Not all drama is good drama.
Apropos to my last post. The following contains not fun drama. As in absolutely fucking ridiculous what the fuck.
I am cutting this so you are not subjected to retarded bullshittery. More for my own reference as I work through my own thoughts and make mincemeat of a situation gone quite stupid. You do not have to read if you do not want to subject yourself to a very stupid situation.
So, bimbomushi_fics posts a dub-con fic on yonkaka. I am curious so I decide to read it. It is a story from Minato's POV where he visits Kakashi and Rin in a hospital. Both students are staying in the same room, post Obito's death. Kakashi lead a team consisting of himself and Rin into a mission and Rin ends up hurt. Minato asks Kakashi, at one point, "What did you let them do to her?" and it is clear Kakashi is pretty distraught over the situation. He is emotionally and physically incapacitated, broken, even. It is heartbreaking to see. I think to myself that Minato is going to be very gentle with him. Instead, what happens is just the opposite. Minato is dominating and oppressive. Kakashi says little other than "Sensei" as Minato gives him orders.
At one point Kakashi asks him, "Are you going to punish me?" and in response, Minato asks him, "Do you feel you deserve punishing?" then proceeds to demonstrate that the punishment is, in fact, sexual. I am surprised and shocked but keep on reading, thinking that there must be a twist somewhere along the line. Maybe dubious consent is because the situation is going on in a room with Rin; in a hospital of all things. I am expecting hesitance and uncertainty from both parties. I am disappointed as a reader to not find any. Midway through the text, this happens:
“Sensei...” Kakashi freezes as Minato wraps his free hand around his penis and rubs the head against the boy’s mouth, and it is not a new desire, this need to see Kakashi’s lips stretched around his cock. Kakashi’s eye has closed again and two faint lines furrow his brow as he keeps his teeth shut, and Minato releases the boy’s wrists to press against Kakashi’s jaw. “Open your mouth.”
“Sensei,” Kakashi repeats, barely forming the syllables, and Minato takes the opportunity to slide his thumb between the chapped lips, the clot of blood at one corner threatening to break as he coaxes Kakashi’s mouth to accept his erection. Kakashi’s frown deepens and Minato pauses as blunt teeth scrape the underside of his cock. (emphasis mine)
Suddenly, I realize I am reading oral rape. This is not dubious consent. This is non-consensual. Minato forces Kakashi to take his penis into his mouth by forcing his lips apart. Kakashi does it quietly, and I realize that we are now in the realm of child sexual abuse. I am horrified. I do not know what to think. It is terribly triggering for me, as a survivor, and I cannot believe that this writer somehow thinks this isn't non-consensual. Kakashi is coerced into sexual acts. This is not what I had prepared myself for.
I am capable of reading non-consensual cases of sex and rape; it is commonly required in my line of academia. However, I am always prepared for it. I know it is coming. It is usually also not done so explicitly, so it is quite a different situation when I am analyzing a literary piece that deals with rape such as in much of Toni Morrison's work, or child sexual abuse as found in Lolita.
I stop thinking and collect my thoughts. I ask the writer if she really wants critique. She asks me to please not to be brutal. Then I try my best to be as kind as possible in my review. I write:
I'm not sure what you consider brutal.
But I will say this.
While your writing certainly held some merit and potential in terms of how you used imagery and rich description, the way you chose to execute it was... well...
Let's put it this way. You set up a scenario where an incapacitated child who is still clearly in the control of an adult had to submit sexually in a form of punishment. As someone who actually survived a situation like this, for Minato to have treated the situation the way he did with that kind of a powerplay was very, very triggering for me. Especially when he forces Kakashi's lips apart despite Kakashi's very obvious reluctance and shoves his cock in.
I would highly recommend that you put a warning up top that says possible trigger warning and non-consensual. I did not, for a moment, feel that Kakashi was in a position of equal power and choice. I felt he had no choice, and that this is ongoing abuse enacted by Minato. Kakashi acquiesces to many of the things that are happening, and at one point appears to want it, but there are so many things about the way you wrote it that doesn't make it feel consensual. It feels like Minato is completely in power, and Kakasahi must submit to him.
On a more literary note, the Obito references throughout that were used to justify and explain some of the "punishment" going on could perhaps be a little more subtle than how you have it here.
