On Daniel and zats and Teal'c and Hammond and general SQUEE! Within the Serpent's Grasp

[sg_fignewton]

Because aurora_novarum would be disappointed if I didn't do this... :)

This week, in redial_the_gate, we finish Season One with the cliffhanger: Within the Serpent's Grasp.

Such an utterly fantastic episode! Off to save the world and seeing Skaara and discovering the zats! ("Zatnikatels." "Let's call them zat guns." And later, in S3: "They are intar." "What's that short for

Comments

[abyssinia4077]

Hammond is just incredible here. He's tried so hard to keep the SGC going, to the lengths of being thrown out of Kinsey's office for persistence.

I know! I always wonder, when Jack charges in so insistent, if he really things Hammond is just taking this sitting down. Because, I know it's early, but I think even that early Jack knows better than that.

What's with the absence of glasses, though? He considers pulling them out at one point, but doesn't. Afraid of reflection from the lenses? Going into a commando raid half-blind doesn't make much sense.

And this drives me NUTS every single time I watch this episode. It makes NO sense at all.

And it further suggets that Daniel and Jack, and Daniel and Sam, have had a lot of personal conversations - Daniel knows that Jack still cares about Sara, and that Sam has a family to lose.But look at "Cold Lazarus." I think that episode, without a doubt, showed the entire team that Jack still cares about Sara. And we also hear Sam admit to being an aunt, so having family. And considering

[sg_fignewton]

Jack and Hammond... I think that Jack still expects Hammond to remain conventional. He hasn't quite worked out Hammond's amazing talent for working within the constraints of convention, as we see him do in The Fifth Man.

I see what you mean re Cold Lazarus, but two things: first, Daniel wasn't there when Sam babbled to Jack about Mark and the kids in the locker room, yet he knows about her family. Second, they were a bit distracted in the hospital. :)

I personally think that Daniel was hitting hard, and below the belt, for the sole reason of jolting them into action. So yes, extrapolation - but at the same time, he must have been pretty sure of his target to play those cards. (And I'm mixing my metaphors horribly, aren't I?)

Daniel and Skaara - the writers seem to make it Daniel looking for Sha're, and Jack looking for Skaara. And I just don't buy it. Daniel would be just as frantic to find his little good brother as he is to find his wife. And while Jack doesn't have the emotional connection with Sha're himself, he does have the

[abyssinia4077]

True. Hammond is really good at getting done what needs doing from within the rules set down and Jack is really good at working outside the rules and managing not to get in trouble for it (wonder how much that says about their military backstories)

I see what you mean re Cold Lazarus, but two things: first, Daniel wasn't there when Sam babbled to Jack about Mark and the kids in the locker room, yet he knows about her family. Second, they were a bit distracted in the hospital. :)Oh, point, for some reason...oh, yes, because Daniel walks in AFTER and tells Sam Charlie is dead. I wouldn't be surprised if Sam had mentioned her nieces? nephews? by then at some point - maybe going to visit them for a weekend (I don't think canon can decide how estranged Sam was/is from Mark). And, yeah, they were distracted in the hospital, but Jack's actions in general (jumping up for the phone) imply he very much still cares about Sara

[sg_fignewton]

(wonder how much that says about their military backstories)

It says YOOHOO, REDBYRD! HERE'S ANOTHER PLOTBUNNY FOR YOU!!! :)

Oh, I wasn't trying to imply that Sam and Jack are hiding the fact that they care for their families. But I do think it suggests that Daniel knows than better than they might realize.

And yes, the writers don't seem to have the most complimentary views towards the fans' intelligence. :p

[nomadicwriter]

That seems reasonable to me. Although I'm not sure it's necessarily the zat and the ribboning combining, just the fact that the hand-device has formed a connection between them so they'll both get zatted. Because I'd be quite amazed if a single zat blast could reliably put down a Goa'uld. (We'll ignore that it worked in Dominion, because hey, said Goa'uld had just changed hosts and was presumably weaker than usual. I specialise in fanwanks for these occasions.)

Even on humans and Jaffa who get zatted fairly regularly zat blasts seem to have a plot convenient varying effect - sometimes the victim's unconscious for a fair chunk of time, sometimes they're only down for about ten seconds. So if you zat a Goa'uld and an ordinary human together, odds are you've knocked the human out for several minutes while the Goa'uld's only going to spasm a bit and recover. Which means you've basically wasted your shot and helpfully knocked the Goa'uld's victim out for them. Not so smart.

[sg_fignewton]

Have I told you lately how much I love your icons? :)

I can buy that it's just the connection, with the added caveat that an already weakened individual might very well be killed with a single zat blast. Which... kinda translates back into what I suggested in the first place, I think.

I think it would be a lot of fun to go through the series and try and handwave every time the zat only dazes/knocks down instead of actually putting someone out. I'm not saying it's actually possible, mind, but it would be fun to try. :) Let's see, now: Daniel in ITLOD only gets knocked down because the blast took down two individuals, not one! And same thing in Lockdown when Teal'c shot him again, plus Anubis might have somehow lessened the effect. And in Seth, people weren't knocked out because the charge was dissipated in negating the nishta! And, um, Jack and Daniel could march into a crowd of people and fire four shots off at once without risking accidentally hitting someone twice because... er. I think I need some help here. ;)

[aurora_novarum]

I figure the electrical connection of the zat blast coupled with the energy of the ribbon device could overload and just make ribbon victim...dead.

