we're all mad here.

[pocochina]

The dynamics between Elena and the Salvatores were set up perfectly, as well. When you abuse someone’s trust, you can’t be the person to interfere for their own good, even when they clearly need someone to, and that’s what happened with Stefan here. Stefan can’t even face her when he backhandedly asks if she even wants the cure, because he knows

Comments

[circelily]

The dynamics between Elena and the Salvatores were set up perfectly, as well. When you abuse someone’s trust, you can’t be the person to interfere for their own good, even when they clearly need someone to, and that’s what happened with Stefan here. Stefan can’t even face her when he backhandedly asks if she even wants the cure, because he knows she doesn’t, at least, not entirely.

Love this insight. Intimacy is enabled by trust, and grows and wanes at the same pace.

Also love your thoughts on where the Bonnie story is going. I'm really worried for her, but also glad she's got a storyline and road to follow.

And I have to give credit where credit is due. The writers have clearly listened and responded to some of the salient fan criticism, and I really think both the narrative and character work is improving as a result.

[pocochina]

I think we're leading up to a pretty deep rift in the Mystic Falls crew. Jeremy is psychologically/metaphysically/whatever incentivized to kill vampires, and if he does find out about the cure, then he's in for the mindfuck of "kill every other vampire I can find, so I can Save Elena." Same with Bonnie, who's had serious misgivings about the vampires from the start and is now being played by Shane into giving herself up to make more/stronger hunters. And now Tyler feels alienated from the group as well.

The writers have clearly listened and responded to some of the salient fan criticism, and I really think both the narrative and character work is improving as a result.

Very much agreed. I'd like the end result anyway, they're doing a great job this season, but on top of that I really respect the effort and intentions I'm perceiving there.

[pocochina]

What struck me about Chris's death was that it laid bare how ridiculous the "reasoning" was behind the audience being OK with what was done to characters like Luka, Mason, even that guard that Stefan killed so Elena could turn in 4x01.

Yes. And just in time for the dilemma about Jeremy's tattoo, too. They're going to come up against it, sooner rather than later, that if they're going to save Elena from being a vampire, then he is going to have to hunt down every other vampire he can find and murder them. And I really love that we're not getting the luxury of the moral high ground about that.

[circelily]

"Moral high ground" Hee. TVD doesn't even have a moral compass. But I'm choosing to believe that we are getting the show is showing signs of engaging with its inherent conflict of trying to have vampire and human protagonists at the same time.

[pocochina]

Yeah, agreed. I liked that Damon name-dropped Origin of Species in this episode, because I think that's what this story is. It's not good vs evil, it's life in the state of nature.

[superkappa]

I was pointed this way by 12_12_12 and I'm so glad because your Tyler thoughts are pretty much my favorite thing in life right now. It was downright chilling to see him sink so low after such a long time but after everything, I get why he did. He was like me. He was part of my pack the way Tyler just owned that identity and what it means to him and everything complicated that comes from it. Just. Ow.

[pocochina]

It was downright chilling to see him sink so low after such a long time but after everything, I get why he did.

Yes. I loved this moment because it reminded us of Tyler's journey this far and what's at stake for him and the people around him. On the one hand, it's amazing that this was a startling moment from him, thinking about what he was just a year ago; on the other hand, it reminds us that he has that violence in him and going one step down that path will lead to terrible places much more quickly with him because of his life experiences. I admire Tyler so much for trying to be better than that, but this was such a sudden, brutal reminder that - he's trying, but he might not make it.

And then I wonder how *I* would react to someone who was that blithely oblivious to my objections to being used to help murder my friend, and it gets hard for me to throw stones, honestly.

[superkappa]

Exactly. He has that his history in him, and he always will. Like I've heard people say that scene was framed to seem abusive and it takes something away from it? But I kind of get why it was. Tyler has that capacity. He has that violence, that history, abusees often become abusers and he's fighting to be better than his father was or Klaus is but it doesn't mean he'll make it.

Right? Like and considering this comes after his big speech in episode two where he talks about being a part of a team and takes a hit to help everyone, he's reminded he's not really a part of the mystic falls team. His priorities are not considered, and how would you feel about that?

[pocochina]

He has that violence, that history, abusees often become abusers and he's fighting to be better than his father was or Klaus is but it doesn't mean he'll make it.

Yeah. And these things are touch and go, you know? I wouldn't buy it as a realistic growth arc without some backsliding. And using it here shows me that the show remembers what Tyler is fighting back against, without trying to obscure it.

[ladygawain]

I've watched this episode in dribs and drabs but am, as per usual, in agreement with you on most things

[pocochina]

Yeah. I think it'll be really interesting to watch the group dynamics get shaken up, which I think kind of has to happen, sooner rather than later.

I love how David Alpay is milking all the shadiness to the point where it's actually hilarious ("a spell that would grant him... IMMORTALLLIIIITTTYYYY.").

He's so clearly having the time of his life. It's so much fun to watch.

Bonnie's relationship with her power alongside the fact that she's learned fairly cruelly that she has no allies within her friend circle (leaving the space open for Shane-Silas) are going to be the driving factors for this story.

YES. I don't know if this was intentionally built up or if they're making something of what was there already, but honestly, I don't care as long as this arc goes where I think it could.

[pocochina]

TYLERRRRRRRR. *whimpers*