(Untitled)
So here I am.
I haven't posted in a while. I don't have much to say.
Valentine's Day was great; I'm so lucky to be marrying the man who is way more than I'd ever dreamed one man could be.
I don't have much else to update about my life, but I do have a general complaint.
I'm not in high school any more. I'm not even in college. And the day I ( Read more... )
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To be totally honest, I--in essence--agree with you. I think EVERYONE (regardless of faith) should have a civil union, and then if you want to have some sort of church sanctioned "marriage," then that's your business. However, that's not the way our country is set up, and I feel that to deny one section of our population the rights and freedoms that everyone else has is just wrong. Once again, I feel as though religion has been legislated--unfortunately, since it happened back in the olden days when everybody in the country worshipped Jesus, it's apparently okay. And since I don't think that anyone is going to be willing to make civil unions the norm, then I think homosexuals must be allowed to "marry," otherwise we risk forcing them into being regarded as second-class citizens, which isn't fair.
(Also, just so you know, some churches accept homosexual marriages. Maybe not your particular brand of church, but there are Christian-identified churches that do...)
It's always interesting to have a real conversation about things like this with a Christian person who can both verbalize her point of view intelligently AND see other sides of an issue--I don't really have any "religious Christian" friends anymore, and the ones I used to have were pretty much of the "We're right, you're wrong, and you're going to burn in hell, you heathen" variety, so this is fascinating to me.
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The parentheses paragraph: I've recently begun attending a United Church of Christ church. They do support allowing homosexuals to be married in the church. I know that I just tried to clearly express how I felt about that, but there is a flip side to my opinion. I do not support gay marriage in the church, but there is a point to be made in its favor: the bible states (again, I'm paraphrasing) that one sin is as bad as another. Lying is a sin, murder is a sin, adultery is a sin. Following that line of thought (bear with me), lying and committing adultery is just as bad as murdering someone. It doesn't matter what the sin is, it's still a sin. Homosexuality is a sin. Gays are sinners. Pride is a sin. I tend to be boastful about the things I've accomplished. I don't mean it to be bad or to hurt anyone, but it's still pride and it's still a sin. So, if their sin (homosexuality) prevents them from getting married in the church, shouldn't it follow that my sin (pride) ought to have the same effect on me? Why should one sinner be allowed to marry religiously, and another not?
And finally, in response to your last paragraph: you know I wouldn't say that to you, or anyone else. But let me tell you something...the fact that I wouldn't say it to someone doesn't mean I wouldn't think it. It doesn't mean I wouldn't pray for that person to see things differently or come to Christ, and it doesn't mean that I don't care what happens to him when he dies. But let me ask you this (and please let me know!). You know you can have these conversations with me and not be judged or personally attacked. If you were an atheist or at least a non-believer, to which approach do you think you would respond better? I honestly believe that if you want people to buy what you're selling, you can't force it on them like some Christians try to do. Now, if you were an atheist, you may not buy it at all, but I think, instead of hating Christians and thinking they were all just stupid holy rollers, you'd at least be inclined to have some degree of religious tolerance.
Wow...this is definitely the most I've ever blogged. Let me know what you think, and if I've been as clear as mud. Again, not saying you have to agree, just asking if you understand what I mean.
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I'm kind of torn on the issue, because what you said is true - the Bible states that man and woman are to be together to procreate and all that jazz. However, because I've studied the scientifics of homosexuality in my Psych classes, Philosophy classes, Bio classes, and other random articles I've found, it's hard for me to accept that people can be sinners due to something in their genes. Of course, then you can come back at me with the statement that sociopaths who kill others aren't sinners then, because there's something in their genes that make them that way, so I don't know.
Nevertheless, I feel like if a homosexual is Christian, then they should be entitled to a Christian ceremony, whether that be "marriage" or a "union." Personally, I've always viewed civil unions as the type of ceremonies people have if they don't believe in God, are going shotgun, are eloping, etc. I know that if I was gay, I'd be pissed off if I couldn't have a Christian ceremony - I have a hard enough time accepting that I might not have a Christian ceremony now and I'm straight, haha. Also, I believe that there are horrible, terrible people in this world getting married in the church sometimes - people who have murdered, people who have been adulterous, what have you - so like you've stated, why are they more entitled to a Christian wedding than possibly two homosexuals who love one another more than the murderer or the adulterer might love their SO?
At the same time, I don't think that every church has to be accepting of it, because it really is how one interprets the Bible. I think that it's a decision each individual church has to make and, once that decision is made, the congregation or surrounding community shouldn't judge. To tell you the truth, I think I'd be uncomfortable sitting through a gay ceremony, but only because I'm not comfortable with the idea of myself ever being gay - I'm just plain old not attracted to other women, so the thought of me ever, you know, getting personal with one gives me the heebie jeebies. But that doesn't mean that other people would be uncomfortable, and it doesn't mean that homosexuals shouldn't be allowed to celebrate one another in a ceremony that may or may not celebrate their religious beliefs. Like I said before, I'd hate thinking I'd have to "settle," so to speak, on a certain kind of ceremony just because that's what the law or the church is making me do, even if I believe in something different.
