Flappy Gum Syndrome and Diarrhea of the Fingers

[bowtrunckle]

A meta by karenmiller got me thinking about Dean and Sam and the overturning of their belief systems since S2 ("HotH") and how that would affect their actions at the end of S4.  I started typing my response only to find I wrote way too much to politely post as a comment (oops), so I'm posting my thoughts here because nobody cares if I pollute my own journal

Comments

[yourlibrarian]

elevating John and Mary to near saint status. But over the course of 2 seasons the reality of who John was (human)...has slowly stripped Dean of his own brand of faith.

I imagine he lost some in his memory of Mary, too. He thought she was great, but the last image we know he had of her, was her making a deal with a demon. He discovered what Sam had known for more than a year, that Mary knew the YED, and hid the truth from them.

And yeah, it's a good point about how both have been losing their faith this season, including in one another.

[bowtrunckle]

Very true. I imagine that was an eye opener to say the least. Talk about keeping secrets; it seems like we know who Sam got is tight lip from. ;)

Have you had time to watch the "ItB" commentary with Kripke and Carver yet? Apparently, one of the many reasons why they couldn't have Azazel be too specific about his side of the the deal with Mary was because they didn't want to vilify her by having her sacrifice one of her unborn children for John. So they opted with a vague notion that Azazel just needed permission to enter her house and that if he was interrupted nobody would get hurt. So it's good to know that the writers are trying to preserve the memory of Mary somewhat.

[yourlibrarian]

They did a commentary for the episode? Where is it available? (Is this one that will be on the DVD?)

Yeah, I suspected they had done that at the time. Of course, we, the viewers already knew what he was up to. I think Mary might still have made the deal, but I don't think she would have been so unprepared for his arrival.

In fact, that would be a really interesting AU story -- of Mary turning into Sam as she knows all along a day is approaching but tries to keep it from John, while still hunting down the YED>

[bowtrunckle]

Where is it available?

They're on YouTube! Growyourwings posted all the embeds at her journal here:

http://growyourwings.livejournal.com/286081.html

I'm not certain, but my guess is that it'll be included as one of the DVD extras. I hope so at least.

that would be a really interesting AU story...

It would be (plus, I sort of miss Azazel). I have a fondness for well-written AU fic, esp. ones that take canon facts and reinvent stories around them that change the perspective of events/characters without contradicting canon facts/events/characterization. Not an easy task, but very cool when it happens. The summer hiatus is a good time for me to read fic, something I don't do much of otherwise.

[llywela13]

Sorry for butting in, and not even to participate in the discussion, just wanted to say that yes, the ITB commentary is on the DVDs. I got my Part 1 DVDs last week and have been indulging in DVD Show Squee ever since. :)

[bowtrunckle]

Thanks for confirming! :)

And...

?!?!?! There are "Part 1 DVDs" out?! O.O Which insinuates there are other "Part II DVDs" or more on their way. Is this a UK specialty or some super secret, underground piracy ring or have I missed some major announcements during my hiatus/hibernation time?

[llywela13]

LOL it's a UK thing - happens every season, for most US shows. The season gets divided in half. We get Part One (eps 1-11) now - mine arrived last week - and Part Two around about September, much the same time that the region 1 set comes out. So I have been happily indulging in the shininess of DVD quality, logo-less episodes 1-11 this last week. :)

[bowtrunckle]

Lucky you! It would be nice if the US adopted that release schedule. It would make the summer hiatus not seem as long. So just out of curiosity, it would seem like at least some of the special features that are associated with 4x01-4x11 are also included on the UK-releases (thus the commentary on "ItB") ... are deleted scences also included?

[llywela13]

Yes, the commentary to ItB and deleted scenes for various episodes - I forget which off the top of my head.

Our season one release had no extras at all, but they've got better since then!