"me-me-me-me-me-me-me"(scaling a tonal range), AAARRRGGGHHH!!! Ahem. Yes. Well now. Now that, that has been said, let's get on with it shall we? How nice. Might not expressing either comprehension or confusion (or Confsciuosness) of wei-wu-wei tempt the illusory ego to make distinctions and therefore dualities that are separate from non-dual being? Could be it be that learning or growing in one's understanding of non-dualism would be a form of striving and is not striving an intentional act and therefore dualistic? One might construe these declarations as sarcastic and therefore negative which is dualistic, but would a practioner of wei-wu-wei make such dualistic evaluations? Too much. Way too much at one sitting. I read it. My head hurt, my eyes are crossed, I am dizzy and I may be going blind, but I did read it. The words of of the text required thought, logic, judgement and reason all of which are illusory constructs of an illusory ego which is required so that the texts describing wei-wu=wei can be deciphered so that illusory and egoistic experinces can be attempted in the egoistic hope that meditation can lead to actions that are non-dualistic, but careful now, lest you try to understand those non-dualistic actions and in so doing become dualistic all over again before you were to move beyond egoistic constructs like logic and reason. Have I missed anything? I see value and potential here not unlike components and threads of many western philosophies, just woven into a different tapestry. That's nice, but smaller pieces please.
Might not expressing either comprehension or confusion (or Confsciuosness) of wei-wu-wei tempt the illusory ego to make distinctions and therefore dualities that are separate from non-dual being?
Thus the Paradox.
Could be it be that learning or growing in one's understanding of non-dualism would be a form of striving and is not striving an intentional act and therefore dualistic?
More Paradox. I think one "solution" is to be headed in the Direction, but when "in the moment" to not be striving at all.
The words of of the text required thought, logic, judgement and reason
...if you say so...
all of which are illusory constructs of an illusory ego which is required so that the texts describing wei-wu=wei can be deciphered so that illusory and egoistic experinces can be attempted in the egoistic hope that meditation can lead to actions that are non-dualistic, but careful now, lest you try to understand those non-dualistic actions and in so doing become dualistic all over again before you were to move beyond egoistic constructs like logic and reason.
...getting warmer...
Have I missed anything?
Actually Experiencing this NonDual Action...
That's nice, but smaller pieces please.
Remember those times when you were so involved with something that you lost yourself in it? Whether it was reading a really good novel, painting a picture, dancing to the rhythm, or however you choose to name that SoC that psychologists have labeled "Flow", one of the things this whole "Wei Wu Wei" is referring to is getting so caught up in an activity that there is no Ego to get in the way. Put another way:
From the Past and the Future, the Action in the NowHere seems to have Meaning, Intent, & Purpose. However, whilst currently in the NowHere performing the Action, the Intent is lost (along with everything else) to surrendering to the Moment.
Given that we are discussing a NonDual concept using Dualistic words, you must understand that these words are not literally deScribing Wei Wu Wei, but sloppily pointing at what I'm getting at. Put another way:
"Tranquility in Disturbance"
"There is Serenity in Chaos. Seek ye the I of the Hurricane"
I find that I am reminded of studies at LDS Institutes of Religion:
"Brother Murdock(Dennis Murdock Director of Eugene LDS Institute of Religion in the late eighties and early nineties, Mastered in Psychology and Doctored in Education and student of esoteric psychological test instruments and of fringe studies of exotic LDS doctrine.) Why is it that the Lord tests our faith? Why does the Book of Mormon refer to the Lord giving us trials to 'test and torment man?'" (Paraphrased response following a never-ending stream of gentle, thought provoking humor.) "Typically the Lord tries our faith until we can be still and know that he is God. The Lord teaches us by trials to seek attunement to the Spirit in all situations, so that we can know peace and joy even in the midst of adversity and sorrows. When we are able to find the hand of the Lord in all things, then whatsoever other things we seek may be added unto us, be it riches, fame, achievement or more spiritual rewards. Sadly it is usually these very worldly blessings that leads so many to the vain delusion that we have achieved these things by our own hand, once again giving rise after a short season, to the Lord teaching by adversity until we turn from our faith in Him and/or until we take His hand and again find value in lasting values like peace, and selfless love and joy in the moment and patience in suffering and child-like delight and wonder and forgiveness of ones own self and others and even the Lord and unity and, of course, our spouses and our children and our parents that we may serve alongside them in Eternity." Actually that was more like a bringing together of many discussions, but my point is that while wei-wu-wei is not filtered by the nursery school motif of Christianity it does have have reflections, refractions and shadows even in the narcissistic philosophies of the West. Thank you again for gently parsing and comparing my rather strained response to your seeming (illusory?) wisdom.
