he said to a fan who asked it was a family issue (might have also been visa issues since he's got a foot in like 3 diff countries atm). could he be lying? sure. but then why even lie? why not cover with something less personal or even more vague?
Well, given that Kris's troubled family history is no secret to fans, it's a perfectly viable and sympathy-inducing excuse. However, he spent most of his two-month vacay in China and not in ONE place either. Moreover, fans know little to nothing however saesangs do. Did you expect him to admit to the fan that he was attempting to escape from the clutches of SME as JYJ and HanGeng successfully did (and Donghae, Leeteuk, Eunhyuk, Shindong and Kang-In all threatened to do before being awarded concessions)? Additionally, find it interesting that SME failed to release a statement on behalf of Kris however release statements for iAmber when she was absent to counter skepticism? Note the failure of EXO members to express any comment on Kris's absence? The only time they've handled events this silently is when Han Geng left the building.
he should know full well its more trouble than its worth. Did it stop JYJ from leaving the most popular boyband in South Korea because they wanted more money and personal freedom? The trouble certainly would have been worth it had he successfully been signed to another Chinese talent agency that would have paid his debt - therein lies the key point. He would have been able to start earning money and had a lot more personal freedom - something he certainly isn't getting in EXO-M under SME. Moreover, it's something his mother wants too - she has never been happy with him being an idol under SME. You seem to have read my post and missed on the key points 1) He wants to be debt free 2) He wishes to be an actor because (he knows he's not talented but when has that stopped anyone) they have a higher value in the celebrity hierarchy 3) His parents back his actions.
not to mention fangirls will turn on him like a pack of rabid wolves for "abandoning" his group
You clearly do not know how terrifyingly loyal the Kris saesangs are. Moreover, many of the saesangs (and might I go as far as to say fans) are more loyal to him than they are to EXO. But that's my own measurement of their feelings.
he other members (in k too) have shown to be v fond of him
Nobody in K has ever been fond of him given that they've spent much of their pre-debut days bullying him. They put up a great front for the audience in exchange for not being backhanded by their manager.
I certainly do not intend to wrestle this point. Believe what it is you want to believe.
There's a lot I can't say. The reality is this - you will choose not to believe sources that say what you don't want to hear.
Yes but they were ALL established artists already. esp Suju and DBSK. and yeah JYJ took a huge risk but thats cause they had a really shit time back in SME esp since back then during their early days SME was a v diff company. secondly, jyj wanted artistic freedom. just what artistic freedom does kris need at this point? he has no artistic talent. i love him but...no. thirdly JYJ have an established, devoted and large fanbase that even if they left they would be fine. plus jae sings, xiah does musicals and yoochun is in dramas. so like its not comparable at all. its the same how suju members were able to threaten SME knowing they are important to the company enough that SME would be willing to negotiate. How does kris have that leverage at this point? furthermore kris cant dance, isnt a great singer, not even that good at rapping and has no acting experience to speak of. to top that off with the huge problem of breaking contracts with SME...like, why? why bother? also in china the most popular entertainers are tv hosts, musicians/singers and idols. kris can be an idol in china via SME and he can do acting in china via them as well and he's more likely to get work as a member of Exo M than otherwise. Hangeng was able to break off from SME because of the foothold suju and suju m gave him in the chinese industry first. I mean I like Kris alot but aside from his leadership of Exo M and his good looks and personality, what does he have? (can he even host anything?) that he can just leave and think he'll do fine? why suffer as a trainee with SME for so many years and endure all that shit he got as a chinese trainee and make friends and etc just to leave barely a year after debut? Yes he could be unhappy atm with his company but what idol hasnt been through that at least once? most of them dont leave.
just what artistic freedom does kris need at this point?
I did not say artistic freedom. I said personal freedom. Take from that what you want.
kris have that leverage at this point?
He is the leader and face of SME's new star boygroup - he has incredible leverage being in that position. You seem to underestimate the significance of EXO to SME.
furthermore kris cant dance, isnt a great singer, not even that good at rapping and has no acting experience to speak of.
This could easily describe a plethora of idols, actors and tv hosts in Japan, South Korea, China and America. He is however considered to be incredibly handsome. Moreover, when has the absence of talent prevented anyone? Siwon seems pretty content eye-brow acting.
huge problem of breaking contracts with SME...like, why?
