Joe- who else would it be?!
Agh...so here's the deal. I don't remember WHEN exactly the following happened but here's the latest. Okay *breathes to try and make this rational* Probably about 1-2 wks ago, Joe called again. Let me also say that when writing about his last phone call with me, I forgot to mention that he made it very clear that he was happy being single, that he couldn't focus on ANYTHING except school at this point and that he wasn't ready at all for a relationship right now and the time it would take up. So basically I decided to NOT tell him about how I feel romantically towards him.
So anyway, recently, he called again. We talked about what was up on our ends, how his weekend trip to NC was and all that. Someone talked to him about going to dinner or something like his roomate or something, I'm not sure. So then I decided to ask what I figured I knew the answer to. "Did you see Becca while you were there?" (Becca is the "other" mormon girl- they were in H.S. together actually she's still a H.S. senior and she's the one that he called on Valentine's Day before me and I know I've mentioned her on here before...anyway to sum up she's the one that he said that he would've tried to date if he had not been leaving for basic so soon- only like a MONTH after leaving here!) well first after I asked that he tried to change the subject but in an overly obvious way like "Sooooo..." and I laughed and said "Joe! Answer the question." and he made some comment about me not letting him off that easy and I said "nope!" Well then he said "Yes I did and (basically- I don't remember exact wording) yes we are now together." Well...needless to say that hurt but I asked how it came about and he said that they had just gone to the movies one day and sat on a love seat (I guess two chairs connected- never seen them in theaters though) and they had a good time and it just..."happened." Sigh. It just...it pissed me off for so many reasons. Once again- it just cemented to me how I can't ever trust him. I can't ever fully fall for him again even if I WANT to because I can't, my heart is tired of his bull shit. Of him professing us to be "true loves" and then moving on about 3 months later. It's just...and after him making it SO damn clear to me that he did NOT want to be in a relationship at that point, ESPECIALLY long distance (his reasoning is that it's not as long distance as we would be because he can visit up there every other weekend or something and they'll see each other more if she comes down). He made it so clear to me, spends one weekend with her, and is all hers...Anyway, back to the conversation. He made some comment about being sorry if it made me angry and I said "You can't really be angry about something you 90% expected." And he said "okay...I'm sorry if it upset you." And I told him "I'm not upset- just realizing that some things will never change." I then said "I thought you needed to go eat." He said "I'll go when we're done talking." and I said "I think we're pretty much done- we covered all the big updates." And he started to say "okay bye..." and before he finished I hung up.
Anyway, so after thinking about his all like nonstop I decided to write him an email explaining why I was upset and all that. Warning- this is EXTREMELY long so stop now if you do not have either the time or interest for all of the details.
Joe,
Here's the deal in complete honesty. I'll say in advance I'm not at all trying to or going to try to break you and Becca up whether I even could or not. That's not up to me and I don't want to be "The Jealous Ex" or anything, but I want you to understand with perfect clarity how I feel about and towards YOU, but I'm sure that she is a wonderful girl. Besides that I wouldn't even want you for myself right now, because once again, I trust nothing you would say. I do in a way wish that I could talk to Becca, warn her "This is how it's happened, how he's played this situation before, and what will probably happen." Sort of like the Whitney Houston song- Same script, different cast. Not exactly, but similar. But I won't because well, a) I can't contact her and b) because that's your situation for you and her to deal with and who knows- maybe this time it really WILL be different...I don't think so...but you have the perogative to as many fresh chances with girls who will take you as you want, and based on my history and experience with you I won't ever try to marr that. Because hopefully one time, it really will be different. You will mean everything you say enough to keep your actions in line with it and not just the sweet words that are always too easy to say. Hopefully. I doubt much of this letter will even affect you because you see and believe only how you want to many times. I am honestly shocked when I hear you admit you're wrong either in whole or in part...but I also realize it's not fair to stew and boil and let our so called relationship deteriorate without at least letting you realize WHY you screwed up this time.
