SPN meta: Dean and His Deal

[patita_fea]

Dean and His Deal

Why he made it, what it's done to him, and whether he'd do it again

We're coming up on the end of Dean's year, and we've had fifteen episodes to find out how he handles living under a death sentence.  Before Our Darling Show closes the book on this chapter, I'd like to throw in my summary of what this arc has meant for Dean's

Comments

[gwendolyngrace]

Fabulous summary of everything we've been seeing recently in Dean's development as a character and this plot arc in particular

[andromakhe001]

but by the same token, the single image with Lisa and the extended fantasy life with Carmen still don't add up, to me, to Dean wanting to settle down.

I tend to look at both of them as "the road not taken" sort of fantasies. If normal folk dream of being heroes, doesn't it make sense that on the flip side, heroes dream of being normal folk sometimes? Especially under extreme duress(and I think we can say Dean has been under extreme duress both this season and last season). Jensen was asked about the Lisa dream at LA Con I think and unfortunately I can't remember exactly the words he used but he said he didn't play the scene with the intention in mind that this is what Dean really wants.

[starbright73]

Sam has just reached Kohlberg's 6th stadium while Dean is still at 4, knocking at 5.

God, I'm so tired of this fucking Sam bashing I could puke! No-one o these guys are perfect, not by a long shot. But the more Sam is bashed, the more I'm staring to like him. And vice-versa with Dean. I so gotta leve this fandom *cackles*

Yes, Sam is evil, amoral, stupid and a bastard because he considered the solutions of a willing virgin's sacrifice. While Dean had his heart set on saving said virgin. I doubt he'd be so willing if the woman was 55 and well lain *rolls eyes* Jeez!

And we now the results of said decision, don't we? The virgin died anyhow.

[gwendolyngrace]

I'm not bashing Sam at all - though I guess it could come across that way. I agree that as he becomes more ambiguous, he also becomes more interesting.

I think Sam is, at heart, more his father's son in a lot of ways than Dean - for Dean, for a long time, John was a "superhero," and I get the impression that he meant more of a Superman than a Batman. For Sam, John has always been flawed, but he nevertheless inherits John's single-mindedness and his willingness to bend the rules for the sake of the goal.

That's not bashing the character, that's discussing what's making him more morally questionable. The areas in which Dean "fails" to adhere to a societal standard are largely self-reflexive--except where they have to do with Sam. The areas where Sam "fails" to adhere to societal standards have much, much more to do with expedience.

[starbright73]

The thing is that they are at war and Jus in Bello differs from the normal societal norms. And hugely so. In war you have to think strategically and not on individual level. That is the atrocity of war and I think Sam has understood this and yes, he also understands that sacrifice is necessary. It's not noble or beautiful, just necessary. And herein lies the amorality of every war.

I suspect that was why he was so desperate to not become what he do desperately didn't want to become. But in light of Dean's deal - he will go to any length to save his brother. And that will be amoral and I can just see the shit Sam's gonna get for it. Sam's in a situation of lose/lose and the sad thing is that someone else put him there. If he doesn't save Dean, he's an unloving, selfish dipshit, if he saves Dean and goes darkside he's a amoral bastard.

That, per se. must already be hell.

[gwendolyngrace]

Jus in Bello differs from the normal societal norms

I disagree. The whole point of JiB was that it's *never* acceptable or necessary to willingly slaughter even if it's for the good of the "many." The only error in Dean's plan occurred by letting the one demon escape and even then, Lilith already knew where they were and was on her way. They had no control over her murders; they resolved the situation and at the time they left, they had saved *everyone* including Nancy. The Lilith effect would have been the same no matter what.

Here's a rather lengthy, but appropriate, section from bardicvoice's meta on JiB:

Moral and ethical choice lie with each of us. That our enemies may have no moral code does not absolve us of the need and duty to remain true to our own. If we abandon our code because it is inconvenient, because it is painful, or because it is costly, then we abandon ourselves. And it can’t be reduced to a simple numbers game, to some arbitrary ledger and balance sheet of lives saved and lives lost. What we choose to do, and how and why

[starbright73]

You do not have free choice in war - that is romanticizing it too much. You don't even have the rules, those rules have to be written because of the chaos that is war. A war is about life and death, for you. for your family and there are no blurred lines when you're in it. It's black and white, life or death.

Dean lives according to these rules in a para-society of hunter:

Kohlberg's stage 4