How Half Of America Lost Its F**king Mind

[calinewarkwc69]

I'm going to explain the Donald Trump phenomenon in three movies. And then some text.There's this universal shorthand that epic adventure movies use to tell the good guys from the bad. The good guys are simple folk from the countryside... while the bad guys are decadent assholes who live in the city and wear stupid clothes

Comments

[lightframes]

This might be because it's way too close to the election, and I feel like at some point I could have this conversation with someone similar to the writer of this article, but I'm having a really hard time with this specific writer.

As a black woman (whose voice is basically never heard, so this person isn't going to get any special sympathy points there) who grew up in a very red county in Florida and now lives in a very blue county, I understand the feeling that "nothing outside the city matters," but... you as a person choose how to respond to that. First of all the TV shows was a ridiculous point. I hope nobody out there voted for Trump because they don't like that TV shows are about cities. I have a very thick Southern accent because of where I grew up. "Trial" sounds like "trahl" when I say it. Yep, that accent gets mocked constantly in media. And I laugh! It's funny. But I'm not ashamed of my accent - it's a part of me.

Hurricane Katrina was a better point, but did this person not watch local news? I don't expect national coverage to in detail cover everything that happens close to me.

If you'd asked me at the time, I'd have said the fear and hatred wasn't of people with brown skin, but of that specific tribe they have in Chicago -- you know, the guys with the weird slang, music and clothes, the dope fiends who murder everyone they see. It was all part of the bizarro nature of the cities, as perceived from afar -- a combination of hyper-aggressive savages and frivolous white elites. Their ways are strange. And it wasn't like pop culture was trying to talk me out of it.

Watching this person try to explain away their fear of black people was pretty amusing. Thanks for the laugh!

And that part about not sharing values... part of being a functioning adult means you don't have to share exact values with someone to acknowledge their right to safely exist and do their own thing. That's actually a big part of city life. Isn't that what the author is asking us to do with red county people? Acknowledge them even though our values are different?

So according to Fox News, what's the result of those decadent, atheist, amoral snobs in the cities having turned their noses up at God?

But black people are at the same time blue county/city scourges and somehow are still overwhelmingly Christian. We must be freaking this person out!

I did mostly agree with the part about rural areas being hit hard by the recession.

Blacks burn police cars, and those liberal elites say it's not their fault because they're poor.

Where is all this magic sympathy for black people when we "act out" coming from? This has not been my experience, but sign me up.

TL, DR: People who feel voiceless deserve to be heard, but I don't think fucking up the country (including red counties, because Trump's not going to help them either) is a justifiable response. That's not how an adult acts in a difficult situation. Additionally, it IS a privilege to be able to choose someone who says he will give you jobs at the expense of encouraging white nationalism because you know white nationalism won't negatively impact you. (And this isn't directed at you, OP, I know you know this. I definitely feel like I could have a conversation with someone from my hometown right now, but... not this writer.)

[calinewarkwc69]

I think, in particular, this was referencing white people more so in the rust belt than in the south, and I don't particularly think he was excluding the narrative of POC, but because he is white, was only able to offer that perspective credibly. And when you say "Where is all this magic sympathy for black people when we "act out" coming from?" I think he is referring specifically to the "elite." You know, the white city liberals who go on Facebook and the news and DO fight against harmful racism and stereotypes, and by no means is there any suggestion here that this is not important work. But, what I think happens, is that to the people discussed in this article, as stated, regardless of wrong or right, they feel forgotten, and who goes out and panders to them? The fucking Republicans and Trump's of the world who tell them their hurt is OK to take out in the form of oppressing others so they can get theirs. Instead, we need, and "we" as the left, need to find a way to make OURSELVES the panderers. Surely there is a way to be able to bring in POC AND middle class white people who are ultimately experiencing the same suffering at different crossroads? But none of the Dem's are going into these communities to do that. They are, as always, hoping that pointing out the worst in the opposition will win them morality points-- but the opposition is going to their communities, listening to their problems, and validating their anger. You have to think from their point of view "how can this person be as awful as you say if they will come sit and talk with me and you won't?"

