Sacrifices need not be bloody... but it really helps.
Hey, I actually finished something. *cheers* Granted, it is a little tiny something that has nothing to do with my large mental stack of 'big things to finish', but it is indeed something!
FFVII ficlets
Mostly worksafe S/C, not-quite-angst
In-game
Spoilers for... disk one. (Enough of a summary for you? ;) )
( There's not enough blood. )
FFVII ficlets
Mostly worksafe S/C, not-quite-angst
In-game
Spoilers for... disk one. (Enough of a summary for you? ;) )
( There's not enough blood. )
I think that the misundertanding of Cloud on Sephiroth's part comes from a misunderstanding of humans in general- After Nibelheim, Sephiroth doesn't name himself as a human, he sees the race as traitorous and begins to aspire to be a God- absolutely superior to them. After finding the (")truth(") about his origins, he may have well thought that humans were wretched creatures meant to be ruled and incapable of feeling.
Looking up the lines(http://www.rpgamer.com/games/ff/ff7/ff7cscript.html) and italicising things I find interesting, the post-Aeris death scene went like this:
((After Sephiroth rambles about Aeris' life energy going back to be one with the Planet and so on...))
Cloud: "Shut up. The cycle of nature and your stupid plan don't mean a thing.
Aeris is gone.
Aeris will no longer talk, no longer laugh, cry...... or get angry......
What about us...... what are WE supposed to do? What about my pain?
My fingers are tingling. My mouth is dry. My eyes are burning!"
Sephiroth: "What are you saying? Are you trying to tell me you have feelings too?"
Cloud: "Of course! Who do you think I am!?"
Sephiroth: "Ha, ha, ha...... Stop acting as if you were sad. There's no need to act as though you're angry either.
Because, Cloud. You are..."
*Jenova Battle*
Jenova: ...a puppet.
I always interpreted that laugh as the same laugh he gives when speaking about his origins upon first arriving to Nibelheim- nervous. I also interpreted the Jenova Battle as Seph fleeing from the situation. Meaning, in my book- Cloud gets to Sephiroth.
I also feel Seph enjoys playing up Cloud's "puppet" situation and playing on his weaknesses- because the more Cloud is broken, the easier it is for Sephiroth to manipulate him into doing what he wants. Seeing as how Cloud gives over the Black Materia- I think it is safe to say that Sephiroth gets to Cloud as well.
That is just my view of it.
One thing I've always wondered is who would have told Cloud the truth about his (Zack's) memories, if not for Seph?
Reply
Ooh, that's a nifty site. Thanks for the link. ^^
That 'too' at the end of Sephiroth's seems pretty telling- that he has feelings and assumes that humans don't. I find it interesting that he acknowledges that little bit of vulnerability to Cloud- and in a way that doesn't really gain Sephiroth anything. Or he thinks he has feelings, anyways. I'm still not very sure how much of the Sephiroth there was controlled by Jenova (if at all) or if they 'merged' in the Sephiroth clone.
Hmm, I always took his laughter there to be the mocking, evil villain variety before he brings down an underling to take care of Avalanche.
It's so frustrating not having voices!
What strikes me as odd is that during Cloud's flashback of Nibelheim, Sephiroth doesn't deny that Cloud has feelings-
Cloud: "What about MY sadness!? My family... friends... The sadness of
having my hometown taken away from me!?... It's the same as your sadness!"
Sephiroth: "Ha, ha, ha... my sadness? What do I have to be sad about?"
And yes, Sephiroth definitely tries his best to drill the notion of 'puppet' into Cloud's head at every opportunity. It makes me wonder, if in truth, the hold Sephiroth had over Cloud in those earlier stages was less than what was actually shown.
I think Cloud gets to Sephiroth by finally throwing off his influence and taking the initiative in attacking at the Northern Crater. The one 'clone' who seems most under his control (nearly killing Aeris, Black Materia, etc.) is the one to go 'You know what? You suck and your mother sucks and your world domination plans suck too'. (Ad libbing, of course >_>;) Cloud's attached enough to all the rich memories and experiences and friends he's collected that he's able to overcome the strings Sephiroth has placed on him.
Maybe Tifa would've finally blurted out the truth? Or perhaps conversations with Prof. Hojo? It's the one good thing Sephiroth did for Cloud. ; )
Wow, that's a big rambly tl;dr this fine early morning. Hopefully there's some coherence.
Reply
As for the laugh- that is definately one of the reasons why there needs to be a remake. >:(
I suppose I've just been in love with the idea of Cloud being the only one able to unsettle Sephiroth for split seconds. (Cloud: "No Sephi, ur wrong!" Seph: "Hoshit!" "..." "Nuh-uh, wut do u kno?" *leaves, causing even more chaos than before*)
Ultimania says that Sephiroth was in control of Jenova(http://faqs.ign.com/articles/698/698416p1.html), but there are some lines in the game that cause me to question how valid that premise is (even though, yes, most Ultimania stuff comes straight from Square).
For example:
Sephiroth: "I have orders to take this planet back from you stupid people
for the Cetra. What am I supposed to be sad about?"
...hmm. He could be talking figuratively there, whatever. I've basically given up on the whole 'who has more influence on whom' thing between those two.
If I am writing, I generally change Jenova influence according to plot. Most of the time I give Sephiroth more control, because it makes him seem all the more ebil.
I think I'm going to make an icon out of "You know what? You suck and your mother sucks and your world domination plans suck too!" XD
Reply
The image of Seph going O_O; "Hoshit!" makes me XDD. Yeah, I like the idea of a Cloud able to get under his skin, even just a little. It evens the playing field (however tiny an amount) and adds depth to Sephiroth, who goes around a large chunk of the game in that 'MWAHAHAHA I PWN YOU' style.
Ah, FFVII remake, how you dangle temptingly out of reach. That would indeed be hardcore awesome, but it's still nice to leave things open to interpretation. All these Crisis Core and Before Crisis style games coming out will probably make AU all the nice SOLDIER era fics. And all these new characters and what looks like another one-winged guy... *sigh*.
Not to mention the deep hole of brokeness I'd be in after buying a PS3
I do wonder how much of it is what Nomura and Co. intended with the original game compared to just making up new stuff to sell. "Quick, our stocks are dropping! We need more fanbait- dust off FF7 and find some plot holes to fill!"
Yes, and I usually like sticking with the Sephiroth-is-in-charge idea (even if canon doesn't say and/or contradicts), mostly for that same reason. It feels like too much of a copout to have it other ways- Sephiroth is an evil, arrogant, sexy bastard due in large part to all the nasty things he's done. Er, in-game and movie anyways. He seemed mostly sane and easygoing, if kind of uptight in the few pre-Nibelheim flashbacks.
I guess if you needed a happier S/C fic, or one more partial to Sephiroth, though, you could go with more of a Jenova influence- Seph: "OMG I wuz brainwashed!" Cloud: "..."
Aww, I'd love to see an icon of that line if you do make one! <3
Reply
The only way S/C becomes Happyland after Nibelheim is by getting through the issues that the pairing have (with each other as well as with their own crazy selves) and I think that not too many writers have the patience to do that, so they cop out.
As for Square- I love the movie and etc- but a part of me and my wallet wish they had just remade the game and shot any idea of a Compilation to hell. It's also sad that they can't remember that the name of the 'mako cannon' is actually the Sister Ray.
Reply
Reply
Leave a comment