot of the lines, and squeed and laughed and was moved by the love story.
But Christmas Chrismased in my Christmas, do you Christmas my Christmas? ALSO CHRISTMAS. Christmas.
Christmas.
As an atheist who doesn't celebrate, I felt the whole message of CHRISTMAS IS FOR EVERYONE, EVEN PEOPLE ON OTHER PLANETS SING ABOUT JEEEEEEESUS, ANYONE WHO DOESN'T IS A BAD BAD HORRIBLE PERSON AND NEEDS TO BE ~SHOWN THE LIGHT~ to be really hurtful and intolerant. I love this show, and I loved parts of this episode, so that really got to me, personally. It's like getting slapped in the face by someone you love and trust.
I GUESS I WILL GO SLAUGHTER SOME ORPHANS BECAUSE I AM A GODLESS INFIDEL AND IT'S CHRISTMAS. SEE YOU ALL LATER.
I never quite thought of it that way, as I usually see DW as a humanistic viewpoint for the most part, but they did overplay the "I'm the Savior of the world"type of Doctor bit.
And where did Nine's 'partial claim' to Father Christmas. Sluffed off on someone named Jeff.
See an episode once, and I like it fine. Overanalyze, and I find it lacking...
Well, I kind of can't help but see it that way. I'm actually quite upset because strangers on the street keep wishing me a happy Christmas, and that is NOT OKAY YOU GUYS. They don't know me! They have no idea if I'm part of a religion that forbids me from celebrating Christmas! For all they know I have PTSD and it's a trigger for me! (This is actually quite common for people who undergo traumas around Christmas, which is likelier than you think.) Or, you know, the actual truth, which is just as valid, which is that I'm an atheist and I'm sick to death of their stupid holiday, and I don't care if they do it, I JUST WANT OUT
( ... )
I don't celebrate "the holiday." I don't celebrate Solstice, Yule, Festivus, Saturnalia, Kwanzaa, Hanukkah, or Christmas. I don't care how much they secularize it, I don't want it. Part of the reason I really hate the "The holidays are for everyone!" mentality is because it forces it on everyone, like it or not. Believe me, if I want it, I'll opt in.
It's like people can understand "different Christmas," but they can't understand "no Christmas." No Christmas. Really. Really really. I don't give gifts, and I don't accept them. I've had to tell people I would throw their gifts in the garbage to deter them. (I wouldn't really, it's just that I had to say something extreme, because otherwise people trample my wishes.) I help the needy when I can, and that's year-round. Most of the time I am the needy, and that experience has taught me that need doesn't show up in early December and get magicked away for a year because of Christmas. When I was homeless in December of '05, I was still homeless in January of '06. Helping
( ... )
If people can understand "different Christmas" they should be able to understand "no Christmas"...however it's probably like people are about those who are different in the first place.
I won't go into illusions cause my brain came up with some horrid ones that didn't sound ANYthing like the point. :( I'll just admit it's awkward for my personal EXACT understanding for really weird reasons... There are also those that are REALLY religious that won't celebrate Christmas AT ALL because they say it's pagan, etc - but wishing someone a merry Christmas and forcing their religion at their kids and everyone else is perfectly fine in their tiny human brains. D:<
Ugh. I know that doesn't help ):
And yeah, the Doctor never seems to have cared this much about ~Christmas spirit~ before.By Gallifrey, that's a nice point. So used to all the "holiday" stuff that Doctor Who is USUALLY a refreshing break to a degree. And plus - he takes his companions along for their own human tradition - kinda for their happiness, cause that seems to
( ... )
Well, if you have any questions, I can do my best to answer.
And yeah, I mean, I can get the Doctor being like, "Look at all the humans doing their thing, they're so passionate about it, I love that!" Like, he's happy we're happy. But I didn't get the idea before that he made value judgments about celebrating/not celebrating. Surely, in the whole of time and space, he's seen that Christmas is not universal. He's been to so many different cultures, human and alien. Christmas is just a cultural celebration. It is not a defining trait of humanity, or sentience.
I've actually been okay with all of RTD's specials. The End of Time is actually like, probably my favorite Doctor Who story ever, but anyway. The Christmas Invasion and The Runaway Bride were both fantastic, fun stories, that just sort of happened to take place while Christmas was going on. Voyage of the Damned was the iffiest, but it totally redeemed itself with, "Information: you are all going to die." XDDD I love that he made Christmas elements menacing instead of sappy. I've
( ... )
It seemed Moff tried to justify it that "it was Christmas-that-used-to-be-Christmas-on-Earth-but-they-still-call-it-Christmas..." sort of thing... c'mon Moff, leave being cryptic like that to Sherlock...