It's not hard to break contract with SME, so long as you are willing to pay the debt and don't sue SME as JYJ/Han Geng did. However, many idols are content to remain with their company so long as they get their concessions. JYJ demanded multiple concessions from SME - and their contract was altered to reflect their demands because of their importance to SME. However, they then decided that the gains were greater as an act independent of SME and left.
why suffer as a trainee with SME for so many years and endure all that shit he got as a chinese trainee
When you have suffered that long, disappointed your parents, and the result is a so-so debut by your idol group - and even more so-so debut by your sub-group, would you not leave in the hope of greater things?
We can sit here and ask rhetorical questions all day.
and make friends and etc
He made a friend - friends is an over optimistic statement of what relations are like in EXO.
Yes he could be unhappy atm with his company but what idol hasnt been through that at least once? most of them dont leave.
But some of them do leave and given that Han Geng, JYJ, SS501 and T-ARA have all happened this should not seem too surprising.
ugh i hate how long this is. but w/e. this is my last word. sisterjuneApril 9 2013, 21:41:27 UTC
Plus if Kris was fucking off to go job hunting why in the world would SME let him go off? even hold the group back for him? are they that lenient and understanding all of a sudden? plus they could have just pulled a kibum on him, kept him in the company as a member of exo but instead doing other gigs instead of singing/dancing. Also most popular actors in chinese speaking world are taiwanese actors (and many were idols first as well) i am so tired of those ridic exo k bullied all the chinese trainees nonsense. tao and sehun have been attached to the hip since idol sports day, luhan is chummy with everyone and sehun's dramatic turn from bitch face to childlike glee whenever luhan was around was so obv that it became a fandom running joke. and the korean members in exo m get along v well with the chinese members. "good show"? is everything a lie? is literally every second of these boys lives run by SME? and wouldnt it be difficult to lie that much and that consistently? even the best liars falter. and fantaken pics and cams are constant. guys like kai, sehun and tao are hopelessly transparent about their feelings. even when they really shouldnt be. how many times has baekyeol gushed about how cool kris is? and suho has never shown to be unkind to anyone ever. so who was bullying? trust i've been in idol fandoms for 6+ years now and it is never not obvious as fuck when members dont like each other. they dont have to say it. u cant hide that level of dislike that u would BULLY someone. whyyy is everything a fuckin conspiracy? and chanyeol has proven many times to speak before thinking. how secretive u think that fool could be about something that fuckin huge? yes there was bullying of the chinese trainees by korean trainees but there was MANY trainees around. SME has literally hundreds of trainees on deck. so six out of that many, the odds of that...well u do the math. Even if Kris has big rabid fans, u think thats enough to get him an actual career? and not believe sources that say what i dont like? i have literally not seen a single source (as in the usual sources every1 trusts and relies on in english speaking fandoms) say anything of this sort. and ofc i wont believe it without actual hard evidence of any kind. what kind of moron would i be then? its not just for idols but for anything its never a good idea to leap to conclusions. and these are frankly unfounded rumors. could i be wrong? ofc. i am not god. if i am then i'll have to make peace with that. but as of this point there is no compelling reason for me to believe any of this. this is the same as fangirls wildly extrapolating that onew's slump a while back was caused by him wanting to leave shinee/was bullied/hated by everyone/tried to commit SUICIDE jfc. but oop bloop turned out that was false! So if u wanna live in drama llama land go right on ahead.
Re: ugh i hate how long this is. but w/e. this is my last word. ninjacandyApril 9 2013, 22:26:11 UTC
Plus if Kris was fucking off to go job hunting why in the world would SME let him go off? even hold the group back for him? are they that lenient and understanding all of a sudden?
They didn't let him go off - he just went off. However, given that he had yet to issue an announcement of his departure it would make little sense for SME to be so ridiculously reactive. It's not them being 'understanding' of Kris's idol crisis (by holding the group back) but rather sensitive to the situation that is threatening a group that cost a lot of money to clothe.
plus they could have just pulled a kibum on him, kept him in the company as a member of exo but instead doing other gigs instead of singing/dancing.
You don't seem to understand what you're talking about. Kim Kibum of Super Junior had an impressive falling out with the new CEO of SME (who has little interest in Super Junior compared to SNSD, TVXQ and EXO) hence why he was suddenly put on a bus despite his constant requests to return to Super Junior. Kris doesn't just want to leave EXO he wants to leave SME.
"good show"? is everything a lie? is literally every second of these boys lives run by SME? and wouldnt it be difficult to lie that much and that consistently? even the best liars falter. and fantaken pics and cams are constant.