Anyway...I wasn't kidding at all when I said I "90% expected it." As always there was a small, stupid part of me that thought maybe, just maybe it wouldn't play the same story as the previous times...but again you proved that portion wrong. Every single time you start this whole thing up, guess who's the first to "get over" it and move on? No matter HOW deep and true they profess their love to be? You. I told you in the beginning I didn't trust you, becuase the last couple times you've spouted all these romantic things about forever and our being "true loves" and the like only to have "forever" end a few months later. Just this last time you said something about not having always withstoood and passed all the trials set before our love but...Guess what happened again...yeah. I don't want to ever hear another love word out of your mouth until you are fully prepared, ready and commited to back it up COMPLETELY through action. That is also what I meant by "Just realizing some things will never change."
I know that we weren't together but here's how I saw it- once you joined the church, whether you agree with this or not, it's as though this enourmous pyschological block was removed. I felt more for you after that...it's as though in October and all that...occasionally I felt a spark, so I knew it was there somewhere, but it wasn't constant, or as strong as I knew it could be but a little was there. Then, once I knew it really had even the POTENTIAL to go somewhere, even if not any time soon...but the hope was there...a dam broke, and all of a sudden I did feel everything again. More than in Oct. But you weren't ready for a relationship- or so you told me. And truth be told, even though I was willing at the time to give it a shot if you had seemed open to it, I was/am not truly ready to be committed to anyone but myself right now. However, I didn't feel ready to date even if I had been asked, because I knew I loved you. You however, a week or two after you left from here, from supposedly the "one" you had been head over heels with in love only a month before- you had already begun moving on. You were already crushing on Becca to the point that you would've dated her long before now had you not been leaving for basic so soon. That's how deep you "really" loved me. In my eyes, if you REALLY love someone, you don't WANT to run out and date others if you already have feelings for someone else. It's not fair to you or them (the others you would date). Which only leads me to two ideas, neither good on your part: either you did love me but your love changes so quickly and is so temporary it's not even close to trustworthy and being considered for anything requiring time and committment such as marriage OR you came here and realized you didn't really love me romantically as you thought you did and that is why you were able to move on so soon, in which case you should have been completely honest with me. So even though we weren't together, I felt as though how you acted afterwards said a LOT about how you really felt or feel about me.
I will say now, I do want to continue our friendship- but for a while, do not want to speak on the phone to you. Not until we discuss this all through email first. It's just easier for me to talk this way where I can be honest but also think things through first.
Also, when you tell me you can't handle a relationship at the moment and all that especially long distance, and then end up, just a while later- a few months to a year, going out with (or trying to) Mary Beth, Shannon, and Becca (those are all I remember that I can directly relate to this situation)- it makes me think that obviously THEY have something that makes giving it a shot with them worth it, regardless of what you previously thought or said. Obviously something between you and them makes it WORTH IT, and apparently WE don't have that. And if WE don't have what it takes to make it worth TRYING to make it through anything than why the hell do WE keep going back to each other?! Bringing me to my next point:
With how often we go through this cycle of romance and love and then oops, you've moved on- did you ever REALLY love me? Or do you simply like being a boyfriend, in a relationship, and for whatever reason, I'm the idiot girl that got suckered in the most, so when you need a relationship or something as close as can get, I still am not "over" you and therefore let you pull me back in. Am I just fulfilling your need for a relationship as needed but you never truly love me? Am I just the most gullible, idiotic girl of all you've dated and that's why we keep ending up together? Especially with what I mentioned above?! I'm worth it for when you need a relationship of some kind but apparently not worth it enough to make you WANT to try and last through time or distance...but other, recent, newfound crushes are. You always make it seem like I'm the one and only for you- Until a few months later when the next cute thing walks by.
Now, after you being with Becca, when I think of you saying "I'm not ready" what I HEAR is "I'm not ready to be with YOU." In which case- you should either be honest and come out and say it if that's what you meant or you should mean what you say. If you're not ready for a relationship- you're not ready. But that's your choice. I'm just saying, that's what I hear now when I think of that because of the current circumstances, and if that (not being ready for me) is/was the case- don't lead me on, come out and say it. Making me feel that way without saying it isn't ANY better. And after what you told me about you in High School- you know, never being the one to "dump" the girl so YOU would look good (which by the way I still think was highly juvenile, ridiculous, and egotistical of you) but turning it around so she'd dump you- I don't know what I should believe? How do I know if the above is true you'd even come out and say it or would you try to turn it around somehow to make it seem like I'm the one who's not ready or couldn't handle it and THAT's why you said it or something?? So basically twist it and say you were saying it for my benefit, in which case I'm a big girl- all you need to do is be honest, not be my keeper. Can I even trust you after everything you've done or not done in the romance department? No matter what you tell me, as friends or otherwise, I don't even know if it's worth trusting at this point.
