i just have a conduct disorder and i like to fight. i feel like i'm a bad person and i push you around. i was tired of me pushing you around i see so many people push you around and it kills me
makes me feel like i do that too. that's what my mom said. i boss you around and i'm mean to you.
i'm horrible. i'm just... you shouldn't be with me. you should get away right now. i will cause you nothing but misery and pain.
i just want you to stand up to me. i'm a sociopath-lite. i'm a mean person, don't you understand? don't you see? i don't feel empathy for most people, except you. i don't know if i even feel guilty for what i just did, i just feel like a terrible person. is this guilt? teach me what guilt is. i don't understand it. teach me how to feel like you do. teach me how to be a human being. please...
i want you to be more like me, but in a good way. i want you to stand up for yourself like i stand up for myself. you need to work on it. obviously i don't want you to have a conduct disorder and want to fight, like i do... so fucking fucked up.
but really, you should get away from me.
i've had awful experiences with religion too, which is why i dislike organized religion. trust me on it, they were pretty fucking horrible.
*hugs* You're not a horrible person. And I'm not trying to say that my experiences were unusually horrible, only explaining why I tend to be very triggery about it. I was attempting to stop myself before getting into a fight, because I recognized the pattern I was falling into. I knew that if I kept going on that route, I would get into a huge fight with you, and I was trying to stop myself before I got to that point. Obviously it didn't work. :-/ I sometimes succeed, but not always. I get offended when people claim to know that God exists. Agnosticism seems a bit silly to me, as it implies that God and no-God are equally plausible. When I say I'm an atheist, I don't mean "I KNOW THERE IS NO GOD!" I mean "I find God to be very implausible". It's an unfalsifiable idea, and if there is a God or gods, how could we know anything about him/her/it/them? How could you know if a theology is right or wrong?
And you're completely right that I let people push me around too much. Including you at times. I'm working on improving that, and I'm not as bad about it as I used to be. I can sometimes stand up for myself. I promise you I'll work on that. And if you say or do something to upset me, I'll say so, okay?
i don't know if i even feel guilty for what i just did, i just feel like a terrible person. is this guilt?
I think so. Guilt usually includes a feeling of being a bad person.
teach me how to feel like you do. teach me how to be a human being. please...
I'll do what I can for you, honey. <3 We can help each other. You can teach me to stand up for myself, and I can teach you to be less confrontational.
the thing is though, you need to realise the god i believe in is not like the god you've heard about from other people. i think sometimes people turn to atheism because they are so used to bad experiences and crappy, horrible organized religion that believes in this awful, terrible, vengeful god who hates trans and gays and bi-sexuals and pokemon and god knows whatever the fuck else.
i believe in a god that is loving and kind. i believe in a god that is okay if you don't pray or don't attend to church. i believe in a god that gave us free will and doesn't interfere in our lives unless he really needs to, to save us from something (like what happened here). i believe in a god that is okay with trans people, gay people, bi-sexuals. i believe in a god that understands agnosticism and atheism both, and understands why people don't believe and doesn't fault them for it. that's the god i believe in.
i also don't believe in hell. if god loves us like children, why would he do that? could you ever send your child to hell? i believe in a god that forgives.
can you see now? it's not like other gods. when i used to believe when i was younger and claimed i was a christian (which i'm really not now, i'm not sure if i believe jesus was the son of god- i think he might have just been a prophet of some sort, i don't like organized religion period, so i actually do refuse to "believe" in that. i think it does nothing but harm)... when i told other christians about the god i believed in, they hated it. they told me i was going to fucking hell for believing in that, and how wrong i was. i think that's sick.
i've had some awful fucking experiences. i was abused. god wasn't there for me, he never took me away from my mother until i was 14. way too late. but again, freewill. things happen for a god damned reason and i wouldn't be the same person i am now without that. even if parts of it are bad, there are some parts that are good.
freewill.
when i was a kid my mom used to jump around religions a lot because she was borderline. i've been to almost every church and i hated them all. she used to send me to awful, horrible baptist summer camps. i really hated those.
at one, the kids all made fun of me. they left notes under my pillow saying i was going to hell. they hated me because i rambled on about invader zim. they couldn't stand it.
i remember being as young as six and i was at one, and people told me i was going to hell. other kids. i remember one night we all agreed we wouldn't be sinners and accept god into our hearts. that night, i thought about it, and i remember crying so hard because i started saying to god: "i'm sorry god, i can't not be a sinner. i'm a sinner. i am going to sin. i'm sorry, i'm sorry, i take back what i said." i felt like i had made a promise i couldn't keep and i was going to hell for it.
the counselor actually woke up when i was sobbing and rocked me back and forth and sang to me, because i told her that's what my mom did. (because she did do that, the counselor had asked what calmed me down.)
