Three Gray Fandoms

[ursulav]

So a lot of conversation is going on at the moment, post-Worldcon, about just how weird the demographics were, and that leads to “I’m tired of all this ageism” and while I am arguably not the most interesting or insightful on that matter, nor do I have a lot of experience with Worldcons, but hey, it’s the Internet, and when did that ever stop

Comments

[bellinghman]

Whoa! I don't think I've ever heard of a Robert E Howard panel at a Worldcon before, and I'd be mildly surprised at the thought of two. Are you sure it's not his rules of order that were in effect?

[awfulhorrid]

I'm very backlogged in my Podcastle episodes right now -- as in well over a year and a half behind. I find it to be a great help in catching up to the current episodes when they run a REH story as I can skip it without the least bit of concern that I might be skipping a story I'm going to enjoy. Yeah, I mean I know he's a well recognized author who contributed greatly blah blah blah, but really people, how about something a bit more current for Worldcon?

[seawolf10]

" I don't think I've ever heard of a Robert E Howard panel at a Worldcon before, and I'd be mildly surprised at the thought of two. Are you sure it's not his rules of order that were in effect?"

Not enough violence, mayhem, blood, gore, eldritch abominations, blood, and mayhem for that, unless she's glossing over them...presumably due to lack of birds.

Robert E Howard

[rocketmensch]

The reason for the Robert E Howard panels is that Robert E Howard's home town, with his house and a Robert E Howard museum, is near San Antonio. So there was a concerted effort to memorialize REH at this convention, even though he wasn't an official "ghost of honor". (Several other Worldcons have had such "ghosts" officially -- it's a way to honor and draw attention to authors who have a particular connection to the convention, either by location, like Mark Twain in San Francisco, or by date, such as on an author's centenary) There was also a large special exhibit about REH, and a field trip to his house and the museum. I don't know if this was organized by a particular REH fan on the con staff, or by the museum staff, or who, but it wasn't just a track about a random dead author.

[zellion]

WorldCon is expensive. Actually when you are in your mid 30's and still have 5+ years to go on your student loans and you can't get a job that actually uses the degree you got so you're working wherever you can that pays you the most money, only they pay you a decent hourly wage but no benefits or paid vacation so you can't go anywhere or take a vacation other than maybe a bed and breakfast for one night and then, fuck, the car breaks down ...

That's my life for the last 8 years.

Cons will happen when we retire.

[ursulav]

I think that's definitely part of it, yeah. I would never pay $250 for a con if it wasn't a business expense/excuse to go somewhere neat as a tax write-off.

[bellinghman]

When we go to a Worldcon, to be honest the actual membership isn't the major cost, not next to international flights and the hotel bills. We usually end up taking a couple of weeks off so we amortise the flight cost. And the jet lag.

(Well, excepting next year, because that's London and we go there for gigs, like we did tonight.)

But yeah, $250 ain't cheap. I can see where those costs are coming from, and how other conventions have ways of keeping them down that the big convention centre cons don't have, but it's a deterrent. I believe the 2015 Helsinki bid would have had Finnish government finance helping them out, and the Dublin bid for 2019 also mentions government support. But the first won't be happening, and the second has a long way to go yet.

[txtriffidranch]

Oh, if you think that's good, you should have tried to become a vendor. The reason why the dealer's room was full of the same old stuff was very deliberate. When vendor spaces opened up, I very seriously considered getting a space. In fact, the price for each space was very reasonable. Problem was, all vendors had to be approved by a jury, and that was only after certifying that everyone at that table or booth had full paid memberships. It was an incredible incentive not to offer competition to the Fan GoH's used book business, as well as a very sneaky way to goose attendance numbers. "Sorry, but we don't find that your products suit our convention. You're now out $600, but at least you can vote for the Hugos. See you st the show, suckers

[sentientcitizen]

I went to WorldCon a few years back, when it was in Montreal and a family friend was up for a Hugo. I brought a friend with me; I was a bona fide teenager till, while she'd just squeaked into her twenties a few months earlier. People seemed pleased in the abstract to see Young People at their con... but at every panel we went to, we found the same two stories

[torrain]

I went to that WorldCon too. And two things are dawning on me:

(1) I want to say it wasn't like that!

(2) I realize that I went out of my way to try and catch two things: the inclusive panels (there was a list of them put out by I believe coffeeandink) and the ones featuring specific people who also happened (I say that with self-suspicion) to be older white women. And there was still some, uhm, some really creepy stuff.

(3) I am remembering how old how many people I talked to were, relative to me. Most of them were not younger. I think possibly a couple of the people I saw from the art show and the dealer's room. Literally, two.

(4) I think part of it is that I geek relatively heavily on old SF, so I am capable of having a discussion that is more "You read 'Evening Primrose' too? I thought I was the only one!" than it is "Well I have read Jack Vance and Alfred Bester so neener."

(5) ...it was so like that, wasn't it. Dammit.

[misty_anne]

The Stars My Destination, yes! Did you know there's a comic version either out, or coming out? I may have to get it, since my current copy is about 15 years older than I am and is in appropriate shape for such a well loved book. Think Velveteen Rabbit in pulp.

[winterlime]

I keep hearing about this "greying of (SF) fandom" thing, but it's rather hard for me to believe concretely, because all the SF fans I know and see are around 25. The only con I attend regularly is one run and attended by college students and very recent alums. All I knew about Worldcon before now was that a group of my friends, all under 30, were attending and performing. We exist! We're just generally too broke to get out much.

[aurora77]

I've never attended a Worldcon, but I've attended my local SF/F convention and I can tell you that the attendance there is healthy and and varied. It feels like it's fairly close to 50/50 on the male/female ratio. There are kids, teens, young adults, people our age, all the way up to grandparents and ancient monoliths. The panels are varied and they specifically provide activities for every age group. It's an incredibly welcoming experience. It was my first SF/F con experience and I realize now I've been terribly spoiled after hearing all the stories and experiences about other conventions. Seeing other cons that aren't as well-balanced and welcoming makes me sad. They can do better and need to do better if they want to survive.

[archangelbeth]

*nod*

At Arisia, there's a kid track, and the kid section is fairly filled. Panels on Kids In Fandom, Parents In Fandom, etc. And panels on Poly, etc., of course...

[aurora77]

I love to hear that it's not just here. We have those at my local con. There's usually panels for parenting, geek families, gender and sexuality discussions, alternative etiquette, poly, BDSM, and various other areas that tend to promote a welcoming, educating atmosphere. And it feels like a really safe place. I've seen people dress and express themselves in ways they could not get away with anywhere else I've ever been and they're able to feel comfortable doing it. It's a beautiful thing and makes me smile and start to tear up a little when I think about it. It's not perfect, but it does feel like a little slice of geeky heaven while I'm there.

[archangelbeth]

I wonder if there's a correlation... Panels for parenting/families = people who bring their kids? Feedback loop?