Torchwood & the attack of the plotbunnies

[wiseheart]

Entry bounced up a few days, so that more people can join the discussion if they want.

First, I wanted to give artemis10002000 this link. It's a discussion on a digitalspy forum titled "Frustration over Jack/Ianto's relationship

Comments

[artemis10002000]

First of all, thanks for the link. I always love to discover or be recommended new places to discuss fandom

[wiseheart]

Your plot bunny sounds really interesting! So I'm of two minds about you resisting it, as I know on one hand how annoying it is to have way too many works in progress when you don't have much time to write, but on the other hand I'd really like to read it :) Although I'd probably be hopelessly lost, with this being SGA season 5 and me not having watched since season 2 :DIt isn't much good after Season 1, to be honest, but I'm a faithful kind of viewer when it comes to sci-fi. Also, I usually hunt down the extended synopses from Gateworld, and I'm on a Yahoo mailing list where they post every single episode transcript from Stargate, so I'm fairly well-informed what will be going on. Unlike most people, I don't mind spoilers at all, since I get everyone at least one year later than it was originally aired, and without spoilers, I wouldn't understand what people are talking about

[artemis10002000]

Yeah, and when you're an European and want to be active in fandom, it's nearly impossible to avoid spoilers anyway. Forum discussions, fanfic, they're everywhere.

Of course, it's possible that the producers have decided to go the "sex sells" way to be successful internationally with Torchwood. A lot of bare skin has become a staple in science-fiction, after all, like in every genre. Which makes me feel kinda nostalgic for 90s sci-fi. I can still remember how fans mocked Seven of Nine's skin-tight uniform. I feel old when I think of that, it's like it's a completely different age of television :D

Woah, Carson was killed in season 3? Meanies!

[wiseheart]

That's why I hate so much when people keep bitching about spoilers. I mean, if you get your fix every week, it's one thing, but if you have to wait for years...

And it might be true that sex sells, but not in such a clumsy manner. It's downright ridiculous, not exciting. IMO sex needs to be believable to sell a show... or perhaps the problem is that I'm not horny 14-year-old?

Yep, they killed Carson. But they brought him back, so I might write that Ianto story one day, after all.

I got another weird idea from the "sex sells" slogan. Ianto and Miko commiserate about their lost loves (if you remember, Miko used to live in wide-eyed awe for Rodney) and then begin to kiss. Miko feels bad about it, but Ianto tells her: "There's nothing wrong with comfort sex." *g*

[artemis10002000]

That's why I hate so much when people keep bitching about spoilers. I mean, if you get your fix every week, it's one thing, but if you have to wait for years

[wiseheart]

You know, it might have exactly been the way it started with him and Jack. I'm toying with the idea to write exactly *that* story - but first I need to read some fanfic to see how other people solved the problem so that I can come up with a better solution. *g*

Yeah, I'm narcistic, how did you know? Sometimes you just have to admire yourself until the rest of mankind finally sees the light...

[artemis10002000]

You know, it might have exactly been the way it started with him and Jack. I'm toying with the idea to write exactly *that* story - but first I need to read some fanfic to see how other people solved the problem so that I can come up with a better solution. *g*
You mean writing that as a Jack/Ianto or a Carson/Ianto?

Yeah, I'm narcistic, how did you know? Sometimes you just have to admire yourself until the rest of mankind finally sees the light...
*lol*

[wiseheart]

Jack/Ianto, of course. With Carson he's gonna fall in love because Carson is everything that Jack is *not*.

There's another little piece of dialogue having popped up in my head. After that "picket fences" moment.

Jack: Are you telling me that you don't want me anymore? (eventually with some suggestive groping...)

Ianto: Oh, I do want you all right... perhaps always will. But he [Carson] is whom I need. (or something like that - I'll have to work on the phrasing some more)

[artemis10002000]

I really like that little piece of dialogue. Especially the "he is whom I need." That really sums up quite nicely how Ianto feels about Jack and Carson. Hmmm... I wonder, how does Carson feel about Ianto's history with Jack and that there's an attraction between them that will probably never fully go away?

[wiseheart]

I've tried to write a little Ianto/Carson piece today, and it seems to work rather nicely. You see, Carson also has a chip on his shoulder: he's a clone, and has identity problems. He's Carson - and yet he isn't. The Carson all these people knew and loved is dead. He has the man's DNA, knowledge, memories, personality - but is he truly the same person? Or just some freak of nature... where "nature" had preciously little to do with his creation. He was cloned by a Wraith, for Pete's sake!