I want to stay friends, I want to have hope. But have we passed that point? Are we so emotionally intertwined that we can't be "just friends?" This is where I'm really at a loss. I'm angry and distrusting of you romantically, but doesn't that in many ways affect the friendship? So then what? Do we just not talk and take a break from it ALL at the risk of losing the friendship we're only now getting a chance to develop? Or do we do the best we can to seperate it, even if the effort is obviously in vain. Because we can never fully hide or erase out of the picture the other emotions we feel whether love, hate, distrust, whatever. They're always a part of the bigger picture of us even if we try to seperate the Love from Friends. I honestly do not know.
I also worry that with how things have happened, if you might have joined the church for Becca, or that you may have decided to just "take a leap of faith" without ANYTHING backing it up- any real feeling, strong or not, or any thoughts of "This has to be the right one" even without a feeling behind it...I wonder if you took the leap of faith even if hoping something later would follow and let you know it is right...I wonder if you initially took it so that you'd have a shot with Becca. You say you "accept" the church but don't neccisarily believe it. That's not enough. If you really even understood what this church is, what WE believe it is, it would be impossible to "accept" without "believing." Or maybe you just haven't clarified on something so I'm confused here...but this is what I feel based on what I've heard. Does Becca know how nonchalant you seem to be about the church at this time? Is that what SHE wants? Is that fair to her? At this point, in all honesty, it's not even enough for me...but it raised the bar of HOPE and therefore emotions. Better this than nothing, because this is a start, although I suppose at this point that doens't matter anyhow. Maybe that's how she feels too. Or would, if she knew.
I have no idea on what you HONESTLY see, want or hope for us in ANY future time. If there's hope, if there's not. If there is hope, if you're waiting to see certain things out of me. If not, be freakin HONEST with me. I don't play your games. I'm done with that. I know that especially after this latest chapter, I am definetly needing to see things from you before you even think about "opening the door" to us again. Words, as usual, are too easy to say for you, but the actions that back them up have once more, not followed. So I know before we're even a real shot again, if that's even what you still see in the future, there are things I need to see- in a few areas- from you. Are you waiting to see certain things from me before you'd see it as "worth it?" Or, no matter what were to happen is this just never going to be "worth" overcoming distance or us not feeling ready for anything? And again, if it never will be, but others sometimes are, WHY are we still playing this game, almost a decade later? Yeah really- we're in our 9th year. If you do see it as being "worth it" eventually, what needs to change? Do you need to see something(s) out of me first? If so, what? I'm not saying it would happen immediately, nothing can change overnight, but it would be a start to see where we stand. And if you want I could honestly tell you what I'd need to see out of you- only if you're sure you want to know.
I've also decided that at this point, no matter HOW you respond, I am not going to once more, try to "actively" get over you. If it happens on it's own (LOL! as if!) great, wonderful. If not, I'm not going to try- I'll focus on myself, I'll still date around if chances come up and all that, but I won't actively try. Because honestly, no matter what you were to tell me, I wouldn't believe this is really over for good yet. Because every other time in the past we've been CERTAIN it's over, it hasn't been, and in my eyes right now, I don't think it ever will be. And in order to truly get over you as best I can, it requires me to shut myself off nearly completely from you, not caring, almost being cold and completely apathetic. Focusing on your faults and why it won't work, why I should move on, etc. And when I do that, it's so hard getting over that and opening up again later, when we want to, and it's all just too emotionally taxing- both getting over you and opening back up to the possibilities. It takes too much effort, for too long for something that only MOSTLY works, only to ALWAYS having to be unearthed or buried again a couple years later. It's not worth it to me, so I won't bother. That doesn't change the fact that before I'll ACT on or agree with you acting on those feelings in any way shape or form I need to see certain things from you and do certain things for myself. That doesn't mean I'm just sitting here waiting to either run back to you or expecting you to run back to me anytime soon (although based on the past, one or the other will try to happen eventually- it's the cycle we go through) but just that no matter what happens, the feelings will be there unless they just naturally go away with time. I'm just letting you know...
