Buffy, Riley (yes, Riley) and Spike (1/2): Not-Entirely Random (Feminist) Ramblings

[red_satin_doll]

When it comes to BtVS, I'd promised myself that I would not write on my own journal here about subjects that are generally quite well-worn and have been discussed at length - and with great intellegence - by other people. Nevermind that I'll rant or blather at length about a variety of subjects (the comics, the episode AYW, etc etc) on other people

Comments

[red_satin_doll]

Her affair with Spike was all about trying to "feel", after all. She needed the tactility of their relationship (… violent sex) to make her feel connected and maybe tethered to something, but that also had the adverse effect of leaving her even more adrift.

I agree with that entire paragraph there - "splitting oneself into two" seems to be a major theme on the show from WTTH when Buffy first encounters Giles. (Her speech to him in that scene is what sold me on the show right off the bat.)

Word to this. Spike is my favourite dude on the show and one of my favourites… ever. But he still doesn't beat out Buffy...it is bothersome and says troubling things about fandom's attitude to men and women. : \

Word back. I think what you're saying here connects to what I said upthread to norwie_2010 and eilowyn about the relative awareness of women to their own issues in RL politics.

I do get what you're saying about S3 re: Angel, but I actually thought the Buffy/Faith arc was really important to Buffy's character? I didn't feel that her story was being taken over (by Faith) or anything. It was really just the Angel/Buffy that was problematic in that regard.

I probably should have clarified myself better in that regard. I DO think Buffy/Faith is very important to both of their arcs. I was thinking in terms of the Angel storyline and may not have made that clear, sorry. I could probably stand to do a S3 rewatch (which I did not do before I wrote this.) I think my memory of the season was that the time spent on Angel actually robbed some of the time that could have been spent on BuffyFaith but that's just my memory and I may be wrong.

I actually want to do some meta just on Buffy and Faith - Buffy is, in Buffyverse terms, Faith's grandsire (grandmother?).

And wasn't Riley's whole huffy exit precisely the result of him feeling that she was ~neglecting him in favour of more important people in her life? IDGI.

Yes, it was, wasn't it? This may be slightly OT but I just rewatched Doomed in S4, and there's a scene where Riley point blank calls Buffy "stupid", self-centered, etc for rejecting trying a relationship with him and not giving him a chance; and that if she sees people and her life in a negative life that's what she's going to get back. I know there's truth to what he says but the WAY he does it, when he knows nothing of the circumstances and hardly knows her (which she calls him on, btw) really bothered me. He was being patronizing, belittling, shaming her for her feelings, and essentially telling her that she was wrong not to give him a chance. Because, you know, he's a great guy, and she SHOULD do what he wants. By the end of Doomed he's rewarded with a kiss and her opening herself up to him. I find that extremely objectionable.

And oddly, it occured to me watching it that there is a little bit of that in what Spike does in S5-6: "I'm in LOVE with you, therefore you ought to love me back, you know you are," etc. I think the difference is that Spike figures out his mistake, Riley never does.