Trolls in my inbox!
Or: how does this shit find me?
So, I'm looking at a bulletin post from Saul Williams which talks about his personal ideology and how that relates to the food that he consumes. At the end of this, he asks which books other people have read lately. So I comment that I've just finished Animal, Vegetable, Miracle by Barbara Kingsolver, a book about sustainable farming practices and locavory. That's all! It is obvious from that comment that I am trying to destroy the world, because I then received the following message from a fellow who calls himself, "Ideology of the Penis":
Saw your comment to the saul williams post and knew your reference. I have read and the majority of the book and though i agree with it i also have to point out the horrible fact today that even if america were to apply that philosophy, The idea of growing our own crops and cattle for those who eat meat would cause a downward spiral in not only the economy of america, but also a sociological failing, because the secondary benefit of importing foods from other countries is the grasping of the many foreign groups present in america today.
hope to here your opinion
Cheshire's Grin
Now, I'm not typically too enthralled with people who proudly declare, "Hey! I have a penis!" Isn't that neat-o!? Super cool!" I mean, you know: roughly half of the population does. It's not an achievement. But I'm even more bothered by the incoherent grammar, punctuation and mechanics of the message. Especially the random capitalization, or lack of. I just feel that making an argument in bad English does not do much good in convincing your opponent of the value of your ideas. And this... I have trouble figuring out what, exactly, he is trying to communicate. I think that he means to say that by buying foreign foods, America's economy benefits and so do foreign economies? I think.
And that's a shame, because it's grossly misinformed. Foreign farmers, unless protected by fair trade policies, receive so little in compensation for growing that food. Mostly, that money lines the pockets of the CEO's of food corporations. And the cost of shipping those products here to us comes out of our pockets: our tax dollars subsidize the cost of the gasoline it takes to transport that food and keep it cool.
Anyway, I replied. I know, I know: never argue with a troll. Ignore, ignore. But I couldn't -- not when he brought his ignorance to my doorstep. (Also the reason that I argue with missionaries.) Also, I feel that sometimes, ignorance is born out of rationalization and fear of change. I guess I'm an optimist; I'd like to help people hope for something better. So, I wrote:
What benefit is that, keeping other peoples reliant on the promise of America's wealth? Wouldn't it be much better if we could all provide for our own? My Costa Rican students tell me that they never could eat pineapple at home, because the best came here and only the worst -- worm eaten and pulpy -- was left for them. And the promise of America's wealth is failing. Our economy is nearly dead anyway and the price of food is going up while the quality and quantity is going down. How can we help to put money in the pockets of farmers from other countries if we can't even support our own?
It's not that I disagree with you totally -- I'm not a total locavore and I do buy bananas. But it's unlikely that all Americans will suddenly change their lifestyles in one moment, and so I don't think that does logistically present any real threat to the American food economy. Or at least, not one that can't be managed and accepted over time. It happened in the seventies! And the fifties. And the thirties. And the twenties. I believe that economic change is something that people can come through, and in this case, perhaps healthier and heartier.
Peace.
I am in the process of changing my own food buying habits: I found a farm four miles from here which sells elk, beef, chicken, milk and eggs which come from livestock that was raised organically and sustainably: no antibiotics or hormones or animal by-products were fed to the animals and the animals were free-range during their lifetimes. (I had a chance to look around the farm and to prove that this was true.) I'm ignorant of the exact process by which farmers can get a certification of having organic livestock, but I do know that it is a difficult and expensive process. And so, in the future, I will be buying the majority of my meat, milk and eggs from this farm. I am very happy to support a local effort to better the world through better and more ethical, natural farming practices. Plus, it's the best quality steak I've eaten. I can't wait to cook the elk.
As for my fruit and vegetable buying habits: well, I'm working on it. I was happy to find organic peaches at the grocery store, but I was sad to see that they had come from California. Peaches are in season right now in this part of Colorado. Why ship them from California when they're right here? I bought them anyway. I'll look for a farmer's market this weekend.
All of that is to say, of course, that it's hard to find out the dirty truth behind your food and to change your eating habits. Where does one begin? And if your local markets are limited, what do you do? And how do you afford fresh, organic food if you don't have much money? I'm hopeful about it, though. This change in my eating habits started in a microbrewery and I'm carrying it further, now. If I can buy a few things that are local and farmed with the future in mind, I can feel good about the impact that I'm making on the earth and hopefully have some part of it left for my children.
There is so much to say on the subject of food, and Barbara Kingsolver says it all much better than I can. It's a shame that "Ideology of the Penis" feels that being self-sufficient and aware of our food's origins and proactive about obtaining local food is going to destroy the world. (Personally, I find it to be a bit racist as well -- a sort of: "Foreign brown people need us to buy their food or they'll die! Let's maintain that oppressive system rather than finding one that benefits us all!") It's a shame that he thinks that America's economy will collapse when we'll actually be buttressing it by buying American. It's a shame that this sort of thinking pervades our society and makes us resistant to the changes that will benefit us, that will help us to find global solutions for what is becoming a global crisis.
But, I guess that's what I should expect from a troll who really, really loves his penis.
______________________
UPDATE! The troll replies:
True in a lot of countries the idea of exporting for the funds to support the economy is seen time and time again. But you also have to take in consideration of countries like thailand, a country that produces its seafood exports at such a rate that only about a third of the total product ever leaves the country and it does the people a load of good. Being there the only thing that i saw to be lack was the lack of non petroleum fuel based transportation.
I... what? I feel awful, but I really have no clue at all what, exactly, he is trying to say. What?
