This is what democracy looks like?

[kayjayuu]

In the last two weeks, we have been treated to the way in which the two major parties conduct their own personal affairs, among people with whom they usually agree and whose support they need/want/seek out/spend millions of dollars on. This has meant the public has been exposed to the whole sausage-making process, especially thanks to social media

Comments

[underlankers]

This is the old democracy you're saying we should go back to:



The reality, too, is that Israel is not a US state and I don't give a fuck about Israel's claim to Jerusalem any more than I do about the PLO's. Neither has a legal claim to it, it's legally UN territory, off limits to both. That nobody in the region respects this has more to do with the fragility of International Law. Israel's capital is Tel-Aviv, Palestine's should be Nablus (assuming Israelis have the intellectual and moral ability to create a real Palestine instead of replacing the Apaches-er the Palestinians with civilization und Lebensraum vor das Volksgemeinschaft Israeli settlers. So why the Hell should it matter to the USA, or to US Jews, what the capital of Israel is? If US Jews want to live in Israel, they can go Aaliyah. The USA is the USA. Period.

[a_new_machine]

it's legally UN territory

I've never heard this before. Any sources?

[telemann]

http://www.un.org/Depts/dpi/palestine/ch12.pdf

[a_new_machine]

Eh, given the consensus basis of international law, I dunno that a UN resolution that's heavily protested and effectively not the case can really be called "legal." But that's a different question. Thanks for the source.

[telemann]

Yep.

[underlankers]

And here's a map of the Corpus Separatum concept.

http://domino.un.org/unispal.nsf/cf02d057b04d356385256ddb006dc02f/3f1bd9477022a0c285256cc500530c1f/Body/0.3E6!OpenElement&FieldElemFormat=gif

I'd argue that UN resolutions are the only law standing right now unless we abolish the UN and replace it with something else. But I repeat that I don't see Palestinians with any greater claim than the Israelis to Jerusalem using the same standard for both, so at least it's a consistent approach. And yes, this would mean that nobody in the region by now has clean hands with UN resolutions.

[yes_justice]

There is the law of the gun and land, that is all too clear.

[underlankers]

It's in the original partition plan of 1947. Israel was to be smaller, but neither Israel nor Palestine were allowed control of Jerusalem. This is a reason that while I favor the Palestinian cause I don't see them as having any greater a claim to Jerusalem than Israel does. Because again neither of them do. I'll have a citation when Google will come up on my laptop.

[kayjayuu]

This is the old democracy you're saying we should go back to:

O.... kay.

By... abiding by... Robert's Rules of Order and... counting votes correctly. Got it.

Sometimes I don't know what planet you are reading my posts on.

[underlankers]

I'm noting that the last time conventions meant something was that timeframe. Conventions have been showboating wastes of time for decades at this point, worrying about what does or doesn't happen with them is a waste of time.

[kayjayuu]

And I'm noting, by the bolding in the quote, that it's not about the content for me, it's about the process. The public process, being broadcast in public, where people in charge blatantly override the wishes of the people they are purportedly courting. Or at least paying a lot of money to feed.

If conventions are showboating to their followers, they R doin' it rong.