Also, there are some issues with punctuation and syntax. You use "students'" at times, when it should just be "students." At times you use plural words for something that should be singular. Namely, Kakashi's eyelids. One of his eyes are covered up, which means he has only one other eyelid.
For some reason, I really liked this line:
Minato rests warm, dry fingertips against the pulse point on her thin wrist and feels time eddy around them
I only partially quoted this because I think it's a pretty powerful, just like that.
Anyway, I think shota is something that should be treated with sensitivity, and it's really difficult to figure out where that line is. I'm sure many people would enjoy your fic, as many do enjoy reading things like non-consensual/rape fics, but usually those are labeled as such. ^^;;;
I know this was probably a little harsher than you would've liked, but I think it's better to be honest than to tell you everything is perfect when it really...isn't.
I considered this a rather objective comment. I am glad that I did this when the writer herself sends me a PM and says:
Hello,
I want to thank you again for your comments about my fic over at the YonKaka comm and to apologise for not having put thorough enough warnings, and for any discomfort the fic might thus have caused you.
I appreciate your pointing out about the use of "students'" (most of which was deliberate, referring to both Kakashi and Rin, but one of which was a typo) and about "eyelids" (which I had used to refer to the upper and lower lid of one eye, rather than meaning both eyes, but didn't realise isn't correct in the English language and that it should be just "eyelid").
Whilst Kakashi was supposed to be sixteen and the fic not shota (although it remains a fine line), this wasn't explicitly stated and was something I realise now I should have made more clear in the warnings. It was meant to be dubious consent, not noncon or rape, but as I avoided going into Kakashi's point of view (largely as I was following a prompt), I can see from your comments how this failed to come across. Also, I belatedly realised how things that are apparent in my head are not necessarily apparent to readers and can instead be interpreted differently.
I appreciate that the mentions of Obito were heavy handed and, although they were supposed to be to a certain extent, could have been dealt with better.
I've a long way to go in my writing. Thank you again for your criticism: I certainly wouldn't want anyone to pretend it is perfect. I've decided to remove the fic from the community, but it will still be available on my personal lj with clearer warnings, should anyone wish to read it.
Naturally, this is another case of where authorial intent conflicts with what the reader happens to understand. I realize that I should've maybe given her some more positive reinforcement because she's a little insecure with her writing, and feel a little bad that she chose to remove it.
Then, the next thing I know, the moderator of yonkaka sends me this:
Hi there. I'm Lene, the mod for YonKaka. Aside from approving your membership, I'm not sure we've interacted. Frankly, I don't recall ever seeing you comment before. It's not a crime to lurk, no worries. Most of the comm are quiet watchers, and we appreciate them as much as those who post.
Freedom of speech is respected on our comm, sure, but, I would like to ask why you chose what I think is your first comment on the comm to emotionally rip one of our best writers (I may be wrong, of course, if you've gone back and commented on older pieces, but you know what I mean).
In Mima's reply to your question of whether or not she was seeking critique, she asked you not to be brutal and assured you she has low self-esteem where her writing is concerned. You replied with an emotional diatribe that is completely irrelevant as far as proper critique and criticism are concerned. Emotion has no place in objective critique, and it honestly could be described as "freaking out," to use such a term.
The piece was properly labeled dubcon. I've read it, and it is definitely not noncon by community standards. This community is centered on a pairing in which one member is the Hokage, the most powerful ninja of the village, and the other is a teenage boy, canonically 13-15 years of age, though granted very powerful in his own right. There are noncon fics and dubcon fics, there is also fluff. What, exactly, did you expect?
You aren't the only member of the community with emotional/mental problems related to past trauma, sexual and otherwise. I don't feel sorry for you. No one is going to read your review and feel sorry for you (no one will now anyway because she removed the piece, feeling as though there was something wrong with it). You reacted like a spoiled child looking for attention for your trauma and triggers.
I don't apologize if that sounds harsh.
As "someone who actually survived a situation like this," it is YOUR responsibility to know your OWN triggers and avoid things that may set them off. Dubcon and noncon are two sides of the same coin, and the line between the two does NOT have a definition. It is NOT the writer's responsibility to ensure they second-guess every trigger you, specifically, might possibly have before posting. It is YOUR responsibility to understand the risk when you decide to read something labeled dubcon.
