The most hated Russian

[luvdovz]

The whole (liberal) (Western) world worships him as the father of Perestroika, a person who hugely contributed for the fall of the Iron Curtain (Tear down that wall, Mr Gorbachev!)... But in Russia itself, Gorbachev is probably the most hated man. And is regularly a recipient of tons of verbal abuse. And no surprise, he's often erroneously declared

Comments

[dwer]

I can't imagine the chaos that would have happened had the USSR collapsed under another hard-line reactionary, rather than what happened with Gorbachev. I wonder if the wars would be over by now.

[papasha_mueller]

First, what exactly do you mean by saying 'another hardliner', may I ask you? Gorbachev wasn't one.
Next, the fact that it was HIM whom the collapse of USSR has to be attributed to, ruins the logic of your statement.

[dexeron]

I think he means a hard-line reactionary as contrasted with Gorby.

I don't know if I'd attribute the collapse to him. It happened under his watch, but the seeds of it were planted long before he took the reins.

[papasha_mueller]

Hard-line one?
Such as?
Trotsky?
Can't imagine myself such an animal.

[abomvubuso]

You seriously can't think of a single hard-liner in Soviet history?

Hell, it doesn't take too much digging even through the more recent history.

What's the real problem here? Is it the word 'another' or the word 'hard-liner', or is it just that you don't have any valid criticism to what's being said?

[papasha_mueller]

The coup against Gorbachev was staged by his former allies and friends, called Politbureau.
They're hardly hardliners.
A link to another (master)piece of bullshit from BBC doesn't help.

[abomvubuso]

The fact that they were members of the Politbureau doesn't prevent many of them from being hardliners. In fact it only enhances their chance that they were.

Sure, anything you disagree with is bullshit. Especially when you haven't even bothered to read the article that you're criticising.

[papasha_mueller]

Politbureau was more, I guess, or less balanced. Probably like Obama's administration.

PS. It's not my agreement or disagreement that makes BBC's output a bullshit.

[underlankers]

Stalin, Kaganovich, Dzherzhinzky, Yagoda, Yezhov, Beria, Molotov, Brezhnev, Chernenko.....

[papasha_mueller]

Quite a Caesar salad you give me.

[underlankers]

I presume you're not going to claim the leaders of the Cheka, OGPU, and NKVD weren't hardliners?

[papasha_mueller]

Well, yes and no. That is not to say that CIA, FBI, NSA, etc CEOs are fluffy and cuddly.
'Noblesse oblige' and so on.

[underlankers]

The only organization on that list that's comparable is the FBI, and then only approximately. The Soviet secret police was the most hardline, vicious element of the Soviet state. It was from the start and would be so for the entirety of the Soviet Empire's existence.

[papasha_mueller]

That's exactly what I love internet for. I have had to live my life thru in the country and at the time in question to get someone from the outside to tell me what it really was.

Which issue of 'Reader's Digest' was on it?

[dwer]

Another hardliner like those before Gorbachev. I disagree that the collapse of the Soviet Union should be attributed to Gorbachev; he simply had to ride the avalanche and try to control it. The country was already falling apart.

[papasha_mueller]

Hmmm, For about 20 years before Gorbatschow there was NO hardliner.
You didn't mean Peter the Great or Ivan the terrible, did you?