(And by the way, way to pre-answer one of my discussion questions, fig). :-)

[sg_fignewton]

I figure the electrical connection of the zat blast coupled with the energy of the ribbon device could overload and just make ribbon victim...dead.

Yep, that's exactly what I was thinking.

As for your discussion question - hey, I've been talking about the zat/ribbon thing for ages! Can't blame me. :)

[aelfgyfu_mead]

Yes, Daniel's lack of glasses makes no sense; I can only think they were giving Michael Shanks fits, and if he leaves them off for one take or scene, he has to leave them off for all. MS never really behaves like someone who wears glasses; I think he's a really good actor, but all the times he gets his glasses knocked off, he doesn't do the instinctive thing that all glasses-wearers I know do: try to get the glasses back right away (which isn't always easy, because it's hard to find your glasses while you aren't wearing them!).

Hammond is great; I think Jack is just venting his frustration with Hammond because Hammond's the most immediate target. Jack should indeed know better, but he's beyond upset.

I can actually see Daniel trying to locate not only his alternate self but the families of his teammates as ammunition for later arguments. It would, however, also be reasonable simply to conclude that they must be dead

[sg_fignewton]

MS never really behaves like someone who wears glasses

Yes, that's true. And Daniel's glasses are part of my next canon vs fanon, and do you how insane it is to try and make any sense out of it? :) I noticed it most in TBFTGOG, when he gets up and unerringly picks up his glasses. There have been times when I've had to call my kids to come and help me find my glasses when I've knocked them off the night table!

Heh for Jack ranting. At least it's a polite rant. :)

I like that Daniel's argument can be interpreted so many different ways. It does all lead to the same conclusion: that Daniel can be a master of manipulation when he wants to be! And yay for teamy goodness, going along and working TOGETHER.

if you hit two people with a zat, they both take the force of it, and a ribbon device sends power.

Yeah, I think that's what it comes down to, really: the zat blast will surge along the channelled power, and zat+ribbon=dead.

[nomadicwriter]

I noticed it most in TBFTGOG, when he gets up and unerringly picks up his glasses. There have been times when I've had to call my kids to come and help me find my glasses when I've knocked them off the night table!

The whole glasses/no glasses thing doesn't bother me as much as it seems to other people. I'm short-sighted and I wear my glasses all the time, but I can still function 98% fine without them. Detail gets increasingly blurry with distance, but I can still locate things perfectly and read a book or a computer screen. And I could easily shoot somebody at any distance (well - if, you know, I could actually do that with glasses on in the first place). Only thing I really have trouble with sans glasses is recognising faces at a distance or reading signposts/notices on walls.

So I really don't find it at all odd that Daniel functions okay without glasses. (Hell, for all we know he has a very mild prescription. Is there really any canon evidence that his eyesight is particularly bad?) What is messed up is the whole

[redbyrd_sgfic]

Is there really any canon evidence that his eyesight is particularly bad?

The only one I can think of is the bit in FIAD when he wakes up in the infirmary (which *is* in the dream, it must be said), and you get a Daniel's eye view of blurriness until Janet gives him his glasses.

The problem of course is that it's *camera* fuzziness, without the variation in focus you get with actual nearsightedness. So I figure part of that has to be the just-waking-up-from-being-ribboned effect, and the rest is inaccuracy in the dream.

I'm with

[aurora_novarum]

You just couldn't wait twenty-four hours, could you. ;-) Hee hee hee.

I love this episode so-so much. It and the sequel are amongst my most favoritist bestest SG-1 episodes EVAR.

I too love how they all (including Daniel) take turns in guarding formation, and Sam GIVES Daniel her spare sidearm while she uses the grenade and rifle. Two gun Daniel and kickass Sam! Whee!

I'm just giddy you're FINALLY doing the glasses canon v fanon. Heh.

[sg_fignewton]

These two eps are right after Fifth Race on my "show this to someone if you want to them get them hooked on Stargate" list. :)

And of course I couldn't wait 24 hours! Honestly, did you expect me to? ;)

And LOL, yes, I liked how Sam handed Daniel the spare sidearm. I don't think she expected him to use them both at once, though!

[kalquessa]

I heart tactical!Team. I think the black BDUs and watch caps should be their default uniform. Only that would rob us of the trademarked Daniel Boonie, which would be a loss. So maybe they should just alternate and wear the olive drab recon-wear one day and the tactical ninja-gear the next.

Also, General Babyfacehead is equal to RAWK!

[sg_fignewton]

B-b-but what about the BANDANA?

SG-1! With ninjas!

And Hammond. Whee!

[kalquessa]

Oh, well, they make tactical black bandannas, I'm sure. *grin*

[sg_fignewton]

Oh, in that case, problem solved! :)