Too Jewish?

[eveningblue]

Something that has always interested me (and that came up in this discussion of Jewish characters played by non-Jewish seeming actors) is this notion of a tv show seeming "too Jewish" by Hollywood standards. rydra_wrong explains this phenomenon here:

Neal Gabler's An Empire Of Their Own: How The Jews Invented Hollywood argues that this is precisely why

Comments

[emily_shore]

I said a little about this in the other thread, but I'll repeat myself

[batdina]

I seem to be following you around. Sorry. With the movie, I think my interest in Mulder is reawakening. Anyway, I have a half finished story about how Mulder's Jewish self was derailed because he was studying for his Bar Mitzvah when his sister was abducted and for obvious reasons, that got lost in the shuffle afterwards. Maybe I'll see about finishing that story some time, because I still like the concept a lot.

[emily_shore]

With the movie, I think my interest in Mulder is reawakening.

Along with many other people! It can only be a good thing. :)

Anyway, I have a half finished story about how Mulder's Jewish self was derailed because he was studying for his Bar Mitzvah when his sister was abducted and for obvious reasons, that got lost in the shuffle afterwards.

That sounds absolutely fascinating. I would love to read it.

[batshua]

That sounds absolutely fascinating. I would love to read it.

Seconded!

[eveningblue]

Thanks for the link--it looks very interesting!

Mulder got confronted by neo-Nazi anti-Semites a couple of times during the course of the show, and it always sent chills up my spine that the character was in a way held back from responding because of the producer's desire for ambiguity.

I agree that this is troubling, especially in "Kaddish" where he has a chance to out himself but doesn't (though he doesn't seem to deny it, either).

[tahnan]

So you get a situation where the actor is Jewish, wants the character to be Jewish, and plays him as Jewish.

Which reminds me of Magneto: a situation in which the actor is gay, wants the character to be gay, and plays him as...well, as a character, but clearly informed by the actor's gayness. (Disclaimer: so I recall reading. I ought to hunt down interviews, but haven't.) Of course, that doesn't necessarily run counter to the intent of the script. Anyway, just a passing thought, perhaps of compare-and-contrast relevance.

(And, of course, Magneto would be a Jewish character played by a non-Jewish actor...but, well, anyway.)

[mofic]

Magneto is an interesting one to bring up. In the interviews after X1 I did not hear McKellen saying he wanted the character to be gay or was playing him as gay. What I heard him say was that his experience of being a closeted gay man and then coming out gave him an understanding of oppression and of being part of a despised class that helped him understand Magneto's experience of being part of a despised class - both as a Jew and as a mutant. I don't feel like he did play him as gay in the movie. OTOH, by X3 he seemed flamboyantly gay, particularly in the flashback scene.

Another interesting thing about Magneto is that in the movie he is clearly shown as Jewish, but in the comics it's not clear that he's Jewish and he's sometimes identified as Romani.

[skywaterblue]

Blah. That's one of the oldest Jew in fandom topics ever, right there. I hope there won't be wank about it, although historically...

(For what it's worth, I'm clearly of the 'he's Jewish and gay and a mutant' team.)

[tahnan]

So nu, I misremembered. Still. :-)

Magneto

[wickedgoodgrrrl]

Interesting read on Magneto; I'm assuming you're taking it from the "X-Men" movies? Since I came late to comic books and still later to the Marvel Universe, my only point of reference for the X-Men comes through the movies and a few Wikipedia articles

Re: Magneto

[executrix]

I'm completely outside comics fandom, although I have seen the three XM movies a) because mofic rocks and b) because I was writing a story where UglyVeiny!Willow applies for a job with Magneto using their three-fer status as gay Jewish supervillains as a CV. But I think irrespective of whether Magneto was played by Sir Ian McKellan or Straighty McBreederson, I don't think it's unreasonable to look at Magneto's relationship to Xavier as being just like Giles' to Ethan: passionate relationship-->bad breakup-->ideological problems with reunion.

Re: Magneto

[polaris_starz]

There was a scene in the second movie that definitely coded mutants as "gay". When the characters end up at Iceman's house and he tells his parents that he's a mutant, there's a very awkward moment and then his mother says "Have you ever tried not being a mutant?" That's a very stereotypical reaction to have to a child coming out.

Re: Magneto

[executrix]

That's a very stereotypical reaction to have to a child coming out.

AND a shoutout to BtVS--I think the audiences overlapped a lot.

Re: Magneto

[tahnan]

Because I'm thinking of the way an actor approaches a role, yes, I'm speaking specifically of the movies. (As it happens, I've not at all read the comics. I'm not a very good geek, sometimes.)

And, also, yes, the opening concentration camp scene was particularly hard-hitting for me as well.