Tentacles Of Doom
I got in today and the Corrs were on the radio, singing a song about how "this boy's cracking up". And I thought, excuse me! I don't go on your radio and say "Hey, The Corrs! You absolutely suck and you all look the same and every time I see or hear you I think of that French & Saunders sketch about you!" So could you kindly stop rubbing it in?
Today was a rubbish day, so rubbish that even going off to take some photos in Old Town for Housing Problems didn't cheer me up. (Matthew take note - I will be taking some of Gresham soon, to put up here) I've got a hell of a headache too, for some reason.
Perhaps those people on this LiveJournal who frequent DarkDreams could read this thing I wrote through. I can't decide whether to post it, get someone else to post it or just leave the entire thing in the vaults.
This is a long post. I’m sorry.
I know that this topic will be greeted with a rolling of eyes by some, and that’s fair enough, but I think it has to be discussed for the simple reason that I’ve seen good boards splinter over lesser problems.
I’ve never been involved in any kind of backstage politicking on this board. I know that by the end of his tenure 42ndStreetFreak liked to think that me and Chris and Misery were squirreled away drafting the Protocols of the Elders of DarkDiscussion, but generally any kind of personal animosity between members has been a closed book to me unless someone directly tells me or unless it spills over onto the boards. It goes without saying that I haven’t always had a hefty post count or a set of reputation points or anything like that. The reason why I do now is, I’d like to think, simple. It’s not because I’m special, it’s not because I’m more important than anyone else and it’s not because I did something that I don’t think anyone else could possibly do - it’s because I came in, contributed to discussions and treated people with basic respect.
Nor did I originate these rules. They’ve always been rules. They’ve been rules for far longer than I’ve been here. These rules are not secretive, they’re not available to a select few, they’re not tucked away in a locked filing cabinet in the bowels of the Pentagon along with the Ark of the Covenant and the Roswell UFO. Everyone who signs up is informed of them.
But this is starting to sound like a lecture, and I don’t want to deliver a lecture because I don’t see myself as being on some sort of higher plane of wisdom than everyone else here. The problem is, some people apparently do think that I, and other posters who’ve been around for a similar length of time, do actually think of themselves in that way.
I think the most shocking thing for me personally about the recent trouble has been the revelation that some newer posters believe there is a kind of shared attitude, a shared project, even, between older members to exclude and harass newer members. If this is in any way a prevalent view, then we’re all doing something horribly, horribly wrong.
I never opposed 42ndStreetFreak on the grounds that he was new and I wasn’t, or that I disagreed with his opinions. (In fact, one of my main problems with him was that he couldn’t tell the difference between an opinion and a person - he practiced a kind of Fox News debate where if you don’t like Guy Ritchie it’s because you’re an inherently bad person, or a hypocrite, or you hate America, or whatever gibberish he ended up spouting. By contrast, I don’t think the fact that many other posters consider, say, Irreversible to be a good film and I don’t means that they all have some kind of personal problem. Surely that’s something we can all agree on as a pretext of good debate?)
No, I opposed 42ndStreetFreak on the grounds that he was a mean-spirited, immature little bully who liked to give everyone a faceful of abuse but turned around and cried discrimination as soon as even the most polite criticism of him was voiced. I’m prepared to accept, as Indyrod noted, that he might have had some interesting opinions, but I can’t get past the way he voiced them and I know a lot of other people couldn’t as well.
But this isn’t just about 42ndStreetFreak - he’s gone, hopefully for good. He’s not a relevant issue any more. What I do worry about is the gaping divide he’s opened up in this board between people who feel that his behaviour was unacceptable (like myself, Antoine, and Misery) and people who think he shouldn’t have been banned, or perhaps even warned (like Indyrod and Horror Wizard). The really worrying thing here is that because the people speaking in defence of him are newer members and that people speaking against him are older members, it fosters this idea that the old members aren’t welcoming new members. Two and two equalling five, in my opinion - but then, I would say that, wouldn’t I?
The reason I go to DD - or used to go, anyway - is because it was a friendly place in what can be a pretty unfriendly life. I have a high-stress job at the moment - the last thing I need is to be a member of a high-stress forum. People like Nick and Sandy and Antoine and Jess have worked very hard to make this place one of the warmest and most accepting places on the Internet, and people who defend 42ndStreetFreak’s style as being not bad, just different, are missing what I believe is a crucial point - this is one of the few forums on the Internet which has such a welcoming tone. It’s like, if you will, an apple orchard in a world full of orange trees. And, to stretch this metaphor way beyond its natural lifespan, it seems that people now are saying, “Why don’t we grow more oranges here?” Well, because everywhere else grows oranges. If I want an orange, there’s nothing stopping me going somewhere else for one. This place is special because it’s not like other forums.
But then, it’s easy for me to say it’s friendly and welcoming here because it’s been years since I’ve had to worry about being the new boy. What matters is what direction this forum is going in. It’s my opinion that people like 42ndStreetFreak make the whole place a lot less welcoming to new posters. Others would argue that people like Chris and me make the place a lot less welcoming. Personally, I hate direct confrontation and I hate directly criticising other members. I remember doing it only once, to Annoyed Grunt when we were discussing M Night Shyamalan, and I still regret taking that road. It was stupid and childish and it cheapened my point. Even during Ropes-n-Razors’ brief reign of terror, I didn’t want to come out and directly attack him. But if there’s a time for honesty, it’s now. This is something that I don’t think we can hide in e-mails and PMs and chat sessions any more. It’s time we brought the whole thing right out in the open.