Please do not call again until you have responded in email to this letter in full and we've come to some form of conclusion.
Love, Ericka
Now I just wait for his response...
So anyway, recently, he called again. We talked about what was up on our ends, how his weekend trip to NC was and all that. Someone talked to him about going to dinner or something like his roomate or something, I'm not sure. So then I decided to ask what I figured I knew the answer to. "Did you see Becca while you were there?" (Becca is the "other" mormon girl- they were in H.S. together actually she's still a H.S. senior and she's the one that he called on Valentine's Day before me and I know I've mentioned her on here before...anyway to sum up she's the one that he said that he would've tried to date if he had not been leaving for basic so soon- only like a MONTH after leaving here!) well first after I asked that he tried to change the subject but in an overly obvious way like "Sooooo..." and I laughed and said "Joe! Answer the question." and he made some comment about me not letting him off that easy and I said "nope!" Well then he said "Yes I did and (basically- I don't remember exact wording) yes we are now together." Well...needless to say that hurt but I asked how it came about and he said that they had just gone to the movies one day and sat on a love seat (I guess two chairs connected- never seen them in theaters though) and they had a good time and it just..."happened." Sigh. It just...it pissed me off for so many reasons. Once again- it just cemented to me how I can't ever trust him. I can't ever fully fall for him again even if I WANT to because I can't, my heart is tired of his bull shit. Of him professing us to be "true loves" and then moving on about 3 months later. It's just...and after him making it SO damn clear to me that he did NOT want to be in a relationship at that point, ESPECIALLY long distance (his reasoning is that it's not as long distance as we would be because he can visit up there every other weekend or something and they'll see each other more if she comes down). He made it so clear to me, spends one weekend with her, and is all hers...Anyway, back to the conversation. He made some comment about being sorry if it made me angry and I said "You can't really be angry about something you 90% expected." And he said "okay...I'm sorry if it upset you." And I told him "I'm not upset- just realizing that some things will never change." I then said "I thought you needed to go eat." He said "I'll go when we're done talking." and I said "I think we're pretty much done- we covered all the big updates." And he started to say "okay bye..." and before he finished I hung up.
Anyway, so after thinking about his all like nonstop I decided to write him an email explaining why I was upset and all that. Warning- this is EXTREMELY long so stop now if you do not have either the time or interest for all of the details.
Joe,
Here's the deal in complete honesty. I'll say in advance I'm not at all trying to or going to try to break you and Becca up whether I even could or not. That's not up to me and I don't want to be "The Jealous Ex" or anything, but I want you to understand with perfect clarity how I feel about and towards YOU, but I'm sure that she is a wonderful girl. Besides that I wouldn't even want you for myself right now, because once again, I trust nothing you would say. I do in a way wish that I could talk to Becca, warn her "This is how it's happened, how he's played this situation before, and what will probably happen." Sort of like the Whitney Houston song- Same script, different cast. Not exactly, but similar. But I won't because well, a) I can't contact her and b) because that's your situation for you and her to deal with and who knows- maybe this time it really WILL be different...I don't think so...but you have the perogative to as many fresh chances with girls who will take you as you want, and based on my history and experience with you I won't ever try to marr that. Because hopefully one time, it really will be different. You will mean everything you say enough to keep your actions in line with it and not just the sweet words that are always too easy to say. Hopefully. I doubt much of this letter will even affect you because you see and believe only how you want to many times. I am honestly shocked when I hear you admit you're wrong either in whole or in part...but I also realize it's not fair to stew and boil and let our so called relationship deteriorate without at least letting you realize WHY you screwed up this time.
Anyway...I wasn't kidding at all when I said I "90% expected it." As always there was a small, stupid part of me that thought maybe, just maybe it wouldn't play the same story as the previous times...but again you proved that portion wrong. Every single time you start this whole thing up, guess who's the first to "get over" it and move on? No matter HOW deep and true they profess their love to be? You. I told you in the beginning I didn't trust you, becuase the last couple times you've spouted all these romantic things about forever and our being "true loves" and the like only to have "forever" end a few months later. Just this last time you said something about not having always withstoood and passed all the trials set before our love but...Guess what happened again...yeah. I don't want to ever hear another love word out of your mouth until you are fully prepared, ready and commited to back it up COMPLETELY through action. That is also what I meant by "Just realizing some things will never change."