Everything in front of fans and cameras are 'a lie'. Is it really so hard to believe that human beings are capable of putting on different fronts, especially when they have been trained by their company to do so? How in the heck was so much Cold War espionage able to take place if it was 'difficult to lie that much and that consistently?' Why do fans, in their desperation to deny the truth, seem to think their idols are incapable of things an average human can do and does in average aspects of life.
yes there was bullying of the chinese trainees by korean trainees but there was MANY trainees around. SME has literally hundreds of trainees on deck. so six out of that many, the odds of that...well u do the math.
Math might be your strong point but apparently comprehension is not. I have said that it the EXO trainees bullied one another when they were EXO trainees - already having been chosen for the group and preparing for debut.
i have literally not seen a single source (as in the usual sources every1 trusts and relies on in english speaking fandoms) say anything of this sort.
That's because those aren't my sources.
ofc i wont believe it without actual hard evidence of any kind. what kind of moron would i be then?
Well, you'll happily defend the SME crafted stage personas. You seem a tad too emotionally invested.
Re: ugh i hate how long this is. but w/e. this is my last word. ninjacandyApril 10 2013, 00:04:40 UTC
Xiumin (according to the saesang sources) is a nice and put upon individual - he is quiet, reserved and works his hardest to overcome his largest obstacle (the fact he is considered ugly, has the least saesangs, least fans and nearly didn't make it to EXO). So I cannot begrudge him and have decided to use an icon to celebrate that he isn't rolling like an EXO-KLAN member and isn't as conniving as EXO-M members can be. However, if I hear anything (that I am allowed to discuss) then I of course shall gleefully denigrate him. They're idols, not my omnipresent Old Testament God XD I chose the icon today in celebration of the fact that he (and Chen) are actually nice (or at least inoffensive).
Yes, you are completely right - bless your doucheradar! I was told he was foremost bully and is very racist, and homophobic (by the sources~). He takes his racist jokes and homophobic jokes too far and often at the expense of those he is taunting.
Re: ugh i hate how long this is. but w/e. this is my last word. teigaApril 10 2013, 00:19:34 UTC
Thank you for your reply! I won't treat it as fact, but as something I personally choose to believe in :) Just like I do with everything idol/k-pop related.
It's interesting that Chen and him are considered to be "nice". This makes one question if it could have anything to do with them being placed in M - if because of having that trait or rather developing it under those circumstances. If all of this should be reality, I hope Xiumin has found at least one genuine friend who he can stick to.
What keeps me wondering, maybe it's a dumb rhetorical question: if fans have come to such conclusions about most (?) EXO members then why do they choose to remain fans? Some of what you're hinting at sounds like total no-gos..?!
(or at least inoffensive) ugh ugh ugh
In the end, EXO is still a big fat black hole, granted how little they've officially promoted yet and still sticking very much to idol textbook statements.
Re: ugh i hate how long this is. but w/e. this is my last word. ninjacandyApril 10 2013, 00:41:56 UTC
No worries! :)
Hm, I think because these people are saesangs (as opposed to fans) and also from a different cultural background from internationals (Western fans), they have a very different standard. They accept the bad parts of these idols (after all it was JYJ saesangs who hid the assault incident until one decided to leak it - and that person leaked it because they no longer liked JYJ). They will protect their idols because they like them and have invested a lot of money into being saesangs (paying to follow them across the globe), and are also very close to these idols (and their managers). Their relationship is markedly different from that of fans hence why they don't have a typical fan reaction. However, fans too often ignore stories they hear so the idea that a saesang would ignore bad parts (or excuse them) is not so shocking(?)
Culture can play a big part too. Chanyeol saesangs won't think of his racism or homophobia as particularly offensive (especially as he is a Korean male). In much the same way 1D fans tend to excuse their catcalling because it's excused as the behaviour of British males. However, Westerners who hear this story will think "Oh, this person is racist."
Another thing to consider is that saesangs don't ~saesang~ for a group but for an individual and that is a whole 'nother political game. [INSERT EXO MEMBER NAME] saesang will not tell the negative things about that member but won't have problems divulging (truthful) negative things about other members (aiya! that idol is a bully, this idol uses his money to get friends, this idol picks popular people to befriend, this idol is a camera whore etc etc) So you often have to compile different dedicated fan tales to get a clear picture.
