Wiscon 31: Whither Hero(in)es?
Description: The NBC series Heroes is a mainstream hit. The show is clearly written with a comic book sensibility and strong SF genre influence. But what about the women of Heroes? As the show progresses, are they transcending initial stereotypes (the sex worker, the cheerleader in need of saving)? Do the women enjoy and take advantage of their newly-found powers as effectively as the male characters?
Panelists: Janice M. Eisen (mod), Candra K. Gill, Joanna Lowenstein, Annalee Newitz, Deborah Stone
I took notes, but I can't actually remember who said what for everything, so there will probably be a lot of passive voice in this one.
Spoilers for Heroes S1 (TV AND comics)
I had a lot of fun at this one; Annalee and Candra in particular were awesome panelists (and funny as hell), there was a really enthusiastic audience, and well, it was just great to have an entire room of people thinking about and talking about all the things that have been on my mind while watching the show.
The general consensus of the panel seemed to be that Heroes was trying with their portrayal of women, but that it had fallen into a lot of holes along the way. There was one point in which the panelsts said something along the lines of "We love the show! We don't hate it," possibly in response to an audience member? I don't remember, and I was there yesterday night! Woe!
General trends that were brought up by the panelists and by the audience were that there just weren't enough women on Heroes and definitely nowhere near enough women of color. There was a lot of mention of the stereotypes of women on the show a la the panel description: why are the two main female characters a stripper and a cheerleader?
On the other hand, Candra mentioned that of all the problems that she had with Niki/Jessica, being a sex worker bothered her the least. The panel mentioned that Niki was able to cut off customers that she didn't want and decide on her own hours and really emphasized that she wasn't a traditional stripper. This is, of course, in contrast to "Five Years Gone," when she's introduced to the episode in a strip dance sequence. Oh show. You try so hard, and yet...
ladyjax also spoke up to talk about Claire and how for her (and me, and I think a lot of people), Claire really transcended the original stereotype of the cheerleader. Claire wasn't popular, she only won Homecoming via the geek vote, and she had a mean streak along with a very strong sense of justice and right and wrong. And in general, Claire was a nuanced character who got to grow during the series. Other people pointed out that Claire did grow, but that she was still an adolescent, and as such, always under someone's power, be it Mr. Bennet's or the Petrelli's. They also pointed out that Claire's power is essentially a passive one, though other people mentioned that Claire was starting to learn how to use it in an active way (like jumping out of the window in the finale and wrecking the car?). And even though she has Wolverine's healing power, she still doesn't get the claws.
Someone else mentioned that if you combined Claire's superhealing with Niki/Jessica's superstrength, you'd get Wolverine. And someone brought up how Heroes kept gender switching the traditional X-Men powers.
I think in general people were more iffy about the portrayal of Niki/Jessica and her storyline, partly because most people found her storyline less interesting. Annalee sarcastically commented that Niki/Jessica's superpower was looking into a mirror. There was also a mention of the fact that of course the other women with superpowers was basically insane and how that fit in with the old trope of "Power drives women crazy!" and the unspoken assumption that women can't handle power. Annalee also mentioned that Jessica doesn't even really get to own her own evilness.
An audience member sitting behind me also noted that the two main female characters on the show both were fairly thin with long blonde hair and asked something along the lines of: "Do you only get to be a heroine if you look like Barbie?"
There was also a lot of discussion between Janice and Candra about the character of Hana/Wireless; they were both really frustrated that one of the most active women on the show... wasn't actually on the show. Instead, NBC delivered most of her story via the online comics, and apparently at the end of the season, her physical body died, though her mind still lived on in the network ("She's Motoko from Ghost in the Shell!" yelled Candra). I am now really frustrated as well and am resolved to read her comics. Also, apparently there is a Secret Blog of Wireless' out there, which I now want to find.
There was a little discussion on Molly utilizing the power of cuteness to disarm the men fighting over her and the equation of that with women using whatever tools they had.
Then there was a lot of discussion on Angela Petrelli ("She has a name!" said Candra, to which I very much agree with, even though I still call Mr. Bennet "Mr. Bennet." On the other hand, there are a good number of named male characters on the show). One argument was that she (and so many of the women on the show) fit a role, hers being that of the political wife (others being: mother, cheerleader, stripper, mother, wife). Angela was the manipulator behind the scenes, which was power of a sort, but it was also a rather streotypical sort of power a la Manchurian Candidate. In general, I think people thought that next season would illuminate more about Angela and whether she can be read as a feminist figure or not -- most people seemed to agree that if she took over the reins from Linderman, it would be pretty darn nifty.
Candra also mentioned that out of all the women on the show, Candice seemed to be the one who had most thought about the implications of her power, with the comments on weight and age and race in the show (with a caveat from the audience that of course, Candice was on the side of Eeeevilll).
There was some talk of the male characters, particularly with Hiro as an honorary girl (which I have some problems with because of the whole asexual Asian man stereotype). People also mentioned that the male characters really run a range, from very macho to emo male nurse and Hiro, and that that would be nice for the women, except that would mean needing more female characters on the cast to begin with. Candra also noted that Peter didn't get much respect for being a hospice nurse, despite it being a gruelling job, and how both Peter and other people put Peter down for it (OMG! It is a man taking a female role!). And then someone in the audience jokingly mentioned that Ted Sprague's powers and the uncontrallability of them could be seen as a metaphor for erectile dysfunction ("Or premature ejaculation!" someone else noted).
Strangely, there wasn't all that much talk about Simone, though there was anger at her being the Woman in the Refrigerator and the supportive girlfriend and the only (and now dead) WOC. Ditto with Eden.
I brought up laurashapiro's concerns with macho Future!Hiro and how the show did manage to not go there in "Five Years Gone," along with the argh-ness of the finale, in which Niki is told to go back and protect her family.