The rest of your review was a bit of praise for a line you liked and a complaint about apostrophes. Seriously? While more than one member of the comm is a professional writer by trade, we do not expect anyone to write professional grade *fan fiction.* This is supposed to be enjoyable, relaxing, fun for the writer.
Your final little paragraph that tries to make the rest of your review 'okay' and just 'honest' critique when it was anything but is also not appreciated, and honestly insulting, not just to Mima, but the entire comm.
I chose to respond here instead of on the thread because we do not feed drama in our community. It is not welcome in any form. As with any community, online or otherwise, I would suggest that you get a feel for the way we interact before commenting further.
Lene
Uh. What. Come again? How am I emotionally rippping into someone? Furthermore, how is my comment an emotional diatrabe? Even more so, what the hell, in her opinion, is a proper critique and criticism? How was I even freaking out? What boggles my mind is how on earth anyone can be insensitive as to not take into consideration the fact that I clearly did not know what I was getting into because the piece was properly mislabeled, and that I had to discover what it was I was reading, completely unprepared to read it, by the very act of reading. What resulted was a trigger, and had I been prepared for it, I would not have had that issue. The piece was not properly labeled. I asked for it to be labeled correctly. I explained my reasonings as to why it should have been and also made it clear to the writer that she should be more careful in the future (without explicitly saying it, and she did understand my implication). Did my comment really warrant a scathing PM like this?
Irritated, pissed, a little shocked. That's probably how I feel right now. And downright disappointed with people and their lack of sensitivity. I understand that bimbomushi_fics is a prolific YonKaka writer and is known for that. But if someone treats a work with casual disregard and does not correctly label a piece to inform the reader what they are reading and prepare them emotionally to deal with the subject, then they deserve the type of comment I gave. That is how I feel about it. Period.
I respond with this:
Hi Lene,
Thank you for taking the time to write to me.
However, I believe you must have misunderstood or misread. I thought it was quite clear from my review that the piece was absolutely not properly labeled. In fact, before I left my comment, there was NO LABEL on it whatsoever that would suggest the piece would be not only non-consensual but would imply explicit sexual child abuse. And yes, perhaps there is a difference to most people between "dubious consent" and "non-consent" but I fail to see the difference when there are situations in a piece that are explicitly forced. Namely, the oral sex that Kakashi was forced to perform.
I also do NOT see how an objective reading of what exactly was going on in the piece is emotional. I stated very clearly the scenario that was going on: a man who has power over a boy in a very sensitive situation not only takes advantage of the boy, but punishes him in a way that is explicitly sexual. I could not understand why the piece was not labeled as such and why the reader had to find out what kind of piece it was only by reading it.It was a very nasty surprise for me, quite frankly, and I stopped reading the moment I realized Kakashi didn't actually -want- to be performing oral sex.
Because of this, I suggested to the writer to label it accordingly.
In case you don't realize, survivors of child molestation and rape tend to avoid things like sensationalized rape or molestation (read: dubcon, noncon) because it causes triggers. Many of us have some form of PTSD due to our experience. If the piece had been properly labeled, I absolutely would not have read it. Do I find the exploration of a relationship between a boy between the ages of 13-15 and his teacher interesting? Absolutely. Do I find the sensationalization of child abuse interesting with an unwilling, scared child interesting? Absolutely not.
Furthermore, in the actual critique of her actual writing, which I intentionally softened because she asked me not to be brutal, I focused on grammatical and syntax mistakes, not on the fact that her use of a death theme was clearly overdone. Melodrama is not, in fact, a good literary device to use in such a small space with no proper elucidation of the theme. I could have told her that, but I chose to simply let her know that she had some typos and other punctuation issues that she could choose to fix. If I were her, I would want to know that there were grammatical issues in my work, and I do enjoy when my readers correct mistakes that I might have missed because I wasn't paying attention. Many of the writers that I associate with all have similar beliefs, so it was my understanding, that when someone ask not to be brutal, pointing out mistakes is a very basic form of critique.
I would like to clarify something: it appears from your message that YonKaka does not allow any kind of negative critique, and apparently we cannot even state our opinions or feelings on a matter in an honest and open way. Negative feelings must be framed diplomatically and tritely, and even if a story is absolutely horrible to the reader due to its execution, the reader should find some way to comment on it in a way that is somehow positive and reinforcing to the writer, regardless of how bad the reader may find the work. You can correct me if I am wrong, but should I approach future pieces with this in mind?