Some will attempt to ignore what these dedicated fans say by going "they might be antisss~" The reality is that everyone has antis but not everyone, such as Zhou Mi for example, get accused of being racist and homophobic.
Another thing is that saesangs can get quite nationalistic and hide things from each other. Korean saesangs at times mistrust Chinese saesangs as a lot of gossip is leaked outside of Korea - the rumours about Yuri's sexuality for example and the attempt of 5 Super Junior members to leave. Han Geng's departure was first told by Chinese saesangs.
P.S. Apologies for using saesangs and fans interchangeably, I get carried away in context.
Also, the no-gos aren't because the idols themselves are terrible (it's hard to beat bullying, racism and homophobia!) but because the information could lead to the sources themselves getting into trouble with other saesangs (being excluded from the fandom). I don't want to do that. So I have to be vague - which will upset many but whatevs~
Re: ugh i hate how long this is. but w/e. this is my last word. teigaApril 10 2013, 12:33:49 UTC
I'd like to respond to your post, but would prefer to do so in private (instead of drawing it out even more on here). If it's fine with you and if you feel like it, could you also please enable messages being sent to you by registered LJ users? You can change that on your profile settings. But no pressure and no butthurt feelings if you're not up for it of course.
Re: ugh i hate how long this is. but w/e. this is my last word. teigaApril 12 2013, 21:05:16 UTC
I've tried to reply to your message, but it still tells me I'm not allowed to due to your privacy settings, even though you've contacted me ;;
(you have to go to your profile -> top right "manage profile" -> then scrolling down to contact information (I think that's what it is in English) -> LJ User Messaging -> setting it to registered users :))
Re: ugh i hate how long this is. but w/e. this is my last word. sisterjuneApril 10 2013, 04:12:54 UTC
Look I'm gonna give u the Kris thing becuz I dont wanna argue about it anymore. I hope its not true. but if it is, well what can I do? and if he does leave, thats sad and if he doesnt then good. I only care about what happens next. Man I didnt know that cold war espionage was comparable to frickin kpop idols but hey what do i know? ur the expert afterall. srsly tho how are kpop idols in any way equivalent to international spies during a war/world wide crisis/conflict? These guys are kids, barely out from under their mothers bosoms and high school, who were taught to sing, dance, and keep their shit together so they dont fuck up their careers via scandals, that is it. last i checked not groping ur bandmates at every given occasion doesnt cause idol groups to tank. You talking about "human behavior" is comical to me, because humans are actually not wired that way. most humans are SHIT liars and always have tells. there's even a whole science built around reading facial expressions to show how truthful a person is being at any given time. the only people who could lie so perfectly like that aside from trained spies would be sociopaths. surprisingly u dont need a bunch of insider sources to read body language. Also there's a p big difference between expressing diff aspects of your personality in diff environments and having a split personality. look It doesnt matter if we believe different things, thats not why I havent let this drop yet (altho i rly should) rather its a bit irritating that you're insisting i'm some kind of crazy delusional fangirl just cause that the Exo doesnt calculate their every single interaction in order to most please the fangirls. There isnt some covert super stealth operation going on for fuck's sake its not that serious! Oh the irony of you telling me I'm so biased by my "emotions" that I cant see "the truth" when you just admitted you hate everyone. hatred is also an intense emotion. in case u forgot Also, you have yet to tell me your sources. I'm not saying u dont have any, but you're basically a rando on omona i've never spoken to before, insisting something p big is true with zero proof aside from "i have sources who tell me so" and essentially I am just supposed to accept that unquestionably? and you talk like i'm a peon because i choose to think critically rather than take every word from u as the fuckin gospel. if anything I'm giving you too much credence as it is. Who are you for me to view u as an authority on all things SME and exo? Cause your friend of a friend read it on a saesang forum? ur buddy from korea is bffs with all the exo saesangs? Where are the receipts? Is there shady shit going on in SME? ofc. duh. is some of it to do with exo? sure but does that mean I have to buy everything that comes out of every fangirl's mouth? You know any fangirl can claim she has "sources" to back up w/e shit they want to say. You may just be repeating what someone told u, but that doesnt mean they are beyond reproach, even if YOU think they are, there's no reason for ME to. Believe what u want but dont get all self important and condescending on me for not believing it when all I have to go on is your word.
