Never thought I'd live long enough to see this...

[spikealicious]

Never thought I'd see this at all. Ever!

Hi all,

Sorry for the long absence, but I've been lurking about anyway.

Today, I was over on James' Facebook page and found this link from a guy named James Christie.

All I can say, is, "HOLY SHIT!"For all those of you out there, whose spouses, significant others have wished that you could make money

Comments

[slaymesoftly]

You're the first person I've seen who sounds at all enthusiastic about Kindle Worlds. Most seem to think it's a way for Amazon (and/or other corporations) to take advantage of people who want to be considered published writers by paying them a pittance for their work, which will then belong to Amazon to do with as they'd like. Not to mention, putting some professional writers who do tie-ins for a living out of work. I'm a bit undecided, although leaning towards thinking it's a bad idea all around. I'm certainly not interested in participating anyway. It remains to be seen if a) Buffy is added to the list of allowable worlds b) anybody I'd be interested in reading actual decides to participate and turn over their fic to Amazon. It'll be interesting to see how it develops...

Everybody who's had knee replacements seems to say the same thing - "why didn't I do this sooner?" LOL Good to know you're progressing well. Sorry about Rick's bone. Hope it starts to knit itself together better.

We went from too hot, to too cold, and will be back to too hot by the end of next week. Weird weather!

[spikealicious]

I may have enthused too soon. I just reread all that, so not quite as enthusiastic as I was to begin with (read my edited portions).

I mean, it's really weird to think about somebody writing in your verse like we write in Joss' isn't it? OTOH, there are a couple of short stories I've written, that I woudn't be too opposed. But, for the one that's 215+ chapters? That would be a hard pill to swallow I think. Also, major edits to remove all (most of) sexual content (not that there's that much - 5% maybe?), etc.

Tempting on one hand, but like selling a bit of your soul on the other - then again, maybe it's the same for all authors, no matter original or not. This new catagory just boggles the mind in everything it implies.

Yes, the weather is really weird.

BTW, just have been finding and reading your stories on ff.net. Really enjoying them. I have my own problems with that (besides looking for actual good reads). I once had part of the long story of mine on there - prob. 70 or so chapters, and w/o warning or anything, 'Poof!' Just gone. All that work. No rhyme or reason given. I still have a couple there, but as far as me ever spending time to put O.N.L. back there. No thanks. And believe me, there's nothing in my story (sexually speaking)that isn't in 1000's of others. That's what I couldn't understand.

[slaymesoftly]

*nods* I don't like the idea of a character I've created being used by someone else to make money of which I would get none. Which, if I understand the rules correctly, is what would happen if I wrote and turned in a story with original characters and it was picked up by, say, a movie studio who thought it could make a good movie. Amazon would own the rights. and they would be the ones to receive any money paid to option the work. So, say I made $100 over time on my "published" story, and they got several thousand for the movie rights.... yeah. I don't think so. :) I'm going to be surprised if Joss goes for this - given the huge fan base he has of ff writers.

What I hear from everyone re ff.net is that the rating thing is ignored more often than not, but you never know. Not worth it to me to take the time and trouble to post my longer fics only to see them disappear. On the other hand, the traffic is pretty amazing for things written some time ago in a tired old fandom. I just figure if they really like what they see there, they'll be able to find me elsewhere if they really want to. :) I reread TTGB recently to see how much sex I could take out, but all the sex scenes contained really important conversations between S/B and would read as very boring and weird if they weren't broken up with some actions. And that was a fic where the sex was somewhat incidental to the relationship (only somewhat - it is S/B after all...). It would be impossible in most of the other long ones.

[spikealicious]

I know, it's pretty amazingly ballsy of Amazon to have that in there - they think they're a studio or something? I don't know how it works with publishing an original story, but I don't think it's like that. I suppose that's the whole point, is that you're already playing in somebody's sandbox, so that's why the amt. of money you make per sale is that much lower, as well. Off the top, you're sharing your profits.

I don't know if it's fair or not, considering, but it does seem stark seeing it in black and white. I wonder if that's the way it is in the comics for the writers. They get paid for the work, but they don't have any say if somebody else picks up a certain story and uses some of the ancillary characters that they created to use in said comic.

Fanfic has been it's own world for so long, it's hard to consider a different world, really. I remember a few yrs. back when there was a kerfuffle over a few people stealing other people's works and posting them as their own on some fanfic site (maybe ff.net) and all the outrage that caused.

I mean, I understand we are playing in somebody else's sandbox to begin with, but I don't like the idea of some other author being able to pick up on my own story and run somewhere else with it. That just boggles. Or maybe I should be flattered. I'm not sure, and again, back to the boggled-ness. But, then again, if they're going to pay me for original content that has used BtVS as a template, then what is the other thing to be called?

