"glory always makes the blood of women flow."
I generally don't like ranting about things I dislike (because ranting about things I like is just so much more fun). But. Unconditional Supernatural love just sets me off.
This site is wondering if Supernatural is as good as Buffy. And, um, no? A world of no, even. How can anyone even compare something as misogynistic and sexist as Supernatural to something that's considered to be as groundbreaking as Buffy in terms of introducing a female heroic journey into mainstream culture? That's, like, comparing James Baldwin to freaking Ernest Hemingway. (I am, of course, aware that there were things that paved way for Buffy, but I'm particularly looking at mythic narratives). What surprised me even more is that there is a large percentage of people on Whedonesque claiming that yes, it is better, and almost everyone is professing his/her love for Supernatural.
I mean, okay, I have no problem with people who watch Supernatural and like it. But people who watch it and deny that it has a serious problem with women? I very possibly like them less than I did before. I'm generally amazed by how many people don't have a problem with Supernatural's issues with women.
The whole premise of the show is based on a very Women in Refrigerators death of the mother so the father and the heroes can be motivated to hunt the demons. The first episode also sees the death of the second son's girlfriend so he can be properly motivated by it to join the family business. One of the main characters, Dean, is so cocky and sexist that there's a scene where he's threatening a girl with information that he has on her (so, yeah, the girl is morally ambiguous and sort of evil), and he's being very physical with her and sort of pulls her towards him (and yes, it does look like there might be some hate-make-out session here), and she is unnerved by it and says, "What the hell are you doing?" And he replies with, "Don't flatter yourself." So she thinks that he is possibly going to force himself on her, and he thinks she's *flattering* herself? By thinking that he thinks she's hot enough to force himself on? Just. No. How can anyone not hate this character? And this is just from a scene someone linked me to. I disliked this character a lot more, I'm sure, when I was watching the show, and I'm sure there were other things like this that I've repressed.
And then people who like the show blame the misogyny on the female fans of the show, who are very vocally against adding female characters to the show. But the writers are certainly to blame for this as well because they give into their demands every. single. time. Every time this show has attempted to add a female to the cast, she's met with an obscure or a tragic ending because the fans can't stand the girls getting in the way of their incest subtext between two brothers, and the writers are not willing to put up with any sort of negativity from the idiot fans.
I watched it, I liked it, but it's just not good enough for me to put up with one dead and possibly mutilated woman per week so the heroes can be even more motivated to be heroic while the women continue to be victims and villains. And every decent, fun, interesting female character this show has introduced has disappeared never to be seen again. Which is a shame. I could've loved these characters, and could've liked the show because of them. But out of the three girls that I found interesting on this show, all three have disappeared. Jo was written out just as she was beginning to get interesting and growing into her character. The girl who shared Sam's visions and issues turned out to be the evil hussy of the second season finale, which is what led me to stop watching. I was intrigued by the descriptions of Bela I read on my friendslist and was possibly going to give the show another try if Bela and the other female character they added to the show survived the season. Which, of course, did not happen.
In conclusion, I share with you the following quote of brilliance from that discussion:
I enjoy Supernatural more than I ever did "Buffy." The only reason I liked Buffy was for Spike, and they treated him awful. At least with Supernatural I can relax and enjoy the stories and not be frustrated at the end of each episode. Supernatural has a great story and 2 great actors that are equally cute and entertaining. So my answer to the question "Is Supernatural as good as Buffy?" is a big YES.
Yeah, people who watched Buffy for Spike and thought he was treated awfully (awfully being that they added Spike to Angel while taking out Cordelia and Lilah because apparently, Spike hadn't reached the end of his journey when he died and Cordelia had ended her journey by being possessed and impregnated by a demon) are exactly the kind of people I would expect unconditional Supernatural love from.
This site is wondering if Supernatural is as good as Buffy. And, um, no? A world of no, even. How can anyone even compare something as misogynistic and sexist as Supernatural to something that's considered to be as groundbreaking as Buffy in terms of introducing a female heroic journey into mainstream culture? That's, like, comparing James Baldwin to freaking Ernest Hemingway. (I am, of course, aware that there were things that paved way for Buffy, but I'm particularly looking at mythic narratives). What surprised me even more is that there is a large percentage of people on Whedonesque claiming that yes, it is better, and almost everyone is professing his/her love for Supernatural.
I mean, okay, I have no problem with people who watch Supernatural and like it. But people who watch it and deny that it has a serious problem with women? I very possibly like them less than I did before. I'm generally amazed by how many people don't have a problem with Supernatural's issues with women.
The whole premise of the show is based on a very Women in Refrigerators death of the mother so the father and the heroes can be motivated to hunt the demons. The first episode also sees the death of the second son's girlfriend so he can be properly motivated by it to join the family business. One of the main characters, Dean, is so cocky and sexist that there's a scene where he's threatening a girl with information that he has on her (so, yeah, the girl is morally ambiguous and sort of evil), and he's being very physical with her and sort of pulls her towards him (and yes, it does look like there might be some hate-make-out session here), and she is unnerved by it and says, "What the hell are you doing?" And he replies with, "Don't flatter yourself." So she thinks that he is possibly going to force himself on her, and he thinks she's *flattering* herself? By thinking that he thinks she's hot enough to force himself on? Just. No. How can anyone not hate this character? And this is just from a scene someone linked me to. I disliked this character a lot more, I'm sure, when I was watching the show, and I'm sure there were other things like this that I've repressed.
And then people who like the show blame the misogyny on the female fans of the show, who are very vocally against adding female characters to the show. But the writers are certainly to blame for this as well because they give into their demands every. single. time. Every time this show has attempted to add a female to the cast, she's met with an obscure or a tragic ending because the fans can't stand the girls getting in the way of their incest subtext between two brothers, and the writers are not willing to put up with any sort of negativity from the idiot fans.
I watched it, I liked it, but it's just not good enough for me to put up with one dead and possibly mutilated woman per week so the heroes can be even more motivated to be heroic while the women continue to be victims and villains. And every decent, fun, interesting female character this show has introduced has disappeared never to be seen again. Which is a shame. I could've loved these characters, and could've liked the show because of them. But out of the three girls that I found interesting on this show, all three have disappeared. Jo was written out just as she was beginning to get interesting and growing into her character. The girl who shared Sam's visions and issues turned out to be the evil hussy of the second season finale, which is what led me to stop watching. I was intrigued by the descriptions of Bela I read on my friendslist and was possibly going to give the show another try if Bela and the other female character they added to the show survived the season. Which, of course, did not happen.
In conclusion, I share with you the following quote of brilliance from that discussion:
I enjoy Supernatural more than I ever did "Buffy." The only reason I liked Buffy was for Spike, and they treated him awful. At least with Supernatural I can relax and enjoy the stories and not be frustrated at the end of each episode. Supernatural has a great story and 2 great actors that are equally cute and entertaining. So my answer to the question "Is Supernatural as good as Buffy?" is a big YES.
Yeah, people who watched Buffy for Spike and thought he was treated awfully (awfully being that they added Spike to Angel while taking out Cordelia and Lilah because apparently, Spike hadn't reached the end of his journey when he died and Cordelia had ended her journey by being possessed and impregnated by a demon) are exactly the kind of people I would expect unconditional Supernatural love from.