Well, given that Kris's troubled family history is no secret to fans, it's a perfectly viable and sympathy-inducing excuse. However, he spent most of his two-month vacay in China and not in ONE place either. Moreover, fans know little to nothing however saesangs do. Did you expect him to admit to the fan that he was attempting to escape from the clutches of SME as JYJ and HanGeng successfully did (and Donghae, Leeteuk, Eunhyuk, Shindong and Kang-In all threatened to do before being awarded concessions)? Additionally, find it interesting that SME failed to release a statement on behalf of Kris however release statements for iAmber when she was absent to counter skepticism? Note the failure of EXO members to express any comment on Kris's absence? The only time they've handled events this silently is when Han Geng left the building.
he should know full well its more trouble than its worth.
Did it stop JYJ from leaving the most popular boyband in South Korea because they wanted more money and personal freedom? The trouble certainly would have been worth it had he successfully been signed to another Chinese talent agency that would have paid his debt - therein lies the key point. He would have been able to start earning money and had a lot more personal freedom - something he certainly isn't getting in EXO-M under SME. Moreover, it's something his mother wants too - she has never been happy with him being an idol under SME. You seem to have read my post and missed on the key points 1) He wants to be debt free 2) He wishes to be an actor because (he knows he's not talented but when has that stopped anyone) they have a higher value in the celebrity hierarchy 3) His parents back his actions.
not to mention fangirls will turn on him like a pack of rabid wolves for "abandoning" his group
You clearly do not know how terrifyingly loyal the Kris saesangs are. Moreover, many of the saesangs (and might I go as far as to say fans) are more loyal to him than they are to EXO. But that's my own measurement of their feelings.
he other members (in k too) have shown to be v fond of him
Nobody in K has ever been fond of him given that they've spent much of their pre-debut days bullying him. They put up a great front for the audience in exchange for not being backhanded by their manager.
I certainly do not intend to wrestle this point. Believe what it is you want to believe.
There's a lot I can't say. The reality is this - you will choose not to believe sources that say what you don't want to hear.
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I did not say artistic freedom. I said personal freedom. Take from that what you want.
kris have that leverage at this point?
He is the leader and face of SME's new star boygroup - he has incredible leverage being in that position. You seem to underestimate the significance of EXO to SME.
furthermore kris cant dance, isnt a great singer, not even that good at rapping and has no acting experience to speak of.
This could easily describe a plethora of idols, actors and tv hosts in Japan, South Korea, China and America. He is however considered to be incredibly handsome. Moreover, when has the absence of talent prevented anyone? Siwon seems pretty content eye-brow acting.
huge problem of breaking contracts with SME...like, why?
It's not hard to break contract with SME, so long as you are willing to pay the debt and don't sue SME as JYJ/Han Geng did. However, many idols are content to remain with their company so long as they get their concessions. JYJ demanded multiple concessions from SME - and their contract was altered to reflect their demands because of their importance to SME. However, they then decided that the gains were greater as an act independent of SME and left.
why suffer as a trainee with SME for so many years and endure all that shit he got as a chinese trainee
When you have suffered that long, disappointed your parents, and the result is a so-so debut by your idol group - and even more so-so debut by your sub-group, would you not leave in the hope of greater things?
We can sit here and ask rhetorical questions all day.
and make friends and etc
He made a friend - friends is an over optimistic statement of what relations are like in EXO.
Yes he could be unhappy atm with his company but what idol hasnt been through that at least once? most of them dont leave.
But some of them do leave and given that Han Geng, JYJ, SS501 and T-ARA have all happened this should not seem too surprising.
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May I ask...who? I thought he was genuine friends with at least Luhan and Lay.
