Dragon*Con panel recap - Beyond Binaries 201

[rm]

This panel was the "after-dark" sequel to the Beyond Binaries 101 panel I was not a part of. Other than a bit of comedy, by and large the content of this panel didn't really seem to need to be "after-dark" -- third-gender topics are not, and should not be, inherently adults only -- but I'm not sure anyone knew where the panel was going to go when

Comments

[yamx]

I agree with your general point, but I have a question:

The assumption that third-gendered characters must be alien was a problem. Trans people, queer people, genderqueer people, intersex people, asexual people, third-gendered people exist, right here, on earth, right now, and are human, and in a well-executed story can be narrators that are effective, plausible and easy to relate to.

While I'm, again, grateful you realize asexuals exist, I'm not quite sure why you included us in this list. While there certainly are asexual people who are also third gendered/defy the gender binary, many (I don't think any studies have been done, so I'm not even going to try to guess percentages) do indeed identify with one of the traditional genders.

I don't think being asexual inherently makes someone third-gendered--they can co-occur, but don't have to. It's entirely possible to be asexual and cis. Or are you saying that the fact that I happen not to feel sexual attraction inherently makes me less female? Because I'd object to that.

[rm]

I did not mean to imply that. Rather, the panel ranged all over the place in terms of trying to figure out what we were talking about: was the panel intended to be about non-heterosexual content or non-male/female content? We also sort of walked into with different assumptions, none of which matched anyone else's assumptions, and there were points where I at least, felt like I'd bring up anything, to get us out of talking about M/F relationships, which is what kept happening over and over again.

I did not mean to in any way question your or anyone elses gender by that listing, and will remove the reference, perhaps making clear that this was also touched on in the panel elsewhere in another paragraph. I apologize for the offense.

[yamx]

Oh, don't worry, I'm not offended. For one thing, I wouldn't consider being called non-cis offensive, just inaccurate. Also, I was pretty sure you'd just worded something ambiguously, because I really don't see you as someone who'd try to tell me what gender identity I can have. *g* I just wanted to make clear the not-necessarily-relatedness of the concepts, for other readers as well.

I wasn't at the panel, but I can definitely imagine how something like that would be likely to go all over the place. Thanks for the write-up, it's very interesting. :)

[rm]

Yay! Cool. I torture sentences to death, so it's very easy for me to be a) unclear and b) an asshole without meaning to be. (of course, I can also c) be an asshole without realizing why I'm an asshole, but that was not this day).

I honestly wish I had a transcript of that panel. It was so remarkably emblematic of the anxieties in the SF/F lit community about marginalization, old vs. new publishing, diversity, sex, that it was astounding. I don't know if we got anything done, but it was a pretty amazing live-action demonstration.

[yamx]

Hmm... maybe you could try to get as many people as possible who were there to do a write-up (*without* comparing notes first) and then collect the links to them all in one place? I bet it'd be fascinating to see different people's accounts of how they experienced the same event.

I think the panel achieved something just by showcasing those anxieties.

[rm]

That would be awesome. I'm not sure how I could make that happen -- there's a couple of people I could email who get up later than me or are West Coast who probably haven't seen this yet.

In the future, I'd really love to try to do recordings/transcripts of some panels if folks are okay with that. Aside from more access to information for more people, it has the potential to be a valuable historical record in terms of the evolution of the genre.

[yamx]

Recordings would be great! I'd love to watch/listen to one.

[rm]

I have edited and made a clarifying footnote regarding my error. Once again my apologies.

[yamx]

I hope this clarifies, and I, of course, stand by the assertion that asexuals exist and that asexual characters can be humans and awesome narrators.

*big hugs*

[ophymirage]

hey yamx, question for you (if you don't mind.) there's a lot of discussion suddenly going on regarding asexuality/demisexuality/something called 'grey'? in relation to the new Sherlock fandom, and I'm trying to be a good beta and educate & ground myself and my author appropriately. (And I've always found the question of lit!Sherlock's sexuality-or-not fascinating anyway, so am interested in 'new' approaches to reading the character.)

Are there internet resources you would recommend as reasonably knowledgeable on the subject, for beginning reading? Books are fine too, though it'll take me longer to get to them (and I suspect would be somewhat less up-to-date than the tubez, but more information is always better.)

I hope this doesn't come across as yet another 'educate me about your life' request, it's certainly not intended as such. :) Thanks for any info you can provide. :D - Ophy

[yamx]

Oh, thank you! I'm always happy to educate people about asexuality. (Well, not "always." Don't call me at 6 a.m. *g*)

I really like this site from the BBC as a starting point:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/h2g2/A4455263

Also, there's AVEN, the Asexual Visibility and Education Network:
http://www.asexuality.org/home/

There are lots of articles there, links to blogs, a forum, and even a Wiki.

Hope this helps! :)

[ophymirage]

Both of those look *brilliant* as starting points to not committing orientation!fail. thank you very much. :)

[yamx]

You're welcome.

If you have any specific questions, feel free. (Keeping in mind of course that I'm just me, not the official spokesperson for all asexuals or anything. *g*)

[valancy_joy]

jumping in here to say I found this LJ comm: asexy_sherlock the other day when I stumbled across an is Sherlock asexual or not discussion...

in case that helps. it's very new, but there are some links to meta tucked in there...

[ophymirage]

Valancy, thanks, I'll take a look. and I have TOTAL love for your icon there & want to steal it badly. :D