Continuation of a Debate
Over at this site, I got into a religious debate with a few posters, mainly a poster named Nicole. Here are some more of my responses:
“Yeah, that is true as well since Christians are supposed to be representatives. This is especially true for those of no understanding of God or Christianity.”
So what are you saying? Because I understand things differently, I have no understanding of God? Or that because I understand Christianity too well, and disagree with a good bit of it, I have no understanding of God?
First let me say that what by the latter part is that it's especially true that Christians should be representatives of the Kingdom of God for the benefit of those who either don't believe or don't understand. Now to your question. Based on much of what you have said, you don't understand actual Christianity or who God is (based on the Bible). Your god is Nature, my God is the creator of all things, alpha and omega, my provider, etc, etc, (check out this site).
I would be insulted if I was deluded enough to think that any human could have any real understanding of God.
You're right, no one can truely understand God's ways, but with the help of the Bible and church sermons that I attend, I can have an idea.....For example, it has been taught in church that when something bad happens to you, it's because you have done something wrong.....when it's not that at all most of the time. Sometimes it's because there's a lesson to be learned, to prepare us for our destiny, and to persuade and show us the glory of God and who He is - to test our faith in Him, just to name a few.
The conversation is going somewhere. It’s just not going the direction you feel it should go, so you’re saying it’s not going anywhere. Where it’s going is that you’re trying to convince me that I have no understanding of the Bible, and bonus, somehow less understanding of God than your thought police.
Actually, it was simply getting tiring. But now it's a new day and I've been rejuvinated ;) And anyway, that Bible advises Christians to not even have debates with nonbelievers. We should simply evangelize (to announce good news - 1st Corinthians 15:1-4), live with our "faith on display", and be walking testimonies to His goodness and mercy. of course if someone asks you questions, then it's ok to respond.
I don’t read something I disagree with and then try to make it mean what I want or whatever the dogma du jour is.
That's not how it should be done anyway. There's more that goes into studying the Bible than just reading it. There's prayer, meditation, and even research.
Renee asks, “How can he be a representative if he doesn’t believe in God?”
Does your husband need to believe in God in order for God to exist? Is he any less a child of the same God you believe yourself to be, because he does not believe?
Absolutely not (how did you even come up with that). It's just that he's not a representative if he doesn't believe in who he should represent. And we're all children of God, but only those who believe in Him and that Jesus Christ died for our sins and rose again (1st Corinthians 15:1-4) are "joint heirs to Christ".
According to the Bible, we are all created in God’s image.
And?
If your husband is a Machiguenga shaman dancing around a fire naked except for body paint, you should be the one who carefully made each and every jaguar like spot along his golden shoulders…and joyfully so.
I agree. But you should pray for him also. This site touches on the subject.
I said, “Yes it is, if your husband and the bishop disagree.”
Renee says, “I don’t doubt this happens. In the end, a wife should follow God. That doesn’t mean putting the bishop first. You’re only following what was preach (which reaffirms teachings in the Bible), which came from God.”
What came from your god, or at least those you choose to prop up as speaking for him, is that you follow God by obedience to your husband.
Yes, I never disputed that. I just said that at the same time you stand by and follow God and His Word.
I said, “Not just that. It says you must be subject to him. That means that you obey and serve him regardless of whether or not be believes in God, and even if he calls God Allah, or even Damballah.”
Renee says, “Yes, but you hold on to your own belief in God and pray for for your husband, that’s all YOU can do.”
I’m glad you’re finally clear on that.
I've been saying that all along.
If…and if you converted to Christianity and he didn’t?
Pray for him.
A righteous Muslim follows the same God as a righteous Christian. They’re just from different social backgrounds.
That means squat. They are not the same god or even the same beliefs. The only path is Jesus Christ and God. And if you don't agree with that, then agree to disagree. You go your way, and I'll go mine.
It speaks of tragedies and disasters, and recovering from them. It says that a godly man gets up again, and ungodly people don’t.
Bonus, it’s from the old testament, so for sure it’s not talking about repentance in Christian terms.
Perhaps it can mean that too. There are many passages where you can read it one time and see it one way, and read it a second time, and interpret it in a whole new way. Each relevant for whatever you're going through. And as far as I know, repentance strictly speaking wasn't only found in the New Testament.
She continues, “But it’s important that their ready to change or do something about their situation. God only helps those who help themselves. We have to take the first step. Of course as humans (because Christians are humans too) fall back to our old ways, and screw up.”
That would be impossible if you were truly a born again new creature, or whatever they’re calling it now. I’m a little behind the fads since my parents went roots.
No it's not. We're human and humans make mistakes, many times BIG mistakes. People all the time get saved and fall back to old ways (I should know). Hence the term "rededication" to Christ, or to rededicate you life to Christ.
Final thoughts:
Anybody can be religious, but it takes much to be a believer.
Christianity has NOTHING to do with social convenience , far from it (it's not even of the "world"). Anyway, being a Christian and walking a path of faith is HARD lol.
There are other comments you posted, but I'm going to leave those alone, because you basically disagree with the foundation of Christianity and who God and what the Bible are. So there's no point in responding to those comments. We just have differing opinions and that's fine.
