but he seemed to be making assumptions and trying to make the decision for her, without finding out or caring how she felt. And that’s not cool, Dave. Neither is handcuffing her boyfriend to a urinal.Yeah.... I guess the only saving grace was that he kept reiterating he wanted to talk to Leslie about it, which he obviously couldn't very well do with Ben around. So I guess maybe it was more Leslie's terrible decision to try to force her current and ex-boyfriends to get along that made it seem like he was trying to make a bunch of decisions for her. I mean, if Ben hadn't been there, they probably would've talked about it rather more calmly, Leslie would've explained she loved Ben (much like she did at the end of the ep) and Dave would've stepped down and respected her decision, like he finally did anyway. Of course, that would have made for rather less of a story, not to mention lacked a lot of the awkwardness that way
( ... )
I may have been a little harsh on Dave last night. You're right that he just wanted a few minutes to talk to Leslie and he didn't get that. Leslie probably could have ended the awkwardness pretty quickly by just asking Ben to give them a minute and letting Dave down, but then where's the comedy in that. I also wondered Dave maybe he regretted not being more upfront about his feelings two years ago. There was something about him dismissing Leslie and Ben's relationship as a non-issue and saying she felt the same way when he didn't know that still rubbed me the wrong way.
I think it could have been funny if Dave didn't know Ben was more than her campaign manager, and misinterpreted Ben's attempts to win him over as flirting with him. Maybe that would have been too much like an inverse of the Bubble plot though.
Sure, Dave was kind of obnoxious telling Ben what Leslie felt, but I think him dismissing their relationship was more posturing than anything else. I can't imagine him saying the same thing to Leslie or blame him for not wanting to be nice to her new boyfriend, really. But the handcuffing and what followed was over the top and felt OOC, I agree.
I think it could have been funny if Dave didn't know Ben was more than her campaign manager Exactly! Dave could've shown up somewhere, her house, the Parks Dept...wherever, looking for her and finding Ben instead. Ben would've known who Dave was. Dave would not have known who Ben was and Ben would've been intimidated by him being a cop while at the same time trying to play it cool and be nice about it. And yes, if Dave found Ben to be effeminate throughout it all and started to wonder about Ben's intentions, that would have been even more hilarious. Later Leslie could've shown up - or not. She and Ben could've just run into him again at the police party to get a scene between the three of
( ... )
As someone who also fears cops (or really, anyone with any unquestioned authority), I can see where Ben is coming from. Though as a white, middle-class male, he has less to fear than most people.
It's not the fearing of cops I don't like. It's the lazy writing surrounding it. Either make it an actual plot with a backstory and a reason for it or leave it be as just this little character quirk. It annoys me that instead they choose to blow it up to this thing that is almost something but not quite. It's very unsatisfying and basically I just agree with rikyl that they're taking these little things about him and are turning them into major things, but with seemingly little rhyme or reason behind it.
I see what you're saying, though it doesn't bother me as much. Mostly because it was so funny watching Ben be that freaked out : ). But it reminds me of an article I read just the other day, about the guy who helped co-write the Pawnee book. He said when they wrote it, Ben was not fully fleshed out yet. Maybe when the writers looked back on Season 3, these were the Ben quirks that made them laugh the most.
I would love more Ben back story though. More back story for everyone, in fact. Especially Ann.
Ben's freakouts were some of the funniest parts of the episode, and Adam Scott is always amazing. But his nervousness around cops was at a much more normal level last season--he was just a little awkward, really, and they dialed that way up now, just like they did the calzone thing a few weeks ago. And it didn't really bother me all that much, it just seemed like a noticeable shift in how they're writing him.
My only explanation, off the top of my head, is that the writers realized Adam Scott is really good at that kind of comedy and are writing to his strengths the way they do to Nick Offerman's and Aziz Ansari's.
With the calzones, I thought the funny thing about it last season was that he expressed a totally normal preference for a food that many people enjoy, and because it was Pawnee, everyone looked at him like he was crazy. And this season it turns out he does actually have a crazy-level obsession with that particular food. So yeah, maybe it's lazy writing to keep going to that well.