I have no problem censoring myself and playing sweet. But as someone who is an academic critic of English Literature, I am not used to mincing my words, but will do so if that is what is expected of me.
Needless to say, I am not sure if I should ever write a negative review again in the world of fanfiction. I write glowing and positive reviews when I see something that was clearly done well. But when a subject matter is treated badly, why on earth should I say glowing things about it when there is very little I find positive or good about it? How is that honest criticism? That was not the way I was trained as a critic to respond to a work, and though I say I would mince my words if that is what is expected of me, I really wonder if I should be giving up my integrity as a critic just to make people happy about a piece that I might find poorly written.
Anyway, if you have read all of this, I am very sorry that you actually spent the time to read this. It's just a bunch of bullshit and I just wanted to rant and get all of this negative and horrible energy out of me since I would like to write some more tonight and do not think I should be writing with those type of feelings and thoughts lingering within me.
And on a final note, that so was not my first comment on the comm. In fact, I had written a rather glowing comment to an earlier piece by idle_ramblingsx. So what the fuck.
Edit: After thinking more about it, I got seriously pissed. I mean, seriously. I did not deserve to be insulted like that. I sent her another message:
On another note, I would like to point you to http://community.livejournal.com/yonkaka/164959.html?thread=2648671#t2648671
That was one of my earliest interactions on the community.
After talking to a few people, I've decided to write you again because I am rather upset with the situation.
As a moderator, you should treat all your members without bias. I understand that bimbomushi_fics is a prolific YonKaka writer, but I am rather disappointed with how you chose to approach me. I am not an idiot. I am not a child. I do not comment with attention-seeking in mind. And I do not appreciate you coming to me in such a hostile way.
If you would like to mediate a situation, shouldn't you, as a moderator, approach things diplomatically without emotionally attacking someone? I find it terribly hypocritical that you would accuse me of emotionally ripping into someone when my comment was actually rather emotionless and very objective.
Furthermore, your lack of sensitivity apropos to me flat out saying that the piece was improperly label and thus, a trigger, is rather appalling.
Telling me what is or is not criticism is not only condescending but incredibly ironic. You assumed I do not know what criticism is and attempted to tell me such. I actually happen to -be- a literary critic. I make mincemeat of literary texts, specializing specifically in postmodern theoretical and literary -criticism-. I have the utmost confidence in my work when it comes to criticism. I know what I am doing. I do not appreciate someone telling me that I do not know what I am doing when I critique a text.
My critique of her piece is one that was very narrow. But a narrow criticism is not one that is improper; furthermore a narrow criticism objectively focusing on her improper treatment of the text as one that is dubcon when it is, in fact, noncon, is not an improper critique. It is not an emotional rip. It is very basic literary analysis.
I made an argument and supported my argument with critical interpretation of a text. My argument was simple: I did not know what I was getting into because the piece was properly mislabeled, and I had to discover what it was I was reading, completely emotionally unprepared to read it, by the very act of reading.
What resulted was a trigger, and had I been prepared for it, I would not have had that issue.
This occurred because the piece was not properly labeled.
I asked for it to be labeled correctly. I explained my reasonings through analyzing her work. The writer understood what I was saying. She did not misunderstand me, as you did.
Did my comment really warrant a scathing PM like this? Seriously?
If you would like me to leave your community, please let me know. If you would rather me only give positive reviews, I will do so. But after thinking about it, I absolutely will not sacrifice my integrity as a critic for the sake of making a writer happy. If a piece of writing is unsatisfactory and the treatment of a theme and its execution is something I do not enjoy, I believe I should be honest in my criticism. This is what criticism is all about, after all.
If you do not support freedom of speech when it comes to opinions in reference to someone else's work, that is perfectly acceptable. It is your community. You only need to make it clear in the rules what is and is not acceptable when it comes to reviews. Personally, I prefer honesty. That is how I, and many others, grow in writing.
I guarantee you that I will most likely, one day, explore the YonKaka dynamic in fic form. This is why I have joined the community; because I enjoy that dynamic and I want to read other work within that pairing by other writers, and also share my own.
So if I happen to have negative criticism in the future, I will simply abstain and hold my silence. If I see a piece that I feel is improperly labeled, I will contact you directly.