[lightframes]

Regarding your last sentence I don't disagree that Democrats need to win back the working class but at some point voters have to take responsibility for their actions. If I was struggling, and someone came up to me and said "I'll solve all of your problems BUT gay people will lose their rights" I would ask that person to leave me alone. I can't sympathize with someone who's willing to step on others to alleviate their own suffering. I can extend all the empathy I want but it doesn't look like I'll get any back.

[calinewarkwc69]

I said in another thread, but I think it's relevant here as well:

I don't have the answers, I really don't, but fuck me if I am not willing to get into essay long discussions with each and every person trying to figure out. We cannot have white people feeling like it's OK to vote for racism, but at the same time, we cannot keep, as a society, reinforcing "you're racist, you're hateful, you're oppressive" because then what we tell them, in their subconscious processing and creation of logic is that THEY'RE RACIST, THEY'RE HATEFUL, THEY'RE OPPRESSIVE, so in their minds it's like "fuck it, you all think I'm like that anyways, so that's who I'll be and I'll show you what the fuck racist and oppressive looks like!" And POC deserve to be angry for racism and oppression, women deserve to be angry about misogyny, we are allowed to be angry about being marginalized, but this article made me realize, BECAUSE we are all angry and we've been shouting about all the racist/misogynistic/hateful people, we've in a sense marginalized them, and where we're trying to fight against our oppression with Dem's/Clinton, it's almost exactly the same way they're fighting our opinions of them with Rep/Trump.

[lightframes]

I don't agree that by pointing out racism and sexism we've somehow marginalized people who perpetrate it. That's something we're just fundamentally going to disagree on.

I don't think that means Democrats shouldn't try to reach out to them in other ways as a party, though.

[calinewarkwc69]

We are NOT marginalizing them, you're absolutely right. But you see how you're logic is created by the emotion invoked by being oppressed? It's the same thing creating their logic just on the other end of the spectrum. They are getting the message that their problems are not being solved because the "elite liberals" who are controlling the world are not solving their problems BECAUSE they're racist, misogynists, etc. We
mock their religion, we think of them as white trash hillbillies with no education, we effectively blame them and their shitty beliefs for their own plight, and now we're mad they voted against us and our "elitism."

But this is something Bernie did well compared to Hillary-- he goes out and let's them know this isn't about Black people, Muslims, Latinos- any foreigner-- they have their own problems that we'll address too- but YOUR problems are about bad trade deals, lack of opportunity, no healthcare for substance abuse, etc. He made it explicitly clear that we must share our pain and work together.

Hillary is out there calling people deplorables, calling Trump and his supporters every shit thing under the sun-- invoking this emotion that we're gonna "fight against them" and "not let what they believe win" etc. she literally framed it as if we're going to declare war on these people---
And they responded by voting against her.

Do you see? We all agree on the problems, it's the divisive speak about labeling one portion of Americans good and one portion as bad that continues to pit us against each other instead of going to these people and saying "I believe you are good. I believe you deserve better. I believe that you love everyone." When we tell them that, tell EVERYONE THAT, the way Bernie did, it makes them want to be that and vote for that. And there is a way to do it without their feelings that we all hate them

[lightframes]

HRC did say those things, though, especially regarding health care/substance abuse and job opportunities. I agree that nobody really seemed to believe her reversal on TPP. And I don't really agree that those problems are specific to poor rural whites, either - those issues affect everyone, POC or white, rural or city (Detroit, for example).

Regarding Sanders, couldn't you conversely say he didn't do as good of a job addressing the problems of POC, and that's why POC tended to vote for HRC over him in the primary?

"I believe you are good. I believe you deserve better. I believe that you love everyone."

Really hard for me to believe that when someone votes for Trump, but I'm just saying that's me personally, not that the Democratic Party shouldn't reach out.

