Politeness

[timwi]

If someone tells me that something I did, said, or wrote is impolite, rude, or in any other way objectionable, surely they do so in order to pressure me into "bettering myself", which essentially means to behave in a way they prefer. Logically, it is therefore actually their problem if they get worked up over something I do, say, or write, because

Comments

[pthalogreen]

I both agree and disagree

[timwi]

When someone says that something you're doing is rude or objectionable or whatever, what they mean is that they are offended by something you have done, or possibly that they are hurt by something that you have done. Then the ball is in your court as to what to do with that information. You decide whether the other person's feelings and comfort is more important than the thing that they said was rude, and if so, you modify the behaviour around them as a courtesy, or you decide that the behaviour is more important to you, and you don't modify your behaviour, but don't surprise if the cost of that is alienating the other person.See, you're making the same mistake that the person who triggered this did. You are assuming that you can just say "This was rude" and that I will know precisely what you are talking about and precisely what particular behaviour needs to be modified to be seen as less rude by you. Then, if some other future behaviour evokes the same annoyance in you, your next assumption is that I must be doing it deliberately,

[pthalogreen]

If I or someone else is unclear when we say "this is rude", you have every right to ask for clarification about what specifically went wrong. A good way to go about it is saying that you didn't mean to offend them and you appologise, and could they please tell you what specifically they found offensive so you can know for future reference. Then the ball is back in your court. If they say "farting at the table is rude", then you know where they're coming from. But if they just say "hey, that's rude", then you don't know, and trying to guess may well make the matter worse if you guess wrong

[pthalogreen]

You shouldn't have to spend hours tailoring your e-mails and making sure you avoid every possible offense, but if you frequently get feedback that your words are coming across in a way that you didn't intend them to, and you get that feedback from several different sources, and especially if many sources say the same thing, it might be something to look into, from a linguistic stand point. There might be something in the subtext of your statements that you aren't aware of. If it's just one person reading too much into things, that is their problem, but it's still your problem to the extent that it's going to affect your relationship with them until you talk things through.

[timwi]

Okay, so let's take this "Don't you want to take a shower?" example. Suppose I am Hungarian and I say this to an English speaker. Then the English speaker gets all offended and stuff. After he cools down, he explains to me that the connotation of that sentence was "You stink

[pthalogreen]

It isn't fair, you're right. People expect other people to read their minds all the time, and most of the time it isn't justified. If I've told you I don't like being tickled and you tickle me anyway, I'll likely get upset, even if you likely just forget. But after we talk it over and I realise that you didn't mean to upset me, I'll calm down. But if you were close friends with someone and they were staying at your house for a few days and you said "hon, take a shower. you stink" they would think you were being honest, not rude. And it's polite to tell someone you're close to like that, rather than letting them go out on a date smelling like they haven't showered in three days. That's the problem: the rules are very intricate, every situation is different, and generalisations are almost impossible