New ABC promo

[phantomsangel]

New LOST promo from ABC.

Still has a ridiculous cage sex clip. :/ It doesn't even match up with what the voice over is saying.

Still features stupid Jackface destiny sound bite.

This one is a bit longer. But still doesn't match the Spanish promo! Get with it, ABC!

Click to view

Comments

[oneloveunited]

There's plenty of depth to her character, what makes you think otherwise?

S2: "I'm probably crazy and this doesn't matter, but maybe you're in there somehow. But you asked me a question. You asked me why I -- why I did it. It wasn't because you drove my father away, or the way you looked at me, or because you beat her. It's because I hated that you were a part of me -- that I would never be good. That I would never have anything good. And every time that I look at Sawyer -- every time I feel something for him -- I see you, Wayne. It makes me sick."

That's pretty heavy (and questionable) if you ask me, and if it had been Locke or Jack or Sawyer or even Dan saying it everyone would've been beside themselves with glee naming it the best monologue ever and praising him to no end.

IMO, audiences have a tendency to simply ignore or discard the (often female) journey if they don't like that character. Just because some people don't favour it, doesn't mean it doesn't hold any resonance or is meaningless. I hate Jack but I know his story and character arc is hugely important to the writers, whether I like it or not.

[lostsailors]

To me, Kate is just a type of character I've seen very, very often in screenwriting. Down to the questionable heavy/dark/abusive past. I guess, this is just my opinion, not fact- it's more cliche than depth. Everything about her is familiar to me, to the point of boredom. I usually know exactly what she will do before she does and I'd rather be surprised by characters. It doesn't mean I disregard her story because she's female and I don't like her. I also never said she was meaningless. I just meant, to me, she's not not the most interesting and I'm bored of this sort of character.

I just saw Madeline_may's comment up there and was excited to agree. I can't stand the type of character she was talking about and often Kate is that type to me, even if she is better written than most. People just read characters different, based on their own experiences. She happens to not really speak to me at all.

If it makes people feel better, I quite liked how Kate was acting this entire past season and my real loathing was directed at Jack, who by far and large is my least, least favourite character ever in the history of ever. I mean, at least Kate was questioning shooting children and blowing up time. I was all for her then!

[8abbott_of_odd0]

You already know I completely agree with this statement, but I'm gonna agree again, just for the sake of emphasis :)

Another thing I'm going to say again; DAMN IT WRITERS, please reference this particularly vital aspect of Kate's character a little more often, mmmkay?

I don't think her issues are especially cliché, or they at very least have much potential to expand beyond cliché in a very interesting way. I sort of see LOST as a show that is populated by characters that are based upon clichéd archetypes who are given extra dimensions of depth to make them fascinating. The idea of a Southern girl with a drunken abusive dad is pretty stock, but I personally find the notion that she feels she is predestined to wickedness because of her genetic heritage rather intriguing. It is an idea that has been used a fair bit before, but it is one that can be taken in many interesting directions. Now if the writers were to just emphasise it a little more, that would be awesome.

Even though I haven't written fanfiction in years I'm sorely tempted to turn that discussion we had into a Kate character study piece.

[oneloveunited]

Our previous discussion was my inspiration for this post :D I'd love to see a Kate character study!

I definitely agree with cliched archetypes with depth, perfect sum up.

Jack - typical asshole doctor but with drinking problems, holds himself and everyone else to impossible standards.

Locke - typical loser with no hope but a strong believer in destiny and magic.

Ben - typical manipulative villain but with a penchant for blindly believing in higher power with or without rewards for his efforts. Lack of control of his own self/identity even though he can control eeeeveryone around him.

Sayid - Typical middle eastern character but with a heart of gold who just wants to settle down.

It goes on - I love it lol!

With Kate, I think it's really unique how they managed to give her at least 3 different reasons for murdering Wayne - to save herself, her mother and to give her a murderous, cold streak. As usual, nothing is black or white with Kate, she's always in between two options which, to me, is why the love triangle is perfect. (Jack/Kate/Sawyer, forget tacked on Juliet LOL)

[8abbott_of_odd0]

After I rewatch season 2 I think I'll make a start on it.