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i am so tired of those ridic exo k bullied all the chinese trainees nonsense. tao and sehun have been attached to the hip since idol sports day, luhan is chummy with everyone and sehun's dramatic turn from bitch face to childlike glee whenever luhan was around was so obv that it became a fandom running joke. and the korean members in exo m get along v well with the chinese members. "good show"? is everything a lie? is literally every second of these boys lives run by SME? and wouldnt it be difficult to lie that much and that consistently? even the best liars falter. and fantaken pics and cams are constant. guys like kai, sehun and tao are hopelessly transparent about their feelings. even when they really shouldnt be. how many times has baekyeol gushed about how cool kris is? and suho has never shown to be unkind to anyone ever. so who was bullying? trust i've been in idol fandoms for 6+ years now and it is never not obvious as fuck when members dont like each other. they dont have to say it. u cant hide that level of dislike that u would BULLY someone. whyyy is everything a fuckin conspiracy? and chanyeol has proven many times to speak before thinking. how secretive u think that fool could be about something that fuckin huge? yes there was bullying of the chinese trainees by korean trainees but there was MANY trainees around. SME has literally hundreds of trainees on deck. so six out of that many, the odds of that...well u do the math. Even if Kris has big rabid fans, u think thats enough to get him an actual career? and not believe sources that say what i dont like? i have literally not seen a single source (as in the usual sources every1 trusts and relies on in english speaking fandoms) say anything of this sort. and ofc i wont believe it without actual hard evidence of any kind. what kind of moron would i be then? its not just for idols but for anything its never a good idea to leap to conclusions. and these are frankly unfounded rumors. could i be wrong? ofc. i am not god. if i am then i'll have to make peace with that. but as of this point there is no compelling reason for me to believe any of this. this is the same as fangirls wildly extrapolating that onew's slump a while back was caused by him wanting to leave shinee/was bullied/hated by everyone/tried to commit SUICIDE jfc. but oop bloop turned out that was false! So if u wanna live in drama llama land go right on ahead.
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They didn't let him go off - he just went off. However, given that he had yet to issue an announcement of his departure it would make little sense for SME to be so ridiculously reactive. It's not them being 'understanding' of Kris's idol crisis (by holding the group back) but rather sensitive to the situation that is threatening a group that cost a lot of money to clothe.
plus they could have just pulled a kibum on him, kept him in the company as a member of exo but instead doing other gigs instead of singing/dancing.
You don't seem to understand what you're talking about. Kim Kibum of Super Junior had an impressive falling out with the new CEO of SME (who has little interest in Super Junior compared to SNSD, TVXQ and EXO) hence why he was suddenly put on a bus despite his constant requests to return to Super Junior. Kris doesn't just want to leave EXO he wants to leave SME.
"good show"? is everything a lie? is literally every second of these boys lives run by SME? and wouldnt it be difficult to lie that much and that consistently? even the best liars falter. and fantaken pics and cams are constant.
Everything in front of fans and cameras are 'a lie'. Is it really so hard to believe that human beings are capable of putting on different fronts, especially when they have been trained by their company to do so? How in the heck was so much Cold War espionage able to take place if it was 'difficult to lie that much and that consistently?' Why do fans, in their desperation to deny the truth, seem to think their idols are incapable of things an average human can do and does in average aspects of life.
yes there was bullying of the chinese trainees by korean trainees but there was MANY trainees around. SME has literally hundreds of trainees on deck. so six out of that many, the odds of that...well u do the math.
Math might be your strong point but apparently comprehension is not. I have said that it the EXO trainees bullied one another when they were EXO trainees - already having been chosen for the group and preparing for debut.
i have literally not seen a single source (as in the usual sources every1 trusts and relies on in english speaking fandoms) say anything of this sort.
That's because those aren't my sources.
ofc i wont believe it without actual hard evidence of any kind. what kind of moron would i be then?
Well, you'll happily defend the SME crafted stage personas. You seem a tad too emotionally invested.
I, however, hate everyone.
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except for Xiumin? (because of your icon)
Am I right when I'm getting major douchebag vibes from Chanyeol..?
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Yes, you are completely right - bless your doucheradar! I was told he was foremost bully and is very racist, and homophobic (by the sources~). He takes his racist jokes and homophobic jokes too far and often at the expense of those he is taunting.
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It's interesting that Chen and him are considered to be "nice". This makes one question if it could have anything to do with them being placed in M - if because of having that trait or rather developing it under those circumstances.
If all of this should be reality, I hope Xiumin has found at least one genuine friend who he can stick to.
What keeps me wondering, maybe it's a dumb rhetorical question: if fans have come to such conclusions about most (?) EXO members then why do they choose to remain fans? Some of what you're hinting at sounds like total no-gos..?!
(or at least inoffensive)
ugh ugh ugh
In the end, EXO is still a big fat black hole, granted how little they've officially promoted yet and still sticking very much to idol textbook statements.
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Hm, I think because these people are saesangs (as opposed to fans) and also from a different cultural background from internationals (Western fans), they have a very different standard. They accept the bad parts of these idols (after all it was JYJ saesangs who hid the assault incident until one decided to leak it - and that person leaked it because they no longer liked JYJ). They will protect their idols because they like them and have invested a lot of money into being saesangs (paying to follow them across the globe), and are also very close to these idols (and their managers). Their relationship is markedly different from that of fans hence why they don't have a typical fan reaction. However, fans too often ignore stories they hear so the idea that a saesang would ignore bad parts (or excuse them) is not so shocking(?)