“Yeah, that is true as well since Christians are supposed to be representatives. This is especially true for those of no understanding of God or Christianity.”
So what are you saying? Because I understand things differently, I have no understanding of God? Or that because I understand Christianity too well, and disagree with a good bit of it, I have no understanding of God?
First let me say that what by the latter part is that it's especially true that Christians should be representatives of the Kingdom of God for the benefit of those who either don't believe or don't understand. Now to your question. Based on much of what you have said, you don't understand actual Christianity or who God is (based on the Bible). Your god is Nature, my God is the creator of all things, alpha and omega, my provider, etc, etc, (check out this site).
I would be insulted if I was deluded enough to think that any human could have any real understanding of God.
You're right, no one can truely understand God's ways, but with the help of the Bible and church sermons that I attend, I can have an idea.....For example, it has been taught in church that when something bad happens to you, it's because you have done something wrong.....when it's not that at all most of the time. Sometimes it's because there's a lesson to be learned, to prepare us for our destiny, and to persuade and show us the glory of God and who He is - to test our faith in Him, just to name a few.
The conversation is going somewhere. It’s just not going the direction you feel it should go, so you’re saying it’s not going anywhere. Where it’s going is that you’re trying to convince me that I have no understanding of the Bible, and bonus, somehow less understanding of God than your thought police.
Actually, it was simply getting tiring. But now it's a new day and I've been rejuvinated ;) And anyway, that Bible advises Christians to not even have debates with nonbelievers. We should simply evangelize (to announce good news - 1st Corinthians 15:1-4), live with our "faith on display", and be walking testimonies to His goodness and mercy. of course if someone asks you questions, then it's ok to respond.
I don’t read something I disagree with and then try to make it mean what I want or whatever the dogma du jour is.
That's not how it should be done anyway. There's more that goes into studying the Bible than just reading it. There's prayer, meditation, and even research.
Renee asks, “How can he be a representative if he doesn’t believe in God?”
Does your husband need to believe in God in order for God to exist? Is he any less a child of the same God you believe yourself to be, because he does not believe?
Absolutely not (how did you even come up with that). It's just that he's not a representative if he doesn't believe in who he should represent. And we're all children of God, but only those who believe in Him and that Jesus Christ died for our sins and rose again (1st Corinthians 15:1-4) are "joint heirs to Christ".
According to the Bible, we are all created in God’s image.
And?
If your husband is a Machiguenga shaman dancing around a fire naked except for body paint, you should be the one who carefully made each and every jaguar like spot along his golden shoulders…and joyfully so.
I agree. But you should pray for him also. This site touches on the subject.
I said, “Yes it is, if your husband and the bishop disagree.”
Renee says, “I don’t doubt this happens. In the end, a wife should follow God. That doesn’t mean putting the bishop first. You’re only following what was preach (which reaffirms teachings in the Bible), which came from God.”
What came from your god, or at least those you choose to prop up as speaking for him, is that you follow God by obedience to your husband.
Yes, I never disputed that. I just said that at the same time you stand by and follow God and His Word.
I said, “Not just that. It says you must be subject to him. That means that you obey and serve him regardless of whether or not be believes in God, and even if he calls God Allah, or even Damballah.”
Renee says, “Yes, but you hold on to your own belief in God and pray for for your husband, that’s all YOU can do.”
I’m glad you’re finally clear on that.
I've been saying that all along.
If…and if you converted to Christianity and he didn’t?
Pray for him.
A righteous Muslim follows the same God as a righteous Christian. They’re just from different social backgrounds.
That means squat. They are not the same god or even the same beliefs. The only path is Jesus Christ and God. And if you don't agree with that, then agree to disagree. You go your way, and I'll go mine.
It speaks of tragedies and disasters, and recovering from them. It says that a godly man gets up again, and ungodly people don’t.
Bonus, it’s from the old testament, so for sure it’s not talking about repentance in Christian terms.
Perhaps it can mean that too. There are many passages where you can read it one time and see it one way, and read it a second time, and interpret it in a whole new way. Each relevant for whatever you're going through. And as far as I know, repentance strictly speaking wasn't only found in the New Testament.
She continues, “But it’s important that their ready to change or do something about their situation. God only helps those who help themselves. We have to take the first step. Of course as humans (because Christians are humans too) fall back to our old ways, and screw up.”
That would be impossible if you were truly a born again new creature, or whatever they’re calling it now. I’m a little behind the fads since my parents went roots.
No it's not. We're human and humans make mistakes, many times BIG mistakes. People all the time get saved and fall back to old ways (I should know). Hence the term "rededication" to Christ, or to rededicate you life to Christ.
Final thoughts:
Anybody can be religious, but it takes much to be a believer.
Christianity has NOTHING to do with social convenience , far from it (it's not even of the "world"). Anyway, being a Christian and walking a path of faith is HARD lol.
There are other comments you posted, but I'm going to leave those alone, because you basically disagree with the foundation of Christianity and who God and what the Bible are. So there's no point in responding to those comments. We just have differing opinions and that's fine.