Anyhoo - that's just my opinion. Even so, I can understand where people who don't want gay marriage in their church are coming from, just because I'm Christian and have studied the Bible. I suppose it really is just how literal you want to take everything in it, which is different for everyone. I'll admit part of my thinking concerning the gay marriage issue is because if we followed everything the Bible said, we wouldn't be allowed to touch anything while we were menstruating, nor should we have sex in the process, and also after giving birth, we wouldn't be allowed to touch anything for 40 or so days after giving birth to a boy. And if we did, it would have to cleansed. I don't know about you, but that whole process would depress me, haha.
In addition, there are lots of things concerning the Christian faith in general that I'm not sure can be interpreted as 100% truth. I mean, Catholicism just got rid of limbo after how many centuries. Granted their reason was that limbo is never mentioned in the Bible itself and was only used to extort money from worshippers, but still. I just overall feel that if someone accepts God as their Savior, and lives life to the best of their abilities without damaging another person's life, then everything will work out.
Oh, well. As long as people are educated enough that they don't run around calling people "dark-sided" just because others celebrate the Summer Solstice and then proclaim themselves "God Warriors," I think their opinions are important :oP
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See, for the most part I'm with you. But when it comes to homosexuality being genetic, again, if you take it from a biblical standpoint, almost any sin comes naturally, including sexual immorality. Straight people who don't wish to engage in premarital sex have to make a genuine effort to keep their other desires in check. A person who lies has to make an effort to be truthful. If being gay is really a sin, then I think gay Christians are in a constant state of sin. They commit their sins knowing full well that the church is (or, in my opinion, should be) against it, but they make no effort to repent because they like their lifestyle. As opposed to the axe murderer, who actually may have a chemical imbalance that he can't control. I firmly believe that homosexuality is different, and that if a person truly wants to do so, they can choose not to act on thier gayness. That's not to say that they wouldn't still be gay, but it is to say they would be doing their best to repent from the sin. I don't know if that made sense, but I'm trying.
I have the same issue with the ordination of homosexual ministers and priests. I think it's all right to ordain gays...IF they're doing their best not to engage in that sort of sexual activity. Granted, everyone's a sinner, and it goes back to the whole if it's a sin, it's a sin. I wouldn't want a pastor that embezzels the church money, or lies to people consistently--or openly has a gay life partner, because if the preacher isn't trying to repent, why should the rest of us? You can't lead by example if you're running a "Do as I say, not as I do" show.
I have to get going for now because my mom and I are going shopping for my wedding dress. I'll catch you both later!
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First, I have to say that if I were an atheist, I would DEFINITELY rather deal with a tolerant Christian than an intolerant one. As you say, I might not change my beliefs, but I at least wouldn't be totally turned OFF by Christianity. Like anything else in life, it's easier to catch a fly with honey than with vinegar.
Secondly, with regards to gay marriage, I think it's likely that we'll never come to any kind of agreement on it, because we have a fundamentally different point of view. In my opinion, being gay isn't a choice. I firmly believe that homosexuality is just as much a part of a person's eyes as freckles or green eyes. If that's the case, I can't believe that God would punish someone for something He made a part of their personality. I realize that He wants us to struggle against our sins, but in that case, I don't belive it's a sin. Maybe, as you say below, someone who is gay should just never act on it in order to live a Godly life...but I don't think God (if He's as kind and loving as everyone says) would create a person and then say to him or her "Here's how I made you. Now, you will NEVER be allowed to be in love or have a relationship or anything like that. You must always be alone or else I will send you to hell." The Divine Being that I believe in wouldn't be that cruel.
I agree with a lot of what your friend fotokween says--she has some really interesting opinions. I think each church should be allowed to decide how they feel about gay marriage. If a church doesn't believe in it, if they think it's wrong, they should NOT be forced to accept it. What I'm saying is that LEGALLY, churches should not be allowed to pressure the government into making something illegal just because they don't believe in it. Religiously, people can believe anything they want--it's America, and they have that right. However, there is supposed to be a separation of church and state in this country that I see getting a bit wobbly.
Maybe I feel differently about this issue because I've had gay family members and many gay friends, and I can't imagine why God would want to punish them just for being who they are--they're good people. And, because I live in Massachusetts, I have seen the results of having gay marriage legalized...there really aren't any. We haven't had raining sulfur or the total dissolution of the "family." In fact, NOTHING has really changed for most of the population. The only change has really been for those people who are now allowed to make a lifetime commitment to the person they love. So my point is, why not make it legal, if it's not hurting anyone?
(Also, I definitely agree with fotokween--if we actually followed most of the stuff in the Old Testament, we'd still be walking through the streets in sackcloth, rending our hair and yelling "Unclean!" every time we had the flu or got our periods...generally, when it comes to the Bible, I tend to put more emphasis on the New Testament, which is all about faith and being a kind, good person than about smoting other people.)
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"Fotokween" is my friend Jenn. We were sorority sisters in college. You might be interested in her site, jennyhats.com, as she is an entrepreneur in the art of crochet.
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