Culture can play a big part too. Chanyeol saesangs won't think of his racism or homophobia as particularly offensive (especially as he is a Korean male). In much the same way 1D fans tend to excuse their catcalling because it's excused as the behaviour of British males. However, Westerners who hear this story will think "Oh, this person is racist."
Another thing to consider is that saesangs don't ~saesang~ for a group but for an individual and that is a whole 'nother political game. [INSERT EXO MEMBER NAME] saesang will not tell the negative things about that member but won't have problems divulging (truthful) negative things about other members (aiya! that idol is a bully, this idol uses his money to get friends, this idol picks popular people to befriend, this idol is a camera whore etc etc) So you often have to compile different dedicated fan tales to get a clear picture.
Some will attempt to ignore what these dedicated fans say by going "they might be antisss~" The reality is that everyone has antis but not everyone, such as Zhou Mi for example, get accused of being racist and homophobic.
Another thing is that saesangs can get quite nationalistic and hide things from each other. Korean saesangs at times mistrust Chinese saesangs as a lot of gossip is leaked outside of Korea - the rumours about Yuri's sexuality for example and the attempt of 5 Super Junior members to leave. Han Geng's departure was first told by Chinese saesangs.
P.S. Apologies for using saesangs and fans interchangeably, I get carried away in context.
Also, the no-gos aren't because the idols themselves are terrible (it's hard to beat bullying, racism and homophobia!) but because the information could lead to the sources themselves getting into trouble with other saesangs (being excluded from the fandom). I don't want to do that. So I have to be vague - which will upset many but whatevs~
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But no pressure and no butthurt feelings if you're not up for it of course.
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(you have to go to your profile -> top right "manage profile" -> then scrolling down to contact information (I think that's what it is in English) -> LJ User Messaging -> setting it to registered users :))
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Man I didnt know that cold war espionage was comparable to frickin kpop idols but hey what do i know? ur the expert afterall. srsly tho how are kpop idols in any way equivalent to international spies during a war/world wide crisis/conflict? These guys are kids, barely out from under their mothers bosoms and high school, who were taught to sing, dance, and keep their shit together so they dont fuck up their careers via scandals, that is it. last i checked not groping ur bandmates at every given occasion doesnt cause idol groups to tank. You talking about "human behavior" is comical to me, because humans are actually not wired that way. most humans are SHIT liars and always have tells. there's even a whole science built around reading facial expressions to show how truthful a person is being at any given time. the only people who could lie so perfectly like that aside from trained spies would be sociopaths. surprisingly u dont need a bunch of insider sources to read body language. Also there's a p big difference between expressing diff aspects of your personality in diff environments and having a split personality.
look It doesnt matter if we believe different things, thats not why I havent let this drop yet (altho i rly should) rather its a bit irritating that you're insisting i'm some kind of crazy delusional fangirl just cause that the Exo doesnt calculate their every single interaction in order to most please the fangirls. There isnt some covert super stealth operation going on for fuck's sake its not that serious!
Oh the irony of you telling me I'm so biased by my "emotions" that I cant see "the truth" when you just admitted you hate everyone. hatred is also an intense emotion. in case u forgot Also, you have yet to tell me your sources. I'm not saying u dont have any, but you're basically a rando on omona i've never spoken to before, insisting something p big is true with zero proof aside from "i have sources who tell me so" and essentially I am just supposed to accept that unquestionably? and you talk like i'm a peon because i choose to think critically rather than take every word from u as the fuckin gospel. if anything I'm giving you too much credence as it is.
Who are you for me to view u as an authority on all things SME and exo? Cause your friend of a friend read it on a saesang forum? ur buddy from korea is bffs with all the exo saesangs? Where are the receipts? Is there shady shit going on in SME? ofc. duh. is some of it to do with exo? sure but does that mean I have to buy everything that comes out of every fangirl's mouth? You know any fangirl can claim she has "sources" to back up w/e shit they want to say. You may just be repeating what someone told u, but that doesnt mean they are beyond reproach, even if YOU think they are, there's no reason for ME to. Believe what u want but dont get all self important and condescending on me for not believing it when all I have to go on is your word.
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