I know that we weren't together but here's how I saw it- once you joined the church, whether you agree with this or not, it's as though this enourmous pyschological block was removed. I felt more for you after that...it's as though in October and all that...occasionally I felt a spark, so I knew it was there somewhere, but it wasn't constant, or as strong as I knew it could be but a little was there. Then, once I knew it really had even the POTENTIAL to go somewhere, even if not any time soon...but the hope was there...a dam broke, and all of a sudden I did feel everything again. More than in Oct. But you weren't ready for a relationship- or so you told me. And truth be told, even though I was willing at the time to give it a shot if you had seemed open to it, I was/am not truly ready to be committed to anyone but myself right now. However, I didn't feel ready to date even if I had been asked, because I knew I loved you. You however, a week or two after you left from here, from supposedly the "one" you had been head over heels with in love only a month before- you had already begun moving on. You were already crushing on Becca to the point that you would've dated her long before now had you not been leaving for basic so soon. That's how deep you "really" loved me. In my eyes, if you REALLY love someone, you don't WANT to run out and date others if you already have feelings for someone else. It's not fair to you or them (the others you would date). Which only leads me to two ideas, neither good on your part: either you did love me but your love changes so quickly and is so temporary it's not even close to trustworthy and being considered for anything requiring time and committment such as marriage OR you came here and realized you didn't really love me romantically as you thought you did and that is why you were able to move on so soon, in which case you should have been completely honest with me. So even though we weren't together, I felt as though how you acted afterwards said a LOT about how you really felt or feel about me.
I will say now, I do want to continue our friendship- but for a while, do not want to speak on the phone to you. Not until we discuss this all through email first. It's just easier for me to talk this way where I can be honest but also think things through first.
Also, when you tell me you can't handle a relationship at the moment and all that especially long distance, and then end up, just a while later- a few months to a year, going out with (or trying to) Mary Beth, Shannon, and Becca (those are all I remember that I can directly relate to this situation)- it makes me think that obviously THEY have something that makes giving it a shot with them worth it, regardless of what you previously thought or said. Obviously something between you and them makes it WORTH IT, and apparently WE don't have that. And if WE don't have what it takes to make it worth TRYING to make it through anything than why the hell do WE keep going back to each other?! Bringing me to my next point:
With how often we go through this cycle of romance and love and then oops, you've moved on- did you ever REALLY love me? Or do you simply like being a boyfriend, in a relationship, and for whatever reason, I'm the idiot girl that got suckered in the most, so when you need a relationship or something as close as can get, I still am not "over" you and therefore let you pull me back in. Am I just fulfilling your need for a relationship as needed but you never truly love me? Am I just the most gullible, idiotic girl of all you've dated and that's why we keep ending up together? Especially with what I mentioned above?! I'm worth it for when you need a relationship of some kind but apparently not worth it enough to make you WANT to try and last through time or distance...but other, recent, newfound crushes are. You always make it seem like I'm the one and only for you- Until a few months later when the next cute thing walks by.
Now, after you being with Becca, when I think of you saying "I'm not ready" what I HEAR is "I'm not ready to be with YOU." In which case- you should either be honest and come out and say it if that's what you meant or you should mean what you say. If you're not ready for a relationship- you're not ready. But that's your choice. I'm just saying, that's what I hear now when I think of that because of the current circumstances, and if that (not being ready for me) is/was the case- don't lead me on, come out and say it. Making me feel that way without saying it isn't ANY better. And after what you told me about you in High School- you know, never being the one to "dump" the girl so YOU would look good (which by the way I still think was highly juvenile, ridiculous, and egotistical of you) but turning it around so she'd dump you- I don't know what I should believe? How do I know if the above is true you'd even come out and say it or would you try to turn it around somehow to make it seem like I'm the one who's not ready or couldn't handle it and THAT's why you said it or something?? So basically twist it and say you were saying it for my benefit, in which case I'm a big girl- all you need to do is be honest, not be my keeper. Can I even trust you after everything you've done or not done in the romance department? No matter what you tell me, as friends or otherwise, I don't even know if it's worth trusting at this point.