Hm, I don't know, the calzone thing was a bit... odd. I didn't think at the time that it was so much that he was SO into calzones, but more that he was weird about something. It was an unusual suggestion (hi, you're buying food for a large group of people? PIZZA, done!), and then he just kept making it at the oddest moments. But I thought that was driven by anxiety, not love for the food in question.
So it's a tiny bit of a leap for him to turn into Ben Wyatt, Calzone Obsessive.
That said, I am not so very into jam, and when I was unemployed for a long stretch about 10 years ago, I made a LOT of jam. Like, dozens and dozens and DOZENS of jars. And I'm not a quirky tv character or anything...
The calzone thing didn't bother me at the time, and the cop thing doesn't bother me much, but put together ... I just hope they don't keep doing that sort of thing. Adam Scott can be hilarious as a crazy person, and I can see how it would be tempting to turn him into a ridiculous character. Then I guess Rashida could go back to being the lone straightwoman.
I actually think the reason I'm thinking about this at all is that I read an article recently about how sitcoms deteriorate over time because the writers start exaggerating the characters' traits for comedy and over time they turn into caricatures. Not that I think that's what's happening here. Just seemed noteworthy.
Exactly. I suppose we could excuse it by saying he's becoming more and more used to Pawnee. He participates in the Jerry-bashing like a native now, for example, so maybe the crazinesss is rubbing off on him. Or maybe, because he was feeling low, he wanted to do something deliberately contrary. But honestly, I don't feel much like excusing it. It feels like, "oh, calzones are always funny and we don't really know what else to do, so let's give 'em more calzones."
I just have to butt in here for a second because I have this really random head-canon about the calzone thing...
My take is that, yeah, in season three, Ben was just offering food suggestions/expressing a preference (and being occasionally awkward about it) and the joke was that Pawneans take their Italian fast-casual dining options strangely seriously...
But then Ben *becomes* a Pawnean. By season 4 he's one of them, and so now he has strangely serious opinions about fast-casual Italian food, but since he'll never be truly of Pawnee, he's going to come down hard on the pro-calzone side. So really the calzone thing is yet another indication of how he's (gladly and happily) becoming integrated into the fabric of Pawnee.
Reply
I think it could have been funny if Dave didn't know Ben was more than her campaign manager, and misinterpreted Ben's attempts to win him over as flirting with him. Maybe that would have been too much like an inverse of the Bubble plot though.
Reply
I think it could have been funny if Dave didn't know Ben was more than her campaign manager Exactly! Dave could've shown up somewhere, her house, the Parks Dept...wherever, looking for her and finding Ben instead. Ben would've known who Dave was. Dave would not have known who Ben was and Ben would've been intimidated by him being a cop while at the same time trying to play it cool and be nice about it. And yes, if Dave found Ben to be effeminate throughout it all and started to wonder about Ben's intentions, that would have been even more hilarious. Later Leslie could've shown up - or not. She and Ben could've just run into him again at the police party to get a scene between the three of ( ... )
Reply
Reply
Reply
I would love more Ben back story though. More back story for everyone, in fact. Especially Ann.
Reply
Reply
Reply
Reply
Reply
So it's a tiny bit of a leap for him to turn into Ben Wyatt, Calzone Obsessive.
That said, I am not so very into jam, and when I was unemployed for a long stretch about 10 years ago, I made a LOT of jam. Like, dozens and dozens and DOZENS of jars. And I'm not a quirky tv character or anything...
Reply
Reply
Reply
I actually think the reason I'm thinking about this at all is that I read an article recently about how sitcoms deteriorate over time because the writers start exaggerating the characters' traits for comedy and over time they turn into caricatures. Not that I think that's what's happening here. Just seemed noteworthy.
Reply
Reply
My take is that, yeah, in season three, Ben was just offering food suggestions/expressing a preference (and being occasionally awkward about it) and the joke was that Pawneans take their Italian fast-casual dining options strangely seriously...
But then Ben *becomes* a Pawnean. By season 4 he's one of them, and so now he has strangely serious opinions about fast-casual Italian food, but since he'll never be truly of Pawnee, he's going to come down hard on the pro-calzone side. So really the calzone thing is yet another indication of how he's (gladly and happily) becoming integrated into the fabric of Pawnee.
Reply
Leave a comment