there were some good things. at the camp when i was older (the first one i was talking about) i met a girl who had been raped. that was the first time i remember feeling empathy for another human being. we just... knew. we knew how horrible people could be, how abusive, how it could fuck up your life. she had PTSD- she told me she took meds for her nightmares. sometimes borderline is considered a form of PTSD, and julia said it was impossible for me not to have it with what happened to me.
the thing is though, you need to realise the god i believe in is not like the god you've heard about from other people. i think sometimes people turn to atheism because they are so used to bad experiences and crappy, horrible organized religion that believes in this awful, terrible, vengeful god who hates trans and gays and bi-sexuals and pokemon and god knows whatever the fuck else.
No, see, that's not it. Maybe some people become atheists for that reason, but I doubt many do. Most people who are turned away by experiences like that turn to other religions, or to some kind of spirituality. I don't believe in the angry, vengeful God. I don't believe in a loving caring God. I don't believe in the limited gods of Greek mythology or Shinto or Norse paganism or any other religion. I don't believe in the gods of Hindu. I don't believe in the Buddha. I don't believe in any of those concepts.
I know your experiences were much worse. Mine were more internal. As a child, I assumed God was just make-believe. I didn't think anyone really believed in him. When I realized people were serious, I started thinking maybe there really was something to it, and I started to take the religion I was brought up in seriously, but I had serious issues with it. Christianity really makes no sense, and, after agonizing over trying to believe in it, I moved onto deism and then a vague polytheism (I still think that, if there is some kind of supernatural, some kind of divinity, that polytheism makes more sense; how could a god love without others like himself to learn love from? Monotheism seems really weird to me)
The book I was reading, Blameless in Abaddon, had an interesting idea about God. That God is not all-loving, not pure good, but that he, like us, is more complicated. He has a loving side and a malevolent side. He is both Jesus and Satan. He both heals the sick and sends disease. If I were to believe in God, that's the kind of God I would believe in. An imperfect being. Maybe one who's trying his best, but ultimately makes mistakes, just like his creations.
and you do let me push you around. i'm tired of it. but be warned, i'm fucking mean when people stand up to me. i usually go: "i don't give a fuck/i don't care, i'm going to do that anyway, fuck you". don't let that deter you, realise it's just my conduct disorder and that i might not feel guilty about it, because... i can't, christy. i was made this way by my mother. it's hard for me to feel those emotions.
just keep pressing. keep saying it until you get it through to me. if you do it enough (and rarely does any one, they pretty much all back off, except maybe my dad and a few people) it will eventually click. i'll feel a low level of guilt, very low, but present. i'll feel bad and that i shouldn't have done that, and i'll work to improve. you just have to keep standing up, no matter how much my reaction hurts you.
it's just how you deal with me.
does it really? i guess this is guilt... i guess i just said that too with my last statement. that is guilt! i don't know, christy. i feel so empty inside.
yes, please teach me how not to want to fight. i need to borrow things from you, i need to sometimes let people stand up to me and for me to back off. i need to stop.
From now on, I'll make an effort to stand up to you more. I tend to fear confrontation, but perhaps this is just what I need to get over that fear. We both have something to learn from each other.
i'm a terrible person
i just have a conduct disorder and i like to fight.
i feel like i'm a bad person and i push you around.
i was tired of me pushing you around
i see so many people push you around and it kills me
makes me feel like i do that too. that's what my mom said. i boss you around and i'm mean to you.
i'm horrible. i'm just... you shouldn't be with me. you should get away right now. i will cause you nothing but misery and pain.
i just want you to stand up to me. i'm a sociopath-lite. i'm a mean person, don't you understand? don't you see? i don't feel empathy for most people, except you. i don't know if i even feel guilty for what i just did, i just feel like a terrible person. is this guilt? teach me what guilt is. i don't understand it. teach me how to feel like you do. teach me how to be a human being. please...
i want you to be more like me, but in a good way. i want you to stand up for yourself like i stand up for myself. you need to work on it. obviously i don't want you to have a conduct disorder and want to fight, like i do... so fucking fucked up.
but really, you should get away from me.
i've had awful experiences with religion too, which is why i dislike organized religion. trust me on it, they were pretty fucking horrible.
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And you're completely right that I let people push me around too much. Including you at times. I'm working on improving that, and I'm not as bad about it as I used to be. I can sometimes stand up for myself. I promise you I'll work on that. And if you say or do something to upset me, I'll say so, okay?
i don't know if i even feel guilty for what i just did, i just feel like a terrible person. is this guilt?
I think so. Guilt usually includes a feeling of being a bad person.
teach me how to feel like you do. teach me how to be a human being. please...