I want to stay friends, I want to have hope. But have we passed that point? Are we so emotionally intertwined that we can't be "just friends?" This is where I'm really at a loss. I'm angry and distrusting of you romantically, but doesn't that in many ways affect the friendship? So then what? Do we just not talk and take a break from it ALL at the risk of losing the friendship we're only now getting a chance to develop? Or do we do the best we can to seperate it, even if the effort is obviously in vain. Because we can never fully hide or erase out of the picture the other emotions we feel whether love, hate, distrust, whatever. They're always a part of the bigger picture of us even if we try to seperate the Love from Friends. I honestly do not know.
I also worry that with how things have happened, if you might have joined the church for Becca, or that you may have decided to just "take a leap of faith" without ANYTHING backing it up- any real feeling, strong or not, or any thoughts of "This has to be the right one" even without a feeling behind it...I wonder if you took the leap of faith even if hoping something later would follow and let you know it is right...I wonder if you initially took it so that you'd have a shot with Becca. You say you "accept" the church but don't neccisarily believe it. That's not enough. If you really even understood what this church is, what WE believe it is, it would be impossible to "accept" without "believing." Or maybe you just haven't clarified on something so I'm confused here...but this is what I feel based on what I've heard. Does Becca know how nonchalant you seem to be about the church at this time? Is that what SHE wants? Is that fair to her? At this point, in all honesty, it's not even enough for me...but it raised the bar of HOPE and therefore emotions. Better this than nothing, because this is a start, although I suppose at this point that doens't matter anyhow. Maybe that's how she feels too. Or would, if she knew.
I have no idea on what you HONESTLY see, want or hope for us in ANY future time. If there's hope, if there's not. If there is hope, if you're waiting to see certain things out of me. If not, be freakin HONEST with me. I don't play your games. I'm done with that. I know that especially after this latest chapter, I am definetly needing to see things from you before you even think about "opening the door" to us again. Words, as usual, are too easy to say for you, but the actions that back them up have once more, not followed. So I know before we're even a real shot again, if that's even what you still see in the future, there are things I need to see- in a few areas- from you. Are you waiting to see certain things from me before you'd see it as "worth it?" Or, no matter what were to happen is this just never going to be "worth" overcoming distance or us not feeling ready for anything? And again, if it never will be, but others sometimes are, WHY are we still playing this game, almost a decade later? Yeah really- we're in our 9th year. If you do see it as being "worth it" eventually, what needs to change? Do you need to see something(s) out of me first? If so, what? I'm not saying it would happen immediately, nothing can change overnight, but it would be a start to see where we stand. And if you want I could honestly tell you what I'd need to see out of you- only if you're sure you want to know.
I've also decided that at this point, no matter HOW you respond, I am not going to once more, try to "actively" get over you. If it happens on it's own (LOL! as if!) great, wonderful. If not, I'm not going to try- I'll focus on myself, I'll still date around if chances come up and all that, but I won't actively try. Because honestly, no matter what you were to tell me, I wouldn't believe this is really over for good yet. Because every other time in the past we've been CERTAIN it's over, it hasn't been, and in my eyes right now, I don't think it ever will be. And in order to truly get over you as best I can, it requires me to shut myself off nearly completely from you, not caring, almost being cold and completely apathetic. Focusing on your faults and why it won't work, why I should move on, etc. And when I do that, it's so hard getting over that and opening up again later, when we want to, and it's all just too emotionally taxing- both getting over you and opening back up to the possibilities. It takes too much effort, for too long for something that only MOSTLY works, only to ALWAYS having to be unearthed or buried again a couple years later. It's not worth it to me, so I won't bother. That doesn't change the fact that before I'll ACT on or agree with you acting on those feelings in any way shape or form I need to see certain things from you and do certain things for myself. That doesn't mean I'm just sitting here waiting to either run back to you or expecting you to run back to me anytime soon (although based on the past, one or the other will try to happen eventually- it's the cycle we go through) but just that no matter what happens, the feelings will be there unless they just naturally go away with time. I'm just letting you know...
Please do not call again until you have responded in email to this letter in full and we've come to some form of conclusion.
Love, Ericka
Now I just wait for his response...