Anyway. That is that. I am done with the situation. Ugh. Time to wash this bad taste out of my mouth.
I am cutting this so you are not subjected to retarded bullshittery. More for my own reference as I work through my own thoughts and make mincemeat of a situation gone quite stupid. You do not have to read if you do not want to subject yourself to a very stupid situation.
So, bimbomushi_fics posts a dub-con fic on yonkaka. I am curious so I decide to read it. It is a story from Minato's POV where he visits Kakashi and Rin in a hospital. Both students are staying in the same room, post Obito's death. Kakashi lead a team consisting of himself and Rin into a mission and Rin ends up hurt. Minato asks Kakashi, at one point, "What did you let them do to her?" and it is clear Kakashi is pretty distraught over the situation. He is emotionally and physically incapacitated, broken, even. It is heartbreaking to see. I think to myself that Minato is going to be very gentle with him. Instead, what happens is just the opposite. Minato is dominating and oppressive. Kakashi says little other than "Sensei" as Minato gives him orders.
At one point Kakashi asks him, "Are you going to punish me?" and in response, Minato asks him, "Do you feel you deserve punishing?" then proceeds to demonstrate that the punishment is, in fact, sexual. I am surprised and shocked but keep on reading, thinking that there must be a twist somewhere along the line. Maybe dubious consent is because the situation is going on in a room with Rin; in a hospital of all things. I am expecting hesitance and uncertainty from both parties. I am disappointed as a reader to not find any. Midway through the text, this happens:
“Sensei...” Kakashi freezes as Minato wraps his free hand around his penis and rubs the head against the boy’s mouth, and it is not a new desire, this need to see Kakashi’s lips stretched around his cock. Kakashi’s eye has closed again and two faint lines furrow his brow as he keeps his teeth shut, and Minato releases the boy’s wrists to press against Kakashi’s jaw. “Open your mouth.”
“Sensei,” Kakashi repeats, barely forming the syllables, and Minato takes the opportunity to slide his thumb between the chapped lips, the clot of blood at one corner threatening to break as he coaxes Kakashi’s mouth to accept his erection. Kakashi’s frown deepens and Minato pauses as blunt teeth scrape the underside of his cock. (emphasis mine)
Suddenly, I realize I am reading oral rape. This is not dubious consent. This is non-consensual. Minato forces Kakashi to take his penis into his mouth by forcing his lips apart. Kakashi does it quietly, and I realize that we are now in the realm of child sexual abuse. I am horrified. I do not know what to think. It is terribly triggering for me, as a survivor, and I cannot believe that this writer somehow thinks this isn't non-consensual. Kakashi is coerced into sexual acts. This is not what I had prepared myself for.
I am capable of reading non-consensual cases of sex and rape; it is commonly required in my line of academia. However, I am always prepared for it. I know it is coming. It is usually also not done so explicitly, so it is quite a different situation when I am analyzing a literary piece that deals with rape such as in much of Toni Morrison's work, or child sexual abuse as found in Lolita.
I stop thinking and collect my thoughts. I ask the writer if she really wants critique. She asks me to please not to be brutal. Then I try my best to be as kind as possible in my review. I write:
I'm not sure what you consider brutal.
But I will say this.
While your writing certainly held some merit and potential in terms of how you used imagery and rich description, the way you chose to execute it was... well...
Let's put it this way. You set up a scenario where an incapacitated child who is still clearly in the control of an adult had to submit sexually in a form of punishment. As someone who actually survived a situation like this, for Minato to have treated the situation the way he did with that kind of a powerplay was very, very triggering for me. Especially when he forces Kakashi's lips apart despite Kakashi's very obvious reluctance and shoves his cock in.
I would highly recommend that you put a warning up top that says possible trigger warning and non-consensual. I did not, for a moment, feel that Kakashi was in a position of equal power and choice. I felt he had no choice, and that this is ongoing abuse enacted by Minato. Kakashi acquiesces to many of the things that are happening, and at one point appears to want it, but there are so many things about the way you wrote it that doesn't make it feel consensual. It feels like Minato is completely in power, and Kakasahi must submit to him.
On a more literary note, the Obito references throughout that were used to justify and explain some of the "punishment" going on could perhaps be a little more subtle than how you have it here.
