Yet another leftist history lesson brought to you by reality's liberal bias.

[rex_dart]

The Pilgrims Were ... Socialists?Ah, Thanksgiving. A celebration regardless of creed; a time for all Americans to come together after a divisive election year

Comments

[filbypott]

I'm baffled by any attempt to link the Pilgrims to socialism, since they were the direct descendants of Cromwell's Puritan movement, which eventually (IMO) gave rise to modern American conservatism.

[tmlforsyth]

Ayatollah Cromwell seemed more authoritarian and would probably consider Adam Smith as a dangerous non-conformist. He didn't abolish England's ban on Jews, but he was bright enough to look the other way, and his rule did some good for England, but he was a humorless prig and the Brits were very happy to have the Stuarts back.

I could see Cromwell backing socialism as long as it was part of Puritan theocracy and excluded other socialist theocrats, like Jesuits. Oliver would naturally be very anti-social democracy, but he's also be just as contemptuous of libertarianism.

[filbypott]

...yeah, that has the ring of truth to it.

Even so, I still think of Cromwell as the progenitor of American social conservatism, if not fiscal conservatism.

[tmlforsyth]

I'll give you social conservatism, especially considering it's New England roots, though I always thought the fiscal conservatism was more based in classical liberalism. Granted was a radical regicidal rebel in his day, but other Puritans were even more radical.

Granted, the definition of fiscal conservative has shifted as populists like Glen Beck claim the libertarian mantle.

I've always found capitalism more radical than socialism, as socialism has certain roots in very ancient societies, while individualism is a more recent concept. Now corporatism may have older roots, too.

[beoweasel]

but he was a humorless prig and the Brits were very happy to have the Stuarts back.

That's putting it mildly, as a gesture of goodwill to King Charles the Second, Cromwell's body was dug up, hanged, beheaded, and his head stuck on a pike.

[tmlforsyth]

I can be much less mild about Cromwell, especially with my mother being mostly Irish, and my father's Scottish family being Anglicans. Ten years ago, I was quite happy to learn that Cromwell's corpse was given such justice. I am not as cruel now, but I can't say I'm sorry it happened :)

[azetburcaptain]

Yeah, I was wondering about this.