And there was much joking around and groaning at some of the plotting and it was quite fun. Except my brain is now dead.
Links:
- mystickeeper's write up
Panelists: Janice M. Eisen (mod), Candra K. Gill, Joanna Lowenstein, Annalee Newitz, Deborah Stone
I took notes, but I can't actually remember who said what for everything, so there will probably be a lot of passive voice in this one.
Spoilers for Heroes S1 (TV AND comics)
I had a lot of fun at this one; Annalee and Candra in particular were awesome panelists (and funny as hell), there was a really enthusiastic audience, and well, it was just great to have an entire room of people thinking about and talking about all the things that have been on my mind while watching the show.
The general consensus of the panel seemed to be that Heroes was trying with their portrayal of women, but that it had fallen into a lot of holes along the way. There was one point in which the panelsts said something along the lines of "We love the show! We don't hate it," possibly in response to an audience member? I don't remember, and I was there yesterday night! Woe!
General trends that were brought up by the panelists and by the audience were that there just weren't enough women on Heroes and definitely nowhere near enough women of color. There was a lot of mention of the stereotypes of women on the show a la the panel description: why are the two main female characters a stripper and a cheerleader?
On the other hand, Candra mentioned that of all the problems that she had with Niki/Jessica, being a sex worker bothered her the least. The panel mentioned that Niki was able to cut off customers that she didn't want and decide on her own hours and really emphasized that she wasn't a traditional stripper. This is, of course, in contrast to "Five Years Gone," when she's introduced to the episode in a strip dance sequence. Oh show. You try so hard, and yet...
ladyjax also spoke up to talk about Claire and how for her (and me, and I think a lot of people), Claire really transcended the original stereotype of the cheerleader. Claire wasn't popular, she only won Homecoming via the geek vote, and she had a mean streak along with a very strong sense of justice and right and wrong. And in general, Claire was a nuanced character who got to grow during the series. Other people pointed out that Claire did grow, but that she was still an adolescent, and as such, always under someone's power, be it Mr. Bennet's or the Petrelli's. They also pointed out that Claire's power is essentially a passive one, though other people mentioned that Claire was starting to learn how to use it in an active way (like jumping out of the window in the finale and wrecking the car?). And even though she has Wolverine's healing power, she still doesn't get the claws.
Someone else mentioned that if you combined Claire's superhealing with Niki/Jessica's superstrength, you'd get Wolverine. And someone brought up how Heroes kept gender switching the traditional X-Men powers.
I think in general people were more iffy about the portrayal of Niki/Jessica and her storyline, partly because most people found her storyline less interesting. Annalee sarcastically commented that Niki/Jessica's superpower was looking into a mirror. There was also a mention of the fact that of course the other women with superpowers was basically insane and how that fit in with the old trope of "Power drives women crazy!" and the unspoken assumption that women can't handle power. Annalee also mentioned that Jessica doesn't even really get to own her own evilness.
An audience member sitting behind me also noted that the two main female characters on the show both were fairly thin with long blonde hair and asked something along the lines of: "Do you only get to be a heroine if you look like Barbie?"
There was also a lot of discussion between Janice and Candra about the character of Hana/Wireless; they were both really frustrated that one of the most active women on the show... wasn't actually on the show. Instead, NBC delivered most of her story via the online comics, and apparently at the end of the season, her physical body died, though her mind still lived on in the network ("She's Motoko from Ghost in the Shell!" yelled Candra). I am now really frustrated as well and am resolved to read her comics. Also, apparently there is a Secret Blog of Wireless' out there, which I now want to find.
There was a little discussion on Molly utilizing the power of cuteness to disarm the men fighting over her and the equation of that with women using whatever tools they had.
Then there was a lot of discussion on Angela Petrelli ("She has a name!" said Candra, to which I very much agree with, even though I still call Mr. Bennet "Mr. Bennet." On the other hand, there are a good number of named male characters on the show). One argument was that she (and so many of the women on the show) fit a role, hers being that of the political wife (others being: mother, cheerleader, stripper, mother, wife). Angela was the manipulator behind the scenes, which was power of a sort, but it was also a rather streotypical sort of power a la Manchurian Candidate. In general, I think people thought that next season would illuminate more about Angela and whether she can be read as a feminist figure or not -- most people seemed to agree that if she took over the reins from Linderman, it would be pretty darn nifty.
Candra also mentioned that out of all the women on the show, Candice seemed to be the one who had most thought about the implications of her power, with the comments on weight and age and race in the show (with a caveat from the audience that of course, Candice was on the side of Eeeevilll).
There was some talk of the male characters, particularly with Hiro as an honorary girl (which I have some problems with because of the whole asexual Asian man stereotype). People also mentioned that the male characters really run a range, from very macho to emo male nurse and Hiro, and that that would be nice for the women, except that would mean needing more female characters on the cast to begin with. Candra also noted that Peter didn't get much respect for being a hospice nurse, despite it being a gruelling job, and how both Peter and other people put Peter down for it (OMG! It is a man taking a female role!). And then someone in the audience jokingly mentioned that Ted Sprague's powers and the uncontrallability of them could be seen as a metaphor for erectile dysfunction ("Or premature ejaculation!" someone else noted).
Strangely, there wasn't all that much talk about Simone, though there was anger at her being the Woman in the Refrigerator and the supportive girlfriend and the only (and now dead) WOC. Ditto with Eden.
I brought up laurashapiro's concerns with macho Future!Hiro and how the show did manage to not go there in "Five Years Gone," along with the argh-ness of the finale, in which Niki is told to go back and protect her family.
And there was much joking around and groaning at some of the plotting and it was quite fun. Except my brain is now dead.
Links:
- mystickeeper's write up