Also, there are some issues with punctuation and syntax. You use "students'" at times, when it should just be "students." At times you use plural words for something that should be singular. Namely, Kakashi's eyelids. One of his eyes are covered up, which means he has only one other eyelid.
For some reason, I really liked this line:
Minato rests warm, dry fingertips against the pulse point on her thin wrist and feels time eddy around them
I only partially quoted this because I think it's a pretty powerful, just like that.
Anyway, I think shota is something that should be treated with sensitivity, and it's really difficult to figure out where that line is. I'm sure many people would enjoy your fic, as many do enjoy reading things like non-consensual/rape fics, but usually those are labeled as such. ^^;;;
I know this was probably a little harsher than you would've liked, but I think it's better to be honest than to tell you everything is perfect when it really...isn't.
I considered this a rather objective comment. I am glad that I did this when the writer herself sends me a PM and says:
Hello,
I want to thank you again for your comments about my fic over at the YonKaka comm and to apologise for not having put thorough enough warnings, and for any discomfort the fic might thus have caused you.
I appreciate your pointing out about the use of "students'" (most of which was deliberate, referring to both Kakashi and Rin, but one of which was a typo) and about "eyelids" (which I had used to refer to the upper and lower lid of one eye, rather than meaning both eyes, but didn't realise isn't correct in the English language and that it should be just "eyelid").
Whilst Kakashi was supposed to be sixteen and the fic not shota (although it remains a fine line), this wasn't explicitly stated and was something I realise now I should have made more clear in the warnings. It was meant to be dubious consent, not noncon or rape, but as I avoided going into Kakashi's point of view (largely as I was following a prompt), I can see from your comments how this failed to come across. Also, I belatedly realised how things that are apparent in my head are not necessarily apparent to readers and can instead be interpreted differently.
I appreciate that the mentions of Obito were heavy handed and, although they were supposed to be to a certain extent, could have been dealt with better.
I've a long way to go in my writing. Thank you again for your criticism: I certainly wouldn't want anyone to pretend it is perfect. I've decided to remove the fic from the community, but it will still be available on my personal lj with clearer warnings, should anyone wish to read it.
Naturally, this is another case of where authorial intent conflicts with what the reader happens to understand. I realize that I should've maybe given her some more positive reinforcement because she's a little insecure with her writing, and feel a little bad that she chose to remove it.
Then, the next thing I know, the moderator of yonkaka sends me this:
Hi there. I'm Lene, the mod for YonKaka. Aside from approving your membership, I'm not sure we've interacted. Frankly, I don't recall ever seeing you comment before. It's not a crime to lurk, no worries. Most of the comm are quiet watchers, and we appreciate them as much as those who post.
Freedom of speech is respected on our comm, sure, but, I would like to ask why you chose what I think is your first comment on the comm to emotionally rip one of our best writers (I may be wrong, of course, if you've gone back and commented on older pieces, but you know what I mean).
In Mima's reply to your question of whether or not she was seeking critique, she asked you not to be brutal and assured you she has low self-esteem where her writing is concerned. You replied with an emotional diatribe that is completely irrelevant as far as proper critique and criticism are concerned. Emotion has no place in objective critique, and it honestly could be described as "freaking out," to use such a term.
The piece was properly labeled dubcon. I've read it, and it is definitely not noncon by community standards. This community is centered on a pairing in which one member is the Hokage, the most powerful ninja of the village, and the other is a teenage boy, canonically 13-15 years of age, though granted very powerful in his own right. There are noncon fics and dubcon fics, there is also fluff. What, exactly, did you expect?
You aren't the only member of the community with emotional/mental problems related to past trauma, sexual and otherwise. I don't feel sorry for you. No one is going to read your review and feel sorry for you (no one will now anyway because she removed the piece, feeling as though there was something wrong with it). You reacted like a spoiled child looking for attention for your trauma and triggers.
I don't apologize if that sounds harsh.
As "someone who actually survived a situation like this," it is YOUR responsibility to know your OWN triggers and avoid things that may set them off. Dubcon and noncon are two sides of the same coin, and the line between the two does NOT have a definition. It is NOT the writer's responsibility to ensure they second-guess every trigger you, specifically, might possibly have before posting. It is YOUR responsibility to understand the risk when you decide to read something labeled dubcon.
The rest of your review was a bit of praise for a line you liked and a complaint about apostrophes. Seriously? While more than one member of the comm is a professional writer by trade, we do not expect anyone to write professional grade *fan fiction.* This is supposed to be enjoyable, relaxing, fun for the writer.