I think we're safe from having somebody take our works and turn them into a movie, (though it would be made of awesome!) b'cuz of where Joss took S8 & S9 (although he once said he'd ignore them if the characters all came back, but I don't think that's where his heart is now anyway, so I don't see it happening) - but I could see a backstory to Spike in a 4 or 5 part comic, if the rest of my story was disregarded. I have a nice old lady named Edna who Spike met/begrudgingly befriended/protected and has been around (in my own verse) since about the 30's. If you take the Spuffy out of it, that story could definitely stand alone. But, I wouldn't want to give her and her backstory up for free.

It's all academic blahdy-blah anyway, since I'm sure that Joss and co. isn't waiting w/ baited breath for me. Or are they...? *g*

As far as ff.net, at the time I had my story on there, I don't think that they had as many catagories as they do now, however, I did certainly put mine in the most adult one they did have b'cuz of the sex.

And that was a fic where the sex was somewhat incidental to the relationship (only somewhat - it is S/B after all...). It would be impossible in most of the other long ones.

Agreed. It is Spuffy and like it or not, there's that undeniable attraction/chemistry, and love that defines the very word, Spuffy

A shorter one I have I can see removing the 'graphic' parts of it and it would still be a fun story to read, b'cuz the sex was near the end, and while hot, wasn't that much of the story, and w/o important dialogue. It just wouldn't be as much fun. I mean, when somebody finally reads about a Spuffy reunion, well, that's just part of the expectation, but written well, it can still be less graphic, I suppose.

It will be interesting to see how or even, if, Buffy becomes a catagory on Amazon World and who joins in.

[slaymesoftly]

*nods* We do play in someone else's sandbox, but with permission and for no profit. I'm really not sure how the paying for it would work - I guess it wouldn't be called fan fiction, it would be called something else? There are books written in the world Joss Created, just without Buffy et al. Stories of earlier slayers and things like that. But those aren't called ff, I just can't remember what they are called. It would be more likely that an entire plot, plus characters, is what would be useful to someone else - but again, my plot. We're on very shaky ground, though, with our use of someone else's world and characters, so I'm not sure we'd have a leg to stand on even if someone stole an actual ff story and turned it into something for profit. Not sure what copyright law is on something like that.

As far as stealing someone's work and claiming it as yours on a ff archive - that's plagiarism - pure and simple - and is identified as such pretty quickly usually. It's more of a "aha! caught you!" kind of thing than a kerfuffle, I think. The offending author is removed from the archive and if it's been reported to the stop plagiarism community, they investigate and add the author to the list of know plagiarists. Nothing to be done legally, I suppose, but lots of peer pressure and fandom condemnation.

I can see me just changing the end of a story where that's where the only sex is to more of a fade to black ending, but not sure I want to bother with it. I feel like I've put up enough for new readers to know if they want to read more or not. Might do some Spander and Gethan to reach the slash fans, but that will probably be about it.

[spikealicious]

I've read the stories of the slayers - at least part of one book. Interesting. I don't know if it's called fanfic, guess it's just like an expanding universe.

It would be more likely that an entire plot, plus characters, is what would be useful to someone else - but again, my plot.

Yeah, I don't know what their logic or fairness in that is, since like you said, we haven't been paid (even if we've been allowed) to play in somebody else's sandbox, so why the double penalty (the first being the not so generous 35%, but understand that is the cost of sandbox playing)?

Having spent 10 yrs. on my own verse, I do feel quite like I own it, whether or not I started out in another's sandbox. The storyline is certainly my own baby.

We're on very shaky ground, though, with our use of someone else's world and characters, so I'm not sure we'd have a leg to stand on even if someone stole an actual ff story and turned it into something for profit. Not sure what copyright law is on something like that.

I know, it just boggles the mind how twisty and turny this thing could be. Totally agree with you.

I'll have to see how some of this plays out in the future before I would give up rights to this story, though I can see perhaps creating something else just for the sake of profit, with the understanding of all of the above. I have some WIPS I barely started sitting about that I'm not nearly as attached to.

[slaymesoftly]

*nods* Yes, I can see perhaps creating something specifically for Kindle Worlds, knowing that you might lose all rights to it. At least you'd be going into it with eyes wide open. Accepting ahead of time that you shouldn't get too attached to your story.

[spikealicious]

Agrees, I'd be okay with that. Besides, I'll never, ever, ever be as attached to anything as much as I am One Normal Day (O.N.D.) and One Normal Life (O.N.L.) anyway, esp. the latter.

[jacobs_muse]

They're licensed expanded universe tie-in books. With this Amazon deal, Warner Bros. is giving Amazon permission to host the fanfics and takes a cut along with Amazon and the author. So far, they've only licensed Vampire Diaries, Pretty Little Liars, and Gossip Girl.

[slaymesoftly]

They're licensed expanded universe tie-in books. Ah, that's the term. Thanks!

[jacobs_muse]

Well, the parent company of the property (Warner Bros.) owns the rights. Amazon is licensing them.