I think one way that the writers give the characters more depth is by presenting them as one archetype initially, then in typical LOST turnabout fashion they then present them as an almost opposing archetype. For the rest of the show the characters are presented as shifting between these two sides of their personalities, which are often in conflict, whilst other complicating characteristics are often introduced to provide even more depth.

Jack: Initially presented as a typical hero, but this is complicated and subverted when his need to save the day is shown to stem from unresolved issues, often leading to trouble as opposed to ending it.

Locke: Seems to be the well recognised guru/wise man at first, but this is subverted completely when it turns out that Locke is perhaps more lost than anyone else on the show.

Ben: At the beginning of season 3 he is presented as the intellectual and cultured villain, but later on in the series he is shown to harbour elements of fanaticism and emotional imbalance.

Hurley: Appears to just be the funny fat guy comic relief, but turns out to have a rather tragic backstory and a history of mental illness, as well as supernatural powers.

Jin: Presented as the angry abusive husband, but then we learn that he is as much a victim as Sun is, only due to his social station instead of his gender.

Sawyer: Shown to be the stereotypical bad boy, until it is revealed that he has a very dark past and his behaviour largely stems from some pretty intense self loathing.

Kate: In the first episode she seems like the typical heroine, until it is revealed that she is actually the fugitive, at which point we are lead to think she is the typical bad girl. Then throughout the series she behaves in a manner than flits between each interpretation, which is emphasised by the love triangle.

And yes, it certainly goes on, it would be fun to match every character up to their archetype.

[lostsailors]

See, I totally agree with this! It's like Sun. Sun was a huge stereotype the first season, but they have worked and broken that down and made her her own person and a wonderful character. All the characters are archetypes who were undone, rebuilt and transmuted into something new. I just personally feel Kate, even now, isn't there yet for me. I don't even have katred, it was more just me expressing my disappointment they haven't taken her further. Again, people respond to different things in different characters. What's really not interesting to some, is what is most moving to others. I'm a huge Ben-stan who feels bad for him most of the time, so I understand what it is to go: "I think this is amazing, why don't you get it?" Haha. I just really don't want people to think I was exceptionally rude about their favourite characters when I didn't mean to be.

[8abbott_of_odd0]

I think the fact that Jin evolved beyond a stereotype was one of the things that helped Sun evolve beyond a stereotype. Sun is initially presented as the stereotypical submissive wife, but is then shown to rebel against her seemingly cruel and repressive husband, something that I personally thought to be very exciting character development. However, it is revealed that Jin is not simply an abusive husband, and that his relationship with Sun is not just one of oppressor/oppressed, rather it is shown they were very deeply in love, but their relationship suffered because of outside forces. Thus Sun's story became more complex and deep; it was still a story about breaking free of oppression but at the same time it was about the nuisances of power and love in human relationships. They don't give up on each other, despite how damaged their relationship is, instead they have to work to rediscover what they lost. I fell in love with Sun when she finally made the full transition between oppressed wife to independent badass in season 4, as she was finally standing up to the true oppressor, her father, but it was also awesome because she was doing it for Jin. She asserts the fact that her father made them both suffer, which shows how Sun and Jin's relationship evolved on the island to be a bond of equality and understanding rather than a horrible mess of resentments built on miscommunication; she no longer blames Jin for what happened, but understands that they suffered together. That's why I personally think Sun/Jin is the most epic canon romance of the series, and get real pissed when people go on about Sun abandoning her daughter as if they can't comprehend why Sun chose to return to the island.

As I said before, I find Kate's fear of genetic predestination interesting, but I'm annoyed that this aspect of her psychology is rarely focused on, at least not directly. I guess I like the concept of Kate, but I'm not always that big on the execution.

Ben's my favourite character too; it's the layers of messed-up psychological and emotional turmoil beneath the seemingly collected exterior that fascinates me :D

[lostsailors]

YEY! This I completely agree with: "I guess I like the concept of Kate, but I'm not always that big on the execution."

That is all I meant, but I think I came off way more PMSy, haha.

I just am disappointed instead of going further with her, they just keep reverting to least interesting parts of her. I liked what they were doing with Aaron, but then she goes back to the Island, never mentions Claire again and devolves back to angsty eyeball exchanges with Sawyer and Jack.