Your final little paragraph that tries to make the rest of your review 'okay' and just 'honest' critique when it was anything but is also not appreciated, and honestly insulting, not just to Mima, but the entire comm.
I chose to respond here instead of on the thread because we do not feed drama in our community. It is not welcome in any form. As with any community, online or otherwise, I would suggest that you get a feel for the way we interact before commenting further.
Lene
Uh. What. Come again? How am I emotionally rippping into someone? Furthermore, how is my comment an emotional diatrabe? Even more so, what the hell, in her opinion, is a proper critique and criticism? How was I even freaking out? What boggles my mind is how on earth anyone can be insensitive as to not take into consideration the fact that I clearly did not know what I was getting into because the piece was properly mislabeled, and that I had to discover what it was I was reading, completely unprepared to read it, by the very act of reading. What resulted was a trigger, and had I been prepared for it, I would not have had that issue. The piece was not properly labeled. I asked for it to be labeled correctly. I explained my reasonings as to why it should have been and also made it clear to the writer that she should be more careful in the future (without explicitly saying it, and she did understand my implication). Did my comment really warrant a scathing PM like this?
Irritated, pissed, a little shocked. That's probably how I feel right now. And downright disappointed with people and their lack of sensitivity. I understand that bimbomushi_fics is a prolific YonKaka writer and is known for that. But if someone treats a work with casual disregard and does not correctly label a piece to inform the reader what they are reading and prepare them emotionally to deal with the subject, then they deserve the type of comment I gave. That is how I feel about it. Period.
I respond with this:
Hi Lene,
Thank you for taking the time to write to me.
However, I believe you must have misunderstood or misread. I thought it was quite clear from my review that the piece was absolutely not properly labeled. In fact, before I left my comment, there was NO LABEL on it whatsoever that would suggest the piece would be not only non-consensual but would imply explicit sexual child abuse. And yes, perhaps there is a difference to most people between "dubious consent" and "non-consent" but I fail to see the difference when there are situations in a piece that are explicitly forced. Namely, the oral sex that Kakashi was forced to perform.
I also do NOT see how an objective reading of what exactly was going on in the piece is emotional. I stated very clearly the scenario that was going on: a man who has power over a boy in a very sensitive situation not only takes advantage of the boy, but punishes him in a way that is explicitly sexual. I could not understand why the piece was not labeled as such and why the reader had to find out what kind of piece it was only by reading it.It was a very nasty surprise for me, quite frankly, and I stopped reading the moment I realized Kakashi didn't actually -want- to be performing oral sex.
Because of this, I suggested to the writer to label it accordingly.
In case you don't realize, survivors of child molestation and rape tend to avoid things like sensationalized rape or molestation (read: dubcon, noncon) because it causes triggers. Many of us have some form of PTSD due to our experience. If the piece had been properly labeled, I absolutely would not have read it. Do I find the exploration of a relationship between a boy between the ages of 13-15 and his teacher interesting? Absolutely. Do I find the sensationalization of child abuse interesting with an unwilling, scared child interesting? Absolutely not.
Furthermore, in the actual critique of her actual writing, which I intentionally softened because she asked me not to be brutal, I focused on grammatical and syntax mistakes, not on the fact that her use of a death theme was clearly overdone. Melodrama is not, in fact, a good literary device to use in such a small space with no proper elucidation of the theme. I could have told her that, but I chose to simply let her know that she had some typos and other punctuation issues that she could choose to fix. If I were her, I would want to know that there were grammatical issues in my work, and I do enjoy when my readers correct mistakes that I might have missed because I wasn't paying attention. Many of the writers that I associate with all have similar beliefs, so it was my understanding, that when someone ask not to be brutal, pointing out mistakes is a very basic form of critique.
I would like to clarify something: it appears from your message that YonKaka does not allow any kind of negative critique, and apparently we cannot even state our opinions or feelings on a matter in an honest and open way. Negative feelings must be framed diplomatically and tritely, and even if a story is absolutely horrible to the reader due to its execution, the reader should find some way to comment on it in a way that is somehow positive and reinforcing to the writer, regardless of how bad the reader may find the work. You can correct me if I am wrong, but should I approach future pieces with this in mind?