How nice.
Might not expressing either comprehension or confusion (or Confsciuosness) of wei-wu-wei tempt the illusory ego to make distinctions and therefore dualities that are separate from non-dual being?
Could be it be that learning or growing in one's understanding of non-dualism would be a form of striving and is not striving an intentional act and therefore dualistic?
One might construe these declarations as sarcastic and therefore negative which is dualistic, but would a practioner of wei-wu-wei make such dualistic evaluations?
Too much.
Way too much at one sitting.
I read it.
My head hurt, my eyes are crossed, I am dizzy and I may be going blind, but I did read it.
The words of of the text required thought, logic, judgement and reason all of which are illusory constructs of an illusory ego which is required so that the texts describing wei-wu=wei can be deciphered so that illusory and egoistic experinces can be attempted in the egoistic hope that meditation can lead to actions that are non-dualistic, but careful now, lest you try to understand those non-dualistic actions and in so doing become dualistic all over again before you were to move beyond egoistic constructs like logic and reason.
Have I missed anything?
I see value and potential here not unlike components and threads of many western philosophies, just woven into a different tapestry.
That's nice, but smaller pieces please.
Reply
Thus the Paradox.
Could be it be that learning or growing in one's understanding of non-dualism would be a form of striving and is not striving an intentional act and therefore dualistic?
More Paradox. I think one "solution" is to be headed in the Direction, but when "in the moment" to not be striving at all.
The words of of the text required thought, logic, judgement and reason
...if you say so...
all of which are illusory constructs of an illusory ego which is required so that the texts describing wei-wu=wei can be deciphered so that illusory and egoistic experinces can be attempted in the egoistic hope that meditation can lead to actions that are non-dualistic, but careful now, lest you try to understand those non-dualistic actions and in so doing become dualistic all over again before you were to move beyond egoistic constructs like logic and reason.
...getting warmer...
Have I missed anything?
Actually Experiencing this NonDual Action...
That's nice, but smaller pieces please.
Remember those times when you were so involved with something that you lost yourself in it? Whether it was reading a really good novel, painting a picture, dancing to the rhythm, or however you choose to name that SoC that psychologists have labeled "Flow", one of the things this whole "Wei Wu Wei" is referring to is getting so caught up in an activity that there is no Ego to get in the way. Put another way:
From the Past and the Future, the Action in the NowHere seems to have Meaning, Intent, & Purpose. However, whilst currently in the NowHere performing the Action, the Intent is lost (along with everything else) to surrendering to the Moment.
Given that we are discussing a NonDual concept using Dualistic words, you must understand that these words are not literally deScribing Wei Wu Wei, but sloppily pointing at what I'm getting at. Put another way:
"Tranquility in Disturbance"
"There is Serenity in Chaos. Seek ye the I of the Hurricane"
Reply
I find that I am reminded of studies at LDS Institutes of Religion:
"Brother Murdock(Dennis Murdock Director of Eugene LDS Institute of Religion in the late eighties and early nineties, Mastered in Psychology and Doctored in Education and student of esoteric psychological test instruments and of fringe studies of exotic LDS doctrine.) Why is it that the Lord tests our faith? Why does the Book of Mormon refer to the Lord giving us trials to 'test and torment man?'"
(Paraphrased response following a never-ending stream of gentle, thought provoking humor.) "Typically the Lord tries our faith until we can be still and know that he is God. The Lord teaches us by trials to seek attunement to the Spirit in all situations, so that we can know peace and joy even in the midst of adversity and sorrows.
When we are able to find the hand of the Lord in all things, then whatsoever other things we seek may be added unto us, be it riches, fame, achievement or more spiritual rewards. Sadly it is usually these very worldly blessings that leads so many to the vain delusion that we have achieved these things by our own hand, once again giving rise after a short season, to the Lord teaching by adversity until we turn from our faith in Him and/or until we take His hand and again find value in lasting values like peace, and selfless love and joy in the moment and patience in suffering and child-like delight and wonder and forgiveness of ones own self and others and even the Lord and unity and, of course, our spouses and our children and our parents that we may serve alongside them in Eternity."
Actually that was more like a bringing together of many discussions, but my point is that while wei-wu-wei is not filtered by the nursery school motif of Christianity it does have have reflections, refractions and shadows even in the narcissistic philosophies of the West.
Thank you again for gently parsing and comparing my rather strained response to your seeming (illusory?) wisdom.
Reply
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