The homesexuals are coming for our childrens
Over in weddingplans, crazybouncycrls is having some issues with her racist grandmother. This isn't the stupid.
crazybouncycrls thinks it's especially odd because she's from California, which is more refined. , but someone else points out that racism exists everywhere... even in Maine. Here comes the kicker:
"Um, I live in Maine, and I don't think they're racist, I think they just ( Read more... )
crazybouncycrls thinks it's especially odd because she's from California, which is more refined. , but someone else points out that racism exists everywhere... even in Maine. Here comes the kicker:
"Um, I live in Maine, and I don't think they're racist, I think they just ( Read more... )
What is reported is purely descriptive, not inferential.
That's my point, thank you for agreeing with me. You are inferring that the students are learning more by saying that scores on the standardized tests are going up. The question is...ARE they learning more? Or is it that a) students are becoming more used to taking standardized tests? b) the tests have been altered so that more students can pass? c) teachers are cheating? Or any number of possibilities. If it's true that they are learning more, then that's great. If it's something else....that is a problem. The test being altered may actually be a good thing because it's no secret that these sorts of tests have often been biased towards white, middle class, suburban children.
I find your entire second paragraph insulting. How dare you insinuate I marginalize my students? You want to know what makes them feel like they can't do anything? Taking a 3rd grade test when they read on a kindergarten level. If you think for one minute I think that my ESL students or special ed students can't "achieve" anything, you are sadly mistaken. However, what I consider, and they consider, achievement might be different from yours. OH but there I go...getting all "emotional" again.
I don't think they should be held to the same standards as "normal" children or native speakers, but their progress should be judged individually. I don't put my kids in a cookie cutter mold and tell them they should be like everyone else, but treat them like individuals, and I take issue with anyone who does not do the same. Why is this so black and white? Why does it have to be that we don't measure them at all or hold them to the same standards? That's ridiculous. There has to be a better way, but this is just easier so no one is doing it, and it's at the expense of our children.
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A) That would be a great thing. Learning test taking strategies are one of the most beneficial thing a student can learn. It teaches deductive logic and reasoning skills that are at the heart of advanced learning. I hope students become better deductive thinkers that learn how to reason, fully comprehend what is being asked, eliminate obviously incorrect responses, and know how to solve the problem. This is a very good life skill that will help them out in life in many forms of academic pursuits.
B) Criterion referenced exams are rigidly administered via standard curriculum frameworks. Its a fairly involved statistical process to weight responses on difficulty and then scale them so they are consistent in difficulty on a yearly basis. There is an entire field of statistics that deal solely with scale construction and I can get into the nitty gritty details of internal consistency, scaling, and alpha weighting if you desire. Needless to say, professional statisticians create these scales on a yearly basis and make their entire methodology available to the publc (look at any SEA webpages and you can find dense methodological procedures).
C) It happens. Rarely, but it happens. We found it in MA two years ago. In fact, I was the one that discovered the cheating based a rigid item analysis of responses in a particular school. While cheating happens, it is very easy to discover (there is usually consistently correct answer patterns that are probabilistically unlikely). Bottom line is that cheating is not a huge problem and when it occurs, it is likely to be discovered.
However, what I consider, and they consider, achievement might be different from yours. OH but there I go...getting all "emotional" again.
Do you know that there are different standards to make AYP based on ESL status? NCLB does understand that language is a barrier, but the standard for AYP takes into consideration ESL status and several other factors. Again, the goal is improvement, not perfection. We look at the baseline of achievement and we see what progress can be made and whether students are actually moving into higher levels of performance.
Why does it have to be that we don't measure them at all or hold them to the same standards? That's ridiculous.
We hold them to the same standards but we consider this into what making progress actually means. They are obviously at a disadvantage, but they can show progress just like other people can show progress. We do not penalize schools that have high ESL populations by holding them to the same AYP as everyone else, we know face hurdles other schools/districts do not face.
The fact is that there needs to be one standard and everyone needs to work towards that standard, with the expectation that it is going to be more difficult for some (and that difficulty is taken into account). I don't think it works in ESL childrens benefit to have lower standards.
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Either you really have no clue how NCLB is implemented in schools, or New Jersey is doing it wrong. I could let that get into the whole state vs. federal thing, but I won't cause frankly, I'm tired and am tired of having this discourse with you because I have more fun things to waste my time on.
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