I suppose the question I’m asking here is twofold; firstly, do people really believe that there’s a coterie of older posters who act in a prejudicial way towards new members? Secondly, do people really believe that 42ndStreetFreak’s style of ‘debate’ is something we should be defending and allowing within DD? Because if that’s the direction we’re going in, I want no part in it.
Today was a rubbish day, so rubbish that even going off to take some photos in Old Town for Housing Problems didn't cheer me up. (Matthew take note - I will be taking some of Gresham soon, to put up here) I've got a hell of a headache too, for some reason.
Perhaps those people on this LiveJournal who frequent DarkDreams could read this thing I wrote through. I can't decide whether to post it, get someone else to post it or just leave the entire thing in the vaults.
This is a long post. I’m sorry.
I know that this topic will be greeted with a rolling of eyes by some, and that’s fair enough, but I think it has to be discussed for the simple reason that I’ve seen good boards splinter over lesser problems.
I’ve never been involved in any kind of backstage politicking on this board. I know that by the end of his tenure 42ndStreetFreak liked to think that me and Chris and Misery were squirreled away drafting the Protocols of the Elders of DarkDiscussion, but generally any kind of personal animosity between members has been a closed book to me unless someone directly tells me or unless it spills over onto the boards. It goes without saying that I haven’t always had a hefty post count or a set of reputation points or anything like that. The reason why I do now is, I’d like to think, simple. It’s not because I’m special, it’s not because I’m more important than anyone else and it’s not because I did something that I don’t think anyone else could possibly do - it’s because I came in, contributed to discussions and treated people with basic respect.
Nor did I originate these rules. They’ve always been rules. They’ve been rules for far longer than I’ve been here. These rules are not secretive, they’re not available to a select few, they’re not tucked away in a locked filing cabinet in the bowels of the Pentagon along with the Ark of the Covenant and the Roswell UFO. Everyone who signs up is informed of them.
But this is starting to sound like a lecture, and I don’t want to deliver a lecture because I don’t see myself as being on some sort of higher plane of wisdom than everyone else here. The problem is, some people apparently do think that I, and other posters who’ve been around for a similar length of time, do actually think of themselves in that way.
I think the most shocking thing for me personally about the recent trouble has been the revelation that some newer posters believe there is a kind of shared attitude, a shared project, even, between older members to exclude and harass newer members. If this is in any way a prevalent view, then we’re all doing something horribly, horribly wrong.
I never opposed 42ndStreetFreak on the grounds that he was new and I wasn’t, or that I disagreed with his opinions. (In fact, one of my main problems with him was that he couldn’t tell the difference between an opinion and a person - he practiced a kind of Fox News debate where if you don’t like Guy Ritchie it’s because you’re an inherently bad person, or a hypocrite, or you hate America, or whatever gibberish he ended up spouting. By contrast, I don’t think the fact that many other posters consider, say, Irreversible to be a good film and I don’t means that they all have some kind of personal problem. Surely that’s something we can all agree on as a pretext of good debate?)
No, I opposed 42ndStreetFreak on the grounds that he was a mean-spirited, immature little bully who liked to give everyone a faceful of abuse but turned around and cried discrimination as soon as even the most polite criticism of him was voiced. I’m prepared to accept, as Indyrod noted, that he might have had some interesting opinions, but I can’t get past the way he voiced them and I know a lot of other people couldn’t as well.
But this isn’t just about 42ndStreetFreak - he’s gone, hopefully for good. He’s not a relevant issue any more. What I do worry about is the gaping divide he’s opened up in this board between people who feel that his behaviour was unacceptable (like myself, Antoine, and Misery) and people who think he shouldn’t have been banned, or perhaps even warned (like Indyrod and Horror Wizard). The really worrying thing here is that because the people speaking in defence of him are newer members and that people speaking against him are older members, it fosters this idea that the old members aren’t welcoming new members. Two and two equalling five, in my opinion - but then, I would say that, wouldn’t I?
The reason I go to DD - or used to go, anyway - is because it was a friendly place in what can be a pretty unfriendly life. I have a high-stress job at the moment - the last thing I need is to be a member of a high-stress forum. People like Nick and Sandy and Antoine and Jess have worked very hard to make this place one of the warmest and most accepting places on the Internet, and people who defend 42ndStreetFreak’s style as being not bad, just different, are missing what I believe is a crucial point - this is one of the few forums on the Internet which has such a welcoming tone. It’s like, if you will, an apple orchard in a world full of orange trees. And, to stretch this metaphor way beyond its natural lifespan, it seems that people now are saying, “Why don’t we grow more oranges here?” Well, because everywhere else grows oranges. If I want an orange, there’s nothing stopping me going somewhere else for one. This place is special because it’s not like other forums.
But then, it’s easy for me to say it’s friendly and welcoming here because it’s been years since I’ve had to worry about being the new boy. What matters is what direction this forum is going in. It’s my opinion that people like 42ndStreetFreak make the whole place a lot less welcoming to new posters. Others would argue that people like Chris and me make the place a lot less welcoming. Personally, I hate direct confrontation and I hate directly criticising other members. I remember doing it only once, to Annoyed Grunt when we were discussing M Night Shyamalan, and I still regret taking that road. It was stupid and childish and it cheapened my point. Even during Ropes-n-Razors’ brief reign of terror, I didn’t want to come out and directly attack him. But if there’s a time for honesty, it’s now. This is something that I don’t think we can hide in e-mails and PMs and chat sessions any more. It’s time we brought the whole thing right out in the open.
I suppose the question I’m asking here is twofold; firstly, do people really believe that there’s a coterie of older posters who act in a prejudicial way towards new members? Secondly, do people really believe that 42ndStreetFreak’s style of ‘debate’ is something we should be defending and allowing within DD? Because if that’s the direction we’re going in, I want no part in it.