I'll do what I can for you, honey. <3 We can help each other. You can teach me to stand up for myself, and I can teach you to be less confrontational.
Reply
i believe in a god that is loving and kind. i believe in a god that is okay if you don't pray or don't attend to church. i believe in a god that gave us free will and doesn't interfere in our lives unless he really needs to, to save us from something (like what happened here). i believe in a god that is okay with trans people, gay people, bi-sexuals. i believe in a god that understands agnosticism and atheism both, and understands why people don't believe and doesn't fault them for it. that's the god i believe in.
i also don't believe in hell. if god loves us like children, why would he do that? could you ever send your child to hell? i believe in a god that forgives.
can you see now? it's not like other gods. when i used to believe when i was younger and claimed i was a christian (which i'm really not now, i'm not sure if i believe jesus was the son of god- i think he might have just been a prophet of some sort, i don't like organized religion period, so i actually do refuse to "believe" in that. i think it does nothing but harm)... when i told other christians about the god i believed in, they hated it. they told me i was going to fucking hell for believing in that, and how wrong i was. i think that's sick.
i've had some awful fucking experiences. i was abused. god wasn't there for me, he never took me away from my mother until i was 14. way too late. but again, freewill. things happen for a god damned reason and i wouldn't be the same person i am now without that. even if parts of it are bad, there are some parts that are good.
freewill.
when i was a kid my mom used to jump around religions a lot because she was borderline. i've been to almost every church and i hated them all. she used to send me to awful, horrible baptist summer camps. i really hated those.
at one, the kids all made fun of me. they left notes under my pillow saying i was going to hell. they hated me because i rambled on about invader zim. they couldn't stand it.
i remember being as young as six and i was at one, and people told me i was going to hell. other kids. i remember one night we all agreed we wouldn't be sinners and accept god into our hearts. that night, i thought about it, and i remember crying so hard because i started saying to god: "i'm sorry god, i can't not be a sinner. i'm a sinner. i am going to sin. i'm sorry, i'm sorry, i take back what i said." i felt like i had made a promise i couldn't keep and i was going to hell for it.
the counselor actually woke up when i was sobbing and rocked me back and forth and sang to me, because i told her that's what my mom did. (because she did do that, the counselor had asked what calmed me down.)
there were some good things. at the camp when i was older (the first one i was talking about) i met a girl who had been raped. that was the first time i remember feeling empathy for another human being. we just... knew. we knew how horrible people could be, how abusive, how it could fuck up your life. she had PTSD- she told me she took meds for her nightmares. sometimes borderline is considered a form of PTSD, and julia said it was impossible for me not to have it with what happened to me.
Reply
No, see, that's not it. Maybe some people become atheists for that reason, but I doubt many do. Most people who are turned away by experiences like that turn to other religions, or to some kind of spirituality. I don't believe in the angry, vengeful God. I don't believe in a loving caring God. I don't believe in the limited gods of Greek mythology or Shinto or Norse paganism or any other religion. I don't believe in the gods of Hindu. I don't believe in the Buddha. I don't believe in any of those concepts.
I know your experiences were much worse. Mine were more internal. As a child, I assumed God was just make-believe. I didn't think anyone really believed in him. When I realized people were serious, I started thinking maybe there really was something to it, and I started to take the religion I was brought up in seriously, but I had serious issues with it. Christianity really makes no sense, and, after agonizing over trying to believe in it, I moved onto deism and then a vague polytheism (I still think that, if there is some kind of supernatural, some kind of divinity, that polytheism makes more sense; how could a god love without others like himself to learn love from? Monotheism seems really weird to me)
The book I was reading, Blameless in Abaddon, had an interesting idea about God. That God is not all-loving, not pure good, but that he, like us, is more complicated. He has a loving side and a malevolent side. He is both Jesus and Satan. He both heals the sick and sends disease. If I were to believe in God, that's the kind of God I would believe in. An imperfect being. Maybe one who's trying his best, but ultimately makes mistakes, just like his creations.
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Reply
just keep pressing. keep saying it until you get it through to me. if you do it enough (and rarely does any one, they pretty much all back off, except maybe my dad and a few people) it will eventually click. i'll feel a low level of guilt, very low, but present. i'll feel bad and that i shouldn't have done that, and i'll work to improve. you just have to keep standing up, no matter how much my reaction hurts you.
it's just how you deal with me.
does it really? i guess this is guilt... i guess i just said that too with my last statement. that is guilt! i don't know, christy. i feel so empty inside.
yes, please teach me how not to want to fight. i need to borrow things from you, i need to sometimes let people stand up to me and for me to back off. i need to stop.
i just want to be like you.
i want to be a human being.
i want to feel guilt.
i want to feel empathy.
please help me.
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