I have no problem censoring myself and playing sweet. But as someone who is an academic critic of English Literature, I am not used to mincing my words, but will do so if that is what is expected of me.
Needless to say, I am not sure if I should ever write a negative review again in the world of fanfiction. I write glowing and positive reviews when I see something that was clearly done well. But when a subject matter is treated badly, why on earth should I say glowing things about it when there is very little I find positive or good about it? How is that honest criticism? That was not the way I was trained as a critic to respond to a work, and though I say I would mince my words if that is what is expected of me, I really wonder if I should be giving up my integrity as a critic just to make people happy about a piece that I might find poorly written.
Anyway, if you have read all of this, I am very sorry that you actually spent the time to read this. It's just a bunch of bullshit and I just wanted to rant and get all of this negative and horrible energy out of me since I would like to write some more tonight and do not think I should be writing with those type of feelings and thoughts lingering within me.
And on a final note, that so was not my first comment on the comm. In fact, I had written a rather glowing comment to an earlier piece by idle_ramblingsx. So what the fuck.
Edit: After thinking more about it, I got seriously pissed. I mean, seriously. I did not deserve to be insulted like that. I sent her another message:
On another note, I would like to point you to http://community.livejournal.com/yonkaka/164959.html?thread=2648671#t2648671
That was one of my earliest interactions on the community.
After talking to a few people, I've decided to write you again because I am rather upset with the situation.
As a moderator, you should treat all your members without bias. I understand that bimbomushi_fics is a prolific YonKaka writer, but I am rather disappointed with how you chose to approach me. I am not an idiot. I am not a child. I do not comment with attention-seeking in mind. And I do not appreciate you coming to me in such a hostile way.
If you would like to mediate a situation, shouldn't you, as a moderator, approach things diplomatically without emotionally attacking someone? I find it terribly hypocritical that you would accuse me of emotionally ripping into someone when my comment was actually rather emotionless and very objective.
Furthermore, your lack of sensitivity apropos to me flat out saying that the piece was improperly label and thus, a trigger, is rather appalling.
Telling me what is or is not criticism is not only condescending but incredibly ironic. You assumed I do not know what criticism is and attempted to tell me such. I actually happen to -be- a literary critic. I make mincemeat of literary texts, specializing specifically in postmodern theoretical and literary -criticism-. I have the utmost confidence in my work when it comes to criticism. I know what I am doing. I do not appreciate someone telling me that I do not know what I am doing when I critique a text.
My critique of her piece is one that was very narrow. But a narrow criticism is not one that is improper; furthermore a narrow criticism objectively focusing on her improper treatment of the text as one that is dubcon when it is, in fact, noncon, is not an improper critique. It is not an emotional rip. It is very basic literary analysis.
I made an argument and supported my argument with critical interpretation of a text. My argument was simple: I did not know what I was getting into because the piece was properly mislabeled, and I had to discover what it was I was reading, completely emotionally unprepared to read it, by the very act of reading.
What resulted was a trigger, and had I been prepared for it, I would not have had that issue.
This occurred because the piece was not properly labeled.
I asked for it to be labeled correctly. I explained my reasonings through analyzing her work. The writer understood what I was saying. She did not misunderstand me, as you did.
Did my comment really warrant a scathing PM like this? Seriously?
If you would like me to leave your community, please let me know. If you would rather me only give positive reviews, I will do so. But after thinking about it, I absolutely will not sacrifice my integrity as a critic for the sake of making a writer happy. If a piece of writing is unsatisfactory and the treatment of a theme and its execution is something I do not enjoy, I believe I should be honest in my criticism. This is what criticism is all about, after all.
If you do not support freedom of speech when it comes to opinions in reference to someone else's work, that is perfectly acceptable. It is your community. You only need to make it clear in the rules what is and is not acceptable when it comes to reviews. Personally, I prefer honesty. That is how I, and many others, grow in writing.
I guarantee you that I will most likely, one day, explore the YonKaka dynamic in fic form. This is why I have joined the community; because I enjoy that dynamic and I want to read other work within that pairing by other writers, and also share my own.
So if I happen to have negative criticism in the future, I will simply abstain and hold my silence. If I see a piece that I feel is improperly labeled, I will contact you directly.
Anyway. That is that. I am done with the situation. Ugh. Time to wash this bad taste out of my mouth.