So, I'm looking at a bulletin post from Saul Williams which talks about his personal ideology and how that relates to the food that he consumes. At the end of this, he asks which books other people have read lately. So I comment that I've just finished Animal, Vegetable, Miracle by Barbara Kingsolver, a book about sustainable farming practices and locavory. That's all! It is obvious from that comment that I am trying to destroy the world, because I then received the following message from a fellow who calls himself, "Ideology of the Penis":
Saw your comment to the saul williams post and knew your reference. I have read and the majority of the book and though i agree with it i also have to point out the horrible fact today that even if america were to apply that philosophy, The idea of growing our own crops and cattle for those who eat meat would cause a downward spiral in not only the economy of america, but also a sociological failing, because the secondary benefit of importing foods from other countries is the grasping of the many foreign groups present in america today.
hope to here your opinion
Cheshire's Grin
Now, I'm not typically too enthralled with people who proudly declare, "Hey! I have a penis!" Isn't that neat-o!? Super cool!" I mean, you know: roughly half of the population does. It's not an achievement. But I'm even more bothered by the incoherent grammar, punctuation and mechanics of the message. Especially the random capitalization, or lack of. I just feel that making an argument in bad English does not do much good in convincing your opponent of the value of your ideas. And this... I have trouble figuring out what, exactly, he is trying to communicate. I think that he means to say that by buying foreign foods, America's economy benefits and so do foreign economies? I think.
And that's a shame, because it's grossly misinformed. Foreign farmers, unless protected by fair trade policies, receive so little in compensation for growing that food. Mostly, that money lines the pockets of the CEO's of food corporations. And the cost of shipping those products here to us comes out of our pockets: our tax dollars subsidize the cost of the gasoline it takes to transport that food and keep it cool.
Anyway, I replied. I know, I know: never argue with a troll. Ignore, ignore. But I couldn't -- not when he brought his ignorance to my doorstep. (Also the reason that I argue with missionaries.) Also, I feel that sometimes, ignorance is born out of rationalization and fear of change. I guess I'm an optimist; I'd like to help people hope for something better. So, I wrote:
What benefit is that, keeping other peoples reliant on the promise of America's wealth? Wouldn't it be much better if we could all provide for our own? My Costa Rican students tell me that they never could eat pineapple at home, because the best came here and only the worst -- worm eaten and pulpy -- was left for them. And the promise of America's wealth is failing. Our economy is nearly dead anyway and the price of food is going up while the quality and quantity is going down. How can we help to put money in the pockets of farmers from other countries if we can't even support our own?
It's not that I disagree with you totally -- I'm not a total locavore and I do buy bananas. But it's unlikely that all Americans will suddenly change their lifestyles in one moment, and so I don't think that does logistically present any real threat to the American food economy. Or at least, not one that can't be managed and accepted over time. It happened in the seventies! And the fifties. And the thirties. And the twenties. I believe that economic change is something that people can come through, and in this case, perhaps healthier and heartier.
Peace.
I am in the process of changing my own food buying habits: I found a farm four miles from here which sells elk, beef, chicken, milk and eggs which come from livestock that was raised organically and sustainably: no antibiotics or hormones or animal by-products were fed to the animals and the animals were free-range during their lifetimes. (I had a chance to look around the farm and to prove that this was true.) I'm ignorant of the exact process by which farmers can get a certification of having organic livestock, but I do know that it is a difficult and expensive process. And so, in the future, I will be buying the majority of my meat, milk and eggs from this farm. I am very happy to support a local effort to better the world through better and more ethical, natural farming practices. Plus, it's the best quality steak I've eaten. I can't wait to cook the elk.
As for my fruit and vegetable buying habits: well, I'm working on it. I was happy to find organic peaches at the grocery store, but I was sad to see that they had come from California. Peaches are in season right now in this part of Colorado. Why ship them from California when they're right here? I bought them anyway. I'll look for a farmer's market this weekend.
All of that is to say, of course, that it's hard to find out the dirty truth behind your food and to change your eating habits. Where does one begin? And if your local markets are limited, what do you do? And how do you afford fresh, organic food if you don't have much money? I'm hopeful about it, though. This change in my eating habits started in a microbrewery and I'm carrying it further, now. If I can buy a few things that are local and farmed with the future in mind, I can feel good about the impact that I'm making on the earth and hopefully have some part of it left for my children.
There is so much to say on the subject of food, and Barbara Kingsolver says it all much better than I can. It's a shame that "Ideology of the Penis" feels that being self-sufficient and aware of our food's origins and proactive about obtaining local food is going to destroy the world. (Personally, I find it to be a bit racist as well -- a sort of: "Foreign brown people need us to buy their food or they'll die! Let's maintain that oppressive system rather than finding one that benefits us all!") It's a shame that he thinks that America's economy will collapse when we'll actually be buttressing it by buying American. It's a shame that this sort of thinking pervades our society and makes us resistant to the changes that will benefit us, that will help us to find global solutions for what is becoming a global crisis.
But, I guess that's what I should expect from a troll who really, really loves his penis.
______________________
UPDATE! The troll replies:
True in a lot of countries the idea of exporting for the funds to support the economy is seen time and time again. But you also have to take in consideration of countries like thailand, a country that produces its seafood exports at such a rate that only about a third of the total product ever leaves the country and it does the people a load of good. Being there the only thing that i saw to be lack was the lack of non petroleum fuel based transportation.
I... what? I feel awful, but I really have no clue at all what, exactly, he is trying to say. What?