DWM Mighty 200 - Top Ten Watchathon: Human Nature (Family of Blood) (#6) Reaction Post
Who_Daily Link: < a href="http://persiflage-1.livejournal.com/311737.html">DWM Mighty 200 - Top Ten Watchathon: #6 Reaction Post by < lj user=persiflage_1
( Read more... )
Martha and Jenny having to sit outside the pub to have a drink
I never saw of the significance of that till now. Ugh.
who's he telepathically picking up those thoughts from?
I always thought he was a precog as well as a thought sensitive. But sensitivity could account for everything he knows, without precognition, if the visions of WWI come from the watch.
John Smith's patronising 'cultural differences' makes me sympathise with Martha
And Joan ought to know it's not true, too, because Martha told her the book was just stories when John lent it to her.
Martha's 'Oh, do you think?' ... always makes me cheer. Lady, you've just been pwned!
When Joan refers to Martha's color, I think Martha ought to have retorted, "I'm from the year 2007," and let Joan stew with that. I put a line like that in, in the AU where the Family never did show up.
John knows Ten won't love Joan, yet later Ten begs Joan to travel with him.
You know, that's weird. The way it's played, it's not as if the Doctor loves her the way Smith did, yet this incarnation is all Mr. Don't Need Anybody. Is he actually invested in her at all? How? Or is he trying to be nice, cluelessly offering Joan the chance to be constantly reminded of the man she loved who never really existed? Why is he trying to be nice - because he hurt her, however accidentally? I really don't grok it. If you're of the school of thought that he knows damn well he's leading Martha on and doesn't care except about his own ego, then it's even reprehensible to her.
Reply
Yeah, I confess I noticed things that made me think this time around that I hadn't really thought about in previous re-watches.
I always thought he was a precog as well as a thought sensitive. But sensitivity could account for everything he knows, without precognition, if the visions of WWI come from the watch.
Given they're visions of *himself* as opposed to anything to do with the
Doctor's life, I think I'd go for him also being a precog...
And Joan ought to know it's not true, too, because Martha told her the book was just stories when John lent it to her.
Yes, exactly!
When Joan refers to Martha's color, I think Martha ought to have retorted, "I'm from the year 2007," and let Joan stew with that.
Yes!
I put a line like that in, in the AU where the Family never did show up.
Ooh, I'll take a look at that...
You know, that's weird. The way it's played, it's not as if the Doctor loves her the way Smith did, yet this incarnation is all Mr. Don't Need Anybody. Is he actually invested in her at all? How? Or is he trying to be nice, cluelessly offering Joan the chance to be constantly reminded of the man she loved who never really existed? Why is he trying to be nice - because he hurt her, however accidentally? I really don't grok it. If you're of the school of thought that he knows damn well he's leading Martha on and doesn't care except about his own ego, then it's even reprehensible to her.
If I'm feeling generous, I might believe he's cluelessly trying to be nice to her - but I actually don't believe that he is half as clueless as he likes to make out. I just don't know what was in his head at that point...
Reply
Yeah. It's one of those moments when one can only guess what's going through the Doctor's head:
a)He hopes to save her from the hardship of living through WW1; she's already lost so much.
b)Although he represses it, he is capable of romance and his memories of what he went through as John pushes him to take the leap.
c)He's so out of touch with human feelings that he believes he can fix things and make Joan happy by taking her on his travels and doesn't realise how hurtful just facing him is for her.
d)John Smith is right and the Doctor can't love someone like he loved Joan, but the Doctor doesn't want to believe it and is rebelling
He's trying to be kind, but doesn't understand Joan's/human feelings well enough to realise he's hurting her.
Reply
I want to know if he even bothered to properly discuss giving Joan that invitation with Martha. Because, given the way Joan's behaves towards Martha, which Ten MUST remember, he must've known it was going to make for an uncomfortable atmosphere on the TARDIS - or was he just planning to drop Martha back home after Farringham?
Reply
Nah, when he returned to the TARDIS, the firsr thing Martha said was along the lines of: "What did she say? Do you want me to go and-?". Martha's selflessness and forgiving nature really struck me in that moment; how she could be in love with the Doctor and still try to help him make amends with Joan.
Reply
Yeah, that is a mystery.
Nah, when he returned to the TARDIS, the firsr thing Martha said was along the lines of: "What did she say? Do you want me to go and-?". Martha's selflessness and forgiving nature really struck me in that moment; how she could be in love with the Doctor and still try to help him make amends with Joan.
Oh, I agree Martha's completely selfless and forgiving - more than Ten deserves. But I can't help thinking that Joan would've tried to carry on treating Martha as a skivvy - that's how she's seen her for the past two and a bit months, after all - which would've made things awkward between the two women (and of course, Ten would've just ignored it like he tries to ignore everything that makes him uncomfortable).
Reply
Heh, if it were just a case of two people disliking each other you're right that Ten would be a terrible mediator. But he is protective of his friends and I don't think he'd allow Joan to be unkind to Martha. He gave Donna's mother the smackdown, after all.
Reply
Oh, I agree that Joan's not stupid. I don't know - I guess I just find the idea very uncomfortable. Martha had to put up with a hell of a lot for two and a half months, during which time John Smith and Joan either ignored her or treated her badly. I know Martha's selfless and got a generous heart, but I can't imagine it would've been easy for her to have Joan aboard, especially if Ten was trying to rekindle what John Smith felt for her. In Martha's shoes, I wouldn't have stuck around once Joan was aboard (mind you, in Martha's shoes, I'd have slapped John Smith a lot sooner than she did!)
Reply
Absolutely! That's why when Martha said, so casually, that she would talk to Joan for the Doctor, if he wanted, I was completely bowled over. She's just such a good person. End of. But that's almost too selfless. I'm glad that at the end she began to value own happiness more.
Reply
Even though I don't buy the Mr Invisible Fiance (Husband?) of Invisibleness (mainly because it annoys me that we never see anything of this supposed romance), I'm glad that Martha is happy. I'd really like to see her in S5 - being oh-so-calm about meeting Eleven and Amy, and totally pwning yet again.
Reply
I'm the opposite then, I quite like that she hooked up with Tom. First, like you say, the happiness. Also, I liked him in LotTL: cute, moraled, brave, paediatrician? Yes please. Also, I like how she sought him out.
Would have been nice to see a bit more of them as a couple, but I understand why it hasn't happened so far.
Reply
Absolutely! I'd quite like to see them meeting up, and Eleven being just the teeniest bit hurt that Martha's so unfazed by his change and Martha rolling her eyes and reminding him that she *does* work for UNIT! :D
I'm the opposite then, I quite like that she hooked up with Tom. First, like you say, the happiness. Also, I liked him in LotTL: cute, moraled, brave, paediatrician? Yes please. Also, I like how she sought him out.
Would have been nice to see a bit more of them as a couple, but I understand why it hasn't happened so far.
I've no objection to Tom in principle - although I'm fairly squicked by the idea of her getting together with a man who died for her, who knows nothing about that aspect of things. And strictly speaking, she can't tell him as she'll have signed the Official Secrets Act when she joined UNIT.
Reply
*after The Doctor's Daughter*
Tom: Martha... you're all covered in mud... what happened?
Martha:...never mind. But I could do with a foot massage.
Reply
Tom: Martha... you're all covered in mud... what happened?
Martha:...never mind. But I could do with a foot massage.
Heh... Good job she cleaned up before she got home, really!
Reply
Leave a comment