I did find RTD's plots a bit flawed -- I think an American superhero movie says it best: all build-up and no bang? But that's my personal opinion... ;/
From what I've seen of the Classic Serials, I found the plots far more nicely rounded...
They didn't need the "Christmas is cancelled" line. It's been done before.
Basically, I pretty much agree - it was better to have a menacing Christmas than have Christmas EVERYWHERE>>>>
But Christmas Chrismased in my Christmas, do you Christmas my Christmas? ALSO CHRISTMAS. Christmas.
Christmas.
As an atheist who doesn't celebrate, I felt the whole message of CHRISTMAS IS FOR EVERYONE, EVEN PEOPLE ON OTHER PLANETS SING ABOUT JEEEEEEESUS, ANYONE WHO DOESN'T IS A BAD BAD HORRIBLE PERSON AND NEEDS TO BE ~SHOWN THE LIGHT~ to be really hurtful and intolerant. I love this show, and I loved parts of this episode, so that really got to me, personally. It's like getting slapped in the face by someone you love and trust.
I GUESS I WILL GO SLAUGHTER SOME ORPHANS BECAUSE I AM A GODLESS INFIDEL AND IT'S CHRISTMAS. SEE YOU ALL LATER.
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And where did Nine's 'partial claim' to Father Christmas. Sluffed off on someone named Jeff.
See an episode once, and I like it fine.
Overanalyze, and I find it lacking...
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I don't celebrate "the holiday." I don't celebrate Solstice, Yule, Festivus, Saturnalia, Kwanzaa, Hanukkah, or Christmas. I don't care how much they secularize it, I don't want it. Part of the reason I really hate the "The holidays are for everyone!" mentality is because it forces it on everyone, like it or not. Believe me, if I want it, I'll opt in.
It's like people can understand "different Christmas," but they can't understand "no Christmas." No Christmas. Really. Really really. I don't give gifts, and I don't accept them. I've had to tell people I would throw their gifts in the garbage to deter them. (I wouldn't really, it's just that I had to say something extreme, because otherwise people trample my wishes.) I help the needy when I can, and that's year-round. Most of the time I am the needy, and that experience has taught me that need doesn't show up in early December and get magicked away for a year because of Christmas. When I was homeless in December of '05, I was still homeless in January of '06. Helping ( ... )
Reply
If people can understand "different Christmas" they should be able to understand "no Christmas"...however it's probably like people are about those who are different in the first place.
I won't go into illusions cause my brain came up with some horrid ones that didn't sound ANYthing like the point. :( I'll just admit it's awkward for my personal EXACT understanding for really weird reasons... There are also those that are REALLY religious that won't celebrate Christmas AT ALL because they say it's pagan, etc - but wishing someone a merry Christmas and forcing their religion at their kids and everyone else is perfectly fine in their tiny human brains. D:<
Ugh. I know that doesn't help ):
And yeah, the Doctor never seems to have cared this much about ~Christmas spirit~ before.By Gallifrey, that's a nice point. So used to all the "holiday" stuff that Doctor Who is USUALLY a refreshing break to a degree. And plus - he takes his companions along for their own human tradition - kinda for their happiness, cause that seems to ( ... )
Reply
And yeah, I mean, I can get the Doctor being like, "Look at all the humans doing their thing, they're so passionate about it, I love that!" Like, he's happy we're happy. But I didn't get the idea before that he made value judgments about celebrating/not celebrating. Surely, in the whole of time and space, he's seen that Christmas is not universal. He's been to so many different cultures, human and alien. Christmas is just a cultural celebration. It is not a defining trait of humanity, or sentience.
I've actually been okay with all of RTD's specials. The End of Time is actually like, probably my favorite Doctor Who story ever, but anyway. The Christmas Invasion and The Runaway Bride were both fantastic, fun stories, that just sort of happened to take place while Christmas was going on. Voyage of the Damned was the iffiest, but it totally redeemed itself with, "Information: you are all going to die." XDDD I love that he made Christmas elements menacing instead of sappy. I've ( ... )
Reply
I did find RTD's plots a bit flawed -- I think an American superhero movie says it best: all build-up and no bang? But that's my personal opinion... ;/
From what I've seen of the Classic Serials, I found the plots far more nicely rounded...
They didn't need the "Christmas is cancelled" line. It's been done before.
Basically, I pretty much agree - it was better to have a menacing Christmas than have Christmas EVERYWHERE>>>>
Reply
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