Eat the Rich: Classism in the UK Entertainment Industry, Pt. 1 [ONTD Original]

[jdnightghobhadi]

Comments

[dandelion]

These guys are undoubtedly privileged but there are a few misconceptions in this post. Cumberbatch wouldn