[calinewarkwc69]

Clinton said those things, but to whom? She barely campaigned in the rust belt and midwest after the primary. I heard, but don't quote me as fact, that she never campaigned in Wisconsin during the general. She was saying the message but to people that were already going to vote for her. Meanwhile, on the news and the media, all you have on loop is her insulting Trump and his supporters. And Trump is HELLA fucking guilty too, of attacking us, but we knew that, we were there. The thing is, we have problems looking outside of ourselves to see we're sharing the same frustration. We fucking hate trump because he wants to grab our pussies, build a wall, and make Muslims register to live here; there are two sides of the spectrum, and no one wants to vote for a President who tells them that they're wrong, there way of life is not good for America, and blame them for problems PUT INTO THEIR COMMUNITIES BY SHITTY POLITICS. They're just not. Especially Hillary in this case who was so tied to NAFTA which destroyed these people's economies.

And Bernie did not have a race problem, every single last factor shows that he had an AGE problem. Large percentage of millennial POC voted for him same as the white kids, but same as the white kids, show up in smaller turnout. The older "not a socialist!" people voted against him, largely in part by the misinformation and fucked up framework perpetuated by the DNC.

Really hard for me to believe that when someone votes for Trump-- you're right for feeling that way, but systemic causation and the things that create and change problems are generational. We may never get the old racist poor white folk who lost their refinery job 30 years ago-- but we might get their kids. There grandkids, their great-grandkids-- but we don't do that if we write their entire culture off as assholes and leave them to rot.

[lightframes]

So as a young WOC who voted for Sanders in the primary, I felt like he had a problem with POC issues. I voted for him mostly on the economic issues, but I always thought HRC did a better job addressing issues specific to POC. And apparently so did my brother, who is younger than me, and my parents, who all voted for HRC in the primary. (Recall his statements about black people living in ghettos, not really addressing gun control and constantly pivoting to economics even when the conversation didn't call for it.) So even though it didn't lose him my vote I still saw it as an issue, if that makes sense? I don't think I'm alone.

I'm not for writing anybody off, I just think part of the problem is Trump voters don't want to come to terms with the racial/gender/religious impact of what they did. Like I said in my other comment, meet us halfway.

[calinewarkwc69]

No, like, I don't want this article or my commentary to be misjudged as POC needing to "get over it" and "build bridges." You're very entitled to your anger and how your family feels about how their issues were addressed is 100% acceptable. Statistics is all I can give you... You know, part of me was appalled at how many POC voted for Trump. Something like 30% of Latinos? That's another article for another time. There are so many factors outside of this that play a part. You know, especially when it comes to how millennials feel, which is apparently very different from the rest of crowd.

I'm not even a fan of "meet us halfway" per se, because as another user posted, it's really not on us as much as the Democratic party and the politicians who want these people's votes. I mean, I could go out to the central Valley in California that is a lot like the places described in this article and try to convince people to become democrat all day, but their not voting for me, or for you-- the people they ARE voting for are failing them on every level. This was an election of change, and it's was they were desperate for, so they gave us Trump.

Our issue now is to figure out what we can do to make sure these people understand that is not the answer.

[lightframes]

Regarding the Latino/Latina vote, I'm not Latina so I don't want to step out of line, but when I was canvassing I did come across a young Latina voter who said she was voting for HRC but she was reluctant because of her stance on abortion. So something I thought would gain her a lot of support among women may have actually hurt her among some Christian groups. I'm sure that will be looked at in the data from this election.

[lightframes]

I liked the Erica Garner ad, too. I remember being surprised when it was posted here because before that point I wasn't 100% sure if Sanders "got it."

You're right, I shouldn't address all POC issues under the same umbrella since we do have different issues we want addressed (I always get annoyed when people do that and now I'm doing it, too). Statistically I see he did win among younger people of color, but I'm just going by what I felt and what I heard from family members (like I said in my other comment to calinewarkwc69, his statements about black people living in ghettos, not really addressing gun control and constantly pivoting to economics even when the conversation didn't call for it). I had assumed my younger brother voted for Sanders in the primary but he told me he actually voted for HRC because he didn't think Sanders could get it done.