Lots of thinky thoughts

[theron09]

Hey guys :)

Well, I've got another day of revising ahead of me but I don't even mind because it'll all be over for a while by lunch time tomorrow! I'm actually still feeling quite confident about this exam which is strange because I'm usually feeling nervous by this point. I don't know, I just feel like this exam is much easier than the one I did

Comments

[melodious329]

I don't exactly watch shows and 'ship' persons, I ship as in I like to read fics about how to get together two characters I find hot and interesting. But even in the first episode when Eliot was speaking to Nate over the pool table and Nate brushes him off with 'we're not friends'. Thou protesteth too much, lol. Eliot seems the second in command and they obviously have chemistry and care for one another.

I do write some Nate/Eliot, you can check my master fic list. Also http://community.livejournal.com/kink_bigbang/15131.html
http://community.livejournal.com/leveragexchange/19868.html
http://community.livejournal.com/leveragexchange/17822.html
http://moonchildfic.livejournal.com/9380.html
There was another one but I can't seem to find it now

As to Sam and Dean, I've only seen through season four, and again though I have written and read Wincest, I don't necessarily watch it and see that. Was Sam selfish? His leaving isn't necessarily the part that I found selfish. To me SPN is (or at least was) about American culture and morality and it represented to me the modern feeling that we have a responsibility to ourselves, that we deserve to be happy, etc. Is Sam selfish, oh yeah. I haven't seen the episode with Sam and heaven, but the fact that he didn't see his family there showcases how he views them for sure and isn't unexpected. When I write them, I do think that it has to start from that place, from Sam taking them for granted or not *wanting* them and then I try to teach him better.

[theron09]

Yeah, I rewatched the first episode the other day and I definitely saw the chemistry there - for Eliot to actually reach out and try to talk to Nate was a huge thing, whether it's for them as a pairing or them as friends/part of a team.

Thanks so much for the links! I'm definitely going to check them out tomorrow once I've done my last exam.

I personally don't think Sam's leaving was selfish, although I can see why Dean and John as characters might think that.

I think that way of writing Sam is really interesting - it makes the heaven episode make more sense, the idea that maybe it's not that he doesn't care or whatever, just that he takes what he actually has/had for granted.

[melodious329]

Eliot also falls in a strange realm between the adults and kids.

Wow recently my new friends have restarted some conversations about SPN. It's been a long time since I actually talked or thought about them.

I don't think it's so much that Dean and John fel the action was selfish, just as I don't think that particular action was selfish. In a family, it's a pattern of behavior. That choice didn't occur in a vaccuum and we the viewer eventually see enough that we re-interpret his decisions based on other episodes. When we first see the characters, Sam is the on paper good guy and Dean isn't and the show challenges those assumptions, challenges our American viewpoint of whether cockiness and sleeping around, etc are enough to condemn a person. By making Sam the vessel of Lucifer, they're suggesting a lot of things that the fans interpret in many different ways by their loyalties

It's just complicated as a family. It's not that Sam doesn't love his family in some way, he just doesn't see them as part of his happiness, he doesn't *choose* them.

[theron09]

Yeah, that's true about Eliot.

I really like your interpretations of the show - the ideas about challenging the viewpoints makes a lot of sense when I think about the show.

I think the whole history and dynamics of the family are interesting - I'd love to see the show explore it even more. I think there's a lot of room to expand on Sam's motives for leaving etc.

[melodious329]

Yeah, I think I ship Nate/Eliot more than Eliot/Hardison because I like to have Christian Kane bottom, lol, and Nate is above Eliot and Hardison is below Eliot. Then again, I still read Eliot/Hardison (with or without Parker) because I do think that of them all, Hardison and Nate have the most normal psychology.

Haha, I remember the beginning of SPN with the Impala and the classic rock adn the American diners and it's just about the American experience for me. I love a supernatural show where the monsters are really archetypes of us as people.

Well, again I haven't seen all the recent episodes, but I think that any opportunity for the show's writers to really tap into that was back in the first three seasons, which is why I'm stuck back there, lol. This is great, I'm actually rereading some of my SPN fics wondering how I did handle it, lol

[theron09]

Yeah, I didn't really get Nate/Eliot until yesterday but I can really understand it now. I think, with Leverage, there are so many ships that work.

Those early seasons were great, although I still like the later seasons, too. I do think the American experience is important, though, and that's part of what drew me to the show in the first place, aside from it being about family and the mythology etc.

Yeah, I think you're probably right, unless the show goes in another different direction again.

Haha, I love discussing things like this.

[melodious329]

There are a lot of Nate/Eliot moments that feel more significant to me, but I can't think of any now. An Eliot/Hardison moment is usually more humorous. There is a Nate/Eliot comm where there is a lot of squeeing over the episodes too so you should check it out.

[theron09]

Ah, I'll definitely check out that community - I'm already a member of the Eliot/Hardison one so it'll be good to have both.