Comments | tinman_meta: Because, apparently, there can't be too much ranting about writing

blade_girl in tinman_meta

Because, apparently, there can't be too much ranting about writing

Feb 27, 2008 07:21

Let me begin by acknowledging that the membership of this community may well be the wrong people to be ranting at on this issue. It's likely that those of you who joined or watch this comm have a full command of the language (in this case, English) and are cognizant of the proper and effective way to express your ideas in prose.

( Cut, but not sanitized, for your flist's protection )

style, nitpicky, fandom customs that need to die, discussion prompt, rant

Comments 168

blackletter February 27 2008, 15:02:51 UTC

I have a sudden urge to bestow upon myself the title "Lord High Defender of the Semi-Colon".

I have other thoughts of the possible more useful sort but I've got to run to campus for now.

In the meantime, I leave this tale of adventure through the jungle of bad writing.

blade_girl February 27 2008, 15:22:11 UTC

I think very highly of semi-colons. Some of my best friends are such.

And that link is just too good. :D

verilyverity February 27 2008, 15:22:33 UTC

I shall be "shieldmaiden of the pronoun."

blade_girl February 27 2008, 15:27:10 UTC

Then I shall proclaim myself "field executioner of the unbetaed story."

Thread 20

erinm_4600 February 27 2008, 15:17:55 UTC

o.o

*passes plate of cookies over*

Well-said. And I am guilty of -not- speaking up to writers on this issue. *hangs head in shame*

blade_girl February 27 2008, 15:26:12 UTC

Yum!

*takes cookie*

Don't beat yourself up for not leaving concrit. Most of us are guilty of that, and that's generally because a culture of anti-crit has grown up around responding to fanfic. I would say the vast majority of all posters of fanfiction expect positive comments exclusively and tend to react badly to negative ones, even if they are tactful. Once they've been flamed a few times or seen it happen to others, it's hard to blame folks for giving up on leaving critical responses.

erinm_4600 February 27 2008, 15:35:55 UTC

There's a set, in particular, that kills me - because the story IS good... but the Punctuation Nazi in me can barely sit through it...

Never been one with words and knowing how to broach (sp?) the subject.

:\

*takes cookie, too*

blade_girl February 27 2008, 15:38:47 UTC

Well, in the case of a story that has real merit, maybe you should consider contacting the author privately and tell her how you feel - the good and the bad. You could offer to be her punctuation and/or grammar beta.

Sometimes people react badly to public criticism because of the embarrassment factor, but are more receptive in private communications.

Thread 5

verilyverity February 27 2008, 15:25:06 UTC

Ready my sword pen. I smell a crusade.

blade_girl February 27 2008, 15:28:17 UTC

Yes! The time is ripe!

verilyverity February 27 2008, 15:30:23 UTC

Into the breach! *brandishes bright red pen*

I did one last night. Now you. :P

blade_girl February 27 2008, 15:32:44 UTC

Well, my purpose in posting this was to find out if it's possible to build a consensus first. It would be better if this appeared to be a larger movement among like-minded members of the fandom rather than a couple of people in a bitchy mood, you know? ;)

Thread 43

amedia February 27 2008, 15:38:11 UTC

Tin Man is a fresh new fandom. We're all in on the ground floor here, and we have an opportunity to set some expectations for minimum writing quality. We could do it, we really could; the fandom is young enough and still small enough that we could create a large core of writers who adhere to a philosophy which required certain standards to be met. And we could instill that philosophy throughout the fandom by approaching fanfic cordially but critically.
I like this idea. It's hopeful, and it's plausible. :-) I've actually been pleasantly surprised by the overall quality of fic in this fandom compared to others, and the fact that people don't bite your head off when you point out a typo ( ... )

blade_girl February 27 2008, 15:47:55 UTC

That's a very good point about the two types of writers. I wonder if there is any realistic way to bridge that gap, given the radically different values and goals.

amedia February 27 2008, 15:54:53 UTC

I like some of the suggestions above, like writing to the author privately, offering to beta, and so on. [cue Margaret Hamilton voice: "These things must be done delicatelyAnd I wouldn't be surprised if Tin Man turned out to be a fandom in which the gap wasn't as wide as it is some other places. I think I've offered typo corrections twice now without being flamed, which sounds pitiful but in my experience it's HUGE ( ... )

blade_girl February 27 2008, 15:59:12 UTC

Thanks for your input so far! We'll still be here when you get back!

Thread 13

luchia13 February 27 2008, 17:03:30 UTC

I happen to be one of those obnoxious people who posts without betas. I kind of hate myself for it too, rest assured, but considering just about everything I write is on request and usually my first two commenters point out any typos and grammar mess-ups for me (they're wonderful ♥) anyway, it works for me. It's not out of disrespect for the reader or laziness in general - I kind of think it's obvious when someone's just lazy or doesn't quite know what they're doing - it's out of simple impatience and, well, predominately the fact I'm kind of a protective bitch when it comes to my writing and don't want anyone reading it until I'm ready to let them...I don't really know what point this has, actually, aside from saying that sometimes the people who have typos and don't have the time to get them beta'd have typos and such because, if they're like me, they're too busy writing papers on Tolstoy and Abu Simbel while writing porn at the same time. (It's funny when I get the "were you typing one-handed" comment because yes, actually, I ( ... )

blade_girl February 27 2008, 17:34:26 UTC

Ah, it's always a danger to generalize, isn't it ( ... )

luchia13 February 27 2008, 17:41:59 UTC

Ahhh, no problem. I figured as much, but felt like I should defend at least the few of us who do it just because of a lack of time and having vicious, sadistic bastards for professors.

Also, something that really concerns me is the read-through betas that aren't...um. Okay, no polite way to phrase this, that are REALLY BAD BETAS. But plot betas are just the most fantasmagorical thing EVER TO WALK THE INTERNET. It takes someone you can trust, but man, when you find some good ones, you're in heaven.

Ahhhhhhhh, gotcha. But lacking originality always makes me so, so sad. I mean, sure, I turn people into ninjas for the hell of it, but when a fic seriously makes you think about things...oh boy do I love that.

amedia February 27 2008, 18:14:40 UTC

*makes mental note to read your ninja fic, because, dude, well-researched ninjas!*

Actually I wanted to bring up a minor disagreement about the beta-ing advice too.

enlist the advice of a beta. If possible, choose someone who writes better than you.

I usually do have my stories beta'd and I have an awesome beta who is very perceptive about character, painfully good at spotting plot holes, and if possible a bigger grammar nazi than I am,* with, furthermore, a sense of style in addition to correctness. (Who would probably be banging his head against a wall over that sentence.) And who doesn't write fic at all.

So I wouldn't say that a beta necessarily has to be a writer. If I didn't already have a beta, though, and if I were looking for a beta in a new fandom, I might very well ask someone whose writing I admire, but I might be even more likely to go to that person and ask who her beta is and whether the beta has time for a new client.

*I would mention that this person is also a former freshman composition teacher, but after ( ... )

Thread 16