More bits of dialogue for you.

Carson: (licking his lips, after Ianto had kissed him) You know, I usually don't walk that side of the street, but this was... nice. It's been quite long since I was last kissed. Actually, I've never been kissed in this body before.

After which Ianto asks him what he means and they discuss the problem of being a clone.

And another one, after Jack & Gwen learn that not only Ianto but Dr. Martha Jones, too, has been invited to an audience with the PM, Harriet Jones.

Jack: Is that some secret conspiration for the

[artemis10002000]

Ooooh, he's cloned by the Wraith? What plan did they have for him? I so need to read up on Stargate Atlants.

Jack: Is that some secret conspiration for the Joneses to take over the world?
Ianto: (bland smile) If it is, I haven't been sent a bulletin yet, sir.
*giggles* That's brilliant!

Yeah, with Carson having identity problems about being a clone, I can really see him bonding with Ianto over their self-consciousness. After all, poor little Ianto suffers under the "just the butler" syndrome as we learn in Cyberwomen.

[wiseheart]

Re: Carson
You saw the end of Season 2, didn't you? Remember Michael? The Wraith they briefly turned into a human? Well that guy managed to stuck somehow between the two, but considerably closer to Wraith, if I'm not mistaken.

In any case, he somehow got his paws on Carson's DNA around the beginning of Season 3 - in which season the idiot creators killed off carson, to replace him with the brainless girl with the distinct lack of personality.

Somewhere around the end of Season 4 (or early Season 5?) they find another lab of Michael's, and the Carson clone there, being forced to help Michael creating Wraith/Human hybrids.

They get clone!Carson out of there, but have to put him into cryostasis for a while, until they find a way to stop his cells or whatnot from degenerating. But along Season 5, he's in every other episode, healing folks on different planets (since he doesn't have his old job anymore), and even gets to save the day in the finale. I think he survives, but I'm not entirely sure. Well, he will survive in this story

[artemis10002000]

Ah, so that's the story of clone Carson. Sounds really interesting. So if he doesn't have his old job anymore, is he still working for the Atlantis mission or is he healing people as a freelance doctor?

Yeah, and in TW, he did heal/repair the Cyberwoman. EVen with her helping, that can't be done by a mere butler. I see him as being really underwhelmed by his new job in Torchwood 3. Making coffee and cleaning up after the others must be boring him to tears.

And Gwen gets to be boss? Huh. Weird. The authors must really, really love her. I'd have seen Tosh as being best qualified for second-in-command, she's always at the top of the game, very level-headed, has several years of job experience (though Ianto would make a good one, too, if only he's actually involved in the missions and got the necessary field experience.)

[wiseheart]

Carson is fighting the Hoffan plague (whatever that is) all over the Pegasus galaxy, with the theoretical support of Atlantis, but otherwise rather independently.

Ianto has offered to take such a job, actually, but we'll only see it in the penultimative episode of Series 2 - about a year or so, if RTL2 is feeling generous. But I've gone and read all the transcripts, and now I have the knowledge. *g*

I agree with you about Tosh being best-qualified to be second-in-command. Of course, it never happens. In one episode, where Jack isn't awailable, Owen steps in as the ranking member, and after that, of course, WonderGwen is taking the reins.

Yep, the writers really do love her, although I can't for my life imagine while. She's an annoying git and stupid obendrein. Sorry for the Germanism, but at least you understand it.

[artemis10002000]

Huh, Hoffan plague... Weird. Weren't the Hoff the one with the Wraith-vaccination? Maybe that mutated and turned into a plague? *scratches head*

They left Owen in charge? Oh dear. It's a miracle earth still exists. Owen may be good in his job, he must be to be in Torchwood, but I can't see him at all as the responsible and reliable leader. He doesn't think before he acts.

[wiseheart]

Yep, those were the Hoffans, all right. It turns out, the Wraith simply killed the entire planet afterwards, since the Hoffans have become toxic for them. Of course, there would have been more intelligent solutions, but then Weird and Sheppard wouldn't have turned out to be right, so the planet had to die, from the scripwriters' POV. That's why I've chosen a different solution in "Out of Legends". Of course, I had the invincible Tyr Anasazi to help me. *g*

Owen was only in charge for one mission, I think. Yeah, he's kind of impulsive, but at least he does have a brain - soemthing you can't say about Gwen, IMO.

I'm about to update telekis_vendiak with a few Torchwood fanfic recs. Found some on the Ianto comm with some wonderful Gwen bashing, so I feel the need to spread the right attitude among the unenlightened masses. ;)