ME: Vexation!!!

Really though, the most offensive character of season 5 was Jack. His centric revolved around getting a pair of shoes. It was THAT exciting.

(tumbleweed).

I agree with you on Sun and Jin. I think their relationship is so complicated and wonderful. It's not always the most stable relationship, but you know they do love each other- it's realistic with all the flaws and anger/trust issues. Before Ben came around Sun was my second favourite (Rousseau being numero 1).

SIDEBAR: I wish Sun did more in Season 5. She was SO AWESOME the season before, then she gets to the Island and becomes information booth. Can't win them all I guess!

And yes, my stan-ness for Ben knows no bounds, but from a writing standpoint he's fascinating. I like him because he's exciting. I just rewatched "Shape of Things to Come" and he'll go from looking like an new born baby architect, to murdering someone, then when he's pleading with Sayid you TOTALLY believe what he's saying, but then he walks away smiling because he got away with something- but what? Then you end with him sobbing over his daughter which is really powerful because he had never emoted before. I love him because I literally just never know what he will do exactly. It makes viewing fun for me!

[8abbott_of_odd0]

I think I feel much the same way. Kate has a lot of potential to be a very interesting character but it isn't used right. In "What Kate Did" her step-dad Sam says that he didn't kill Wayne because he doesn't have murder in his heart, implicating that Kate does, and it must take some pretty dark thoughts and a steely mind to leave a man in a house and then blow it up in cold blood. However, in the series we only very rarely see evidence of her being in possession of these dark thoughts and steely mind, instead Kate comes across as being more of a vanilla heroine with conventional morals. In order for Ben to do what he does, he must have a pretty twisted psych and unconventional outlook on the world, and the way he's written reflects this perfectly; I personally think that's why he's so interesting a character. One of my major wishes in season 6 is to see the darker, more intense and kinda psycho Kate that's capable of remorselessly blowing people up, then I think the dissonance between her backstory and her character will be resolved and she will be a much more enjoyable to watch.

LOL! Well, Darlton said that Jack's arc in season 5 was about going from being a man of science to a man of faith, and he certainly adopted Locke's propensity for blowing shit up, so at least it had some thematic meat to it.

I love the emotional and dramatic complexity of Sun and Jin's relationship; it is certainly realistic in all its flaws. It's sort of a subversion of the whole "and they lived happily ever after" ending, in a sense. I've been telling myself than Sun and Jin didn't have a lot to do in the later half of season 5 because all their awesome is being saved up for season 6, at which point we will all be blown away by it.

"The Shape of Things to Come" is probably one of the most exciting episodes of LOST, and it really goes to show just how layered and fascinating Ben's history must be, considering all the skills and experience he has evidently picked up somewhere along the way. I really wish LOST wasn't ending yet because I wanna see a bunch of Ben-centric flashbacks that feature him getting involved in all kinds of secretive international intrigue, and being all classy, academic and ass-kicking whilst doing so.

[lostsailors]

I know this entry is like from a thousand years ago at this point, but just YES YES YES. This comment makes me feel so much better, I just had to let you know.

I totally agree with everything here. I don't even really care which direction Kate's character is taken, I just wish they were more mindful of the arc, and it all makes sense to her character, backstory and plot trajectory AND they accept she doesn't have to be OOH!With Sawyer OOH!NvmwithJack to be interesting. Haha.

[8abbott_of_odd0]

Dude, I think I've left comments for a year and then gone back to answer them, lol, but that's how I roll.

We all know Kate should totes end up with Roger after all. I would like to see Kate confront herself honestly, and be able to see Jack and Sawyer for who they are rather than an extension of her issues.

I gotta know, what picture is your icon taken from?

[lostsailors]

YEY! I am horrible because I don't have comment notifications so just whenever I have happen to remember to go back do I find replies!

Dude, totally. I ship Kate and Roger so hard. Sawyer and Jack, who? Btw, a present for you.

I found the icon picture on the LOST Getty gallery! It's an unreleased image. I wish so much someone could find a bigger version of it, but this is the best I could do: