'you are forgiven. always and completely'

Oct 07, 2011 06:25

The triumph of intellect and romance....Thank you, Steven Moffat ( Read more... )

eleven, steven moffat, doctor who, amy pond, rory williams, river song

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subtle1science October 7 2011, 22:31:04 UTC
AMEN!

It was an amazing reclamation of the Doctor's character, after what was inflicted on it by Rusty in, particularly, Tennant's final episodes.

River taught the Doctor that he is/was loved: she doesn't just save him by giving him her regenerations--she saves him by loving him and reminding of what it is about him that is lovable. She restores the merry, irrepressible time traveler.

He, in turn, saves her. All the traits that make up River are in Mels, but warped. Eleven can see the potential for the River he loves, even in his "bespoke" murderer; his insistence upon her real nature--his inability to regard her as anyone other than River--ends up bringing out that person.

I can't imagine not loving this series, and this ending. It's all been about the strength that can be drawn from love, the joy it can give, its redemptive powers....I can't get how anyone could find something wrong about it, any more than I can comprehend those who find something tainted about Snape's "Always" devotion to Lily. It's all about the best in people and why that matters.

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suo_gan October 8 2011, 18:33:17 UTC
If I recall correctly, there was mention of a woman saving the Doctor's soul which, as it turns out, is River. I guess that gets up people's noses because they find it demeaning for River. But River is a Force. She is able to fight her way out of her life suit as a child, and as an adult, she is able to counter her earlier brainwashing. To say that she is merely an adjunct to the Doctor, a character who is dismissed because she gives up her lives for him is, in reality, insulting to a character who makes her own choices, always. In fact, I find remarks like that sexist not only towards her character, but to Moffat who's written some strong female characters in this series, as well as men like Craig who aren't afraid to show their tender sides.

River saves his soul, and as you say, he saves hers by telling Mels he loves River, which is what I think the Doctor whispered, and letting Mels see whom she becomes. It changes her - maybe not the risktaker, or the assassin River, but it makes what should have been present in the infant daughter of the Ponds and was strangled, grow. It's mutual, just as it was mutual when she saved his life and he went on to 'save' hers, and reveal once more, the tenderness that is within her.

I don't think it's an accident that the last we ever see of River is in the flowing, goddesslike gown in her virtual world. It's a stunning visual counter to the Silent uniform she wore, a reminder that she is tender and loving, and that part of her love is sacrificial, just as the Doctor's always was; that is, before"I don't want to go".

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subtle1science October 8 2011, 19:39:54 UTC
It seems to me that River becomes rather like her father....As Rory is Amy's anchor, her grounder--that's River for the Doctor. The Doctor and Amy are a lot alike: fast thinkers, fast actors....who occasionally need someone to pull them back, slow them down--and maybe bring them down to earth before they get a little too full of themselves.

Of course, it's not all one or the other. After all, as Amy tells Kovarian, River gets some of that ruthless fire from Amy. Like Mother, like Daughter.

Way back in "Time of the Angels," River's relationship with the Doctor was all spelled out in the exchange with Amy, when Amy wanted to know if River and the Doctor were married. River's question about whether Amy thought it could be that simple was met with an affirmative--which, in turn, River approved with a laugh. Because--it is that simple. Both River and the Doctor are complicated people, with complicated storylines. Yet, when it comes down to it, the relationship is nothing more and nothing less than: two people in love. Never mind all the timey-wimey, time-traveling alien, pre-progammed psychopath stuff. That's just plot.

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suo_gan October 9 2011, 03:01:21 UTC
River is a lot like Rory in an antithetical kind of way, if that makes sense. Rory is gentle, a healer, but love for Amy brings out the steel in him, makes him a hero, a lone centurion. River starts out all steel, someone who is turned into a psychopath by Kovarian, but is also changed by love to become fully actualized, a heroic woman and a loving woman.

Father and daughter are open to the kind of loyal, singleminded love that happens only rarely in a lifetime, and I shouldn't leave Amy out of the mix, but the matter of fact "I'm Amy, you're Rory" is iconic for their relationship, as is the number of times River has the Doctor's back, and his unconditional love, i.e. "You are always forgiven" is for theirs, the unspoken declarations of love.

Nothing ever can be simple for the Doctor or River, not with their capacity to explore time and space, and yet simplicity is distilled into their time together, nights when he visits her and takes her off somewhere for adventure and, I sincerely hope, romance. And they are married, but not in the typical white picket fence settling down together and picking out china patterns way, and that is complicated but not for them. I suspect two such personalities wouldn't have it any other way.

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subtle1science October 13 2011, 10:20:30 UTC
I loved the detail that AU Amy was looking for Rory; she couldn't see him, but she knew that he had to be with her, and vice versa. The detail of her drawing of him--going directly back to her comment in "The Girl Who Waited," that he was the most beautiful man....Then, suddenly, she 'sees' him--and all's well again, no matter what else is going on; because, even in a timeline that shouldn't exist, Amy and Rory must.

I'm so liking the idea that I can look forward to what's coming in the next episodes, in the upcoming seasons. I love that I can rewatch episodes and see more and more rich detail.

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suo_gan October 14 2011, 03:28:01 UTC
There's a lovely symmetry to this story in that it refers back to 'Let's Kill Hitler' in which Rory is crazy in love with Amy but can't bring himself to declare it, and she loves him as well but until she really sees him for the first time, she can't make that connection. Once they do, though - wow, does everything take off. They are meant for each other, clearly, and nothing, even death, can keep them apart.

The Doctor and River share the same kind of destiny, but with more complicating factors given their histories. But, when the Doctor tells River she is and always will be forgiven, he makes the most profound statement about love he's ever made throughout all his regenerations. He isn't forgiving as Ten did, because the Master is a Time Lord and he's lonely for his own kind. His forgiveness is born out of love, but it's unconditional, no strings, no holds barred love for another person that is God-like as opposed to Lonely God-like. And I think because he is so open to love by that point, he can accept the love of those million voices and in particular, River's love which is greater than all that. It's no coincidence, either, that Amy and Rory are witnesses to this as lovers, parents and people who love him deeply.

And this is why I love Moffat's stories so much: he loves lovers. More specifically, he respects his lovers, he doesn't tear them down or change their characters for a cheap plot point, and his characters emerged from the two series older, wiser but most certainly as much, if not more, in love than ever.

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subtle1science October 14 2011, 10:12:39 UTC
The thing that Moffat realizes is simple: most people are involved with other people--being in love is not some abnormal weakness, as portrayed in Rusty's scripts.

Moffat also explores the process of falling in love, even giving two versions of it with Amy/Rory and the Doctor/River. Being in love also doesn't mean endlessly perfect, idyllic bliss--Moffat's couples spar and squabble; they even get angry and shout. It all brings that touch of normalcy to the fantastic world into which the characters are set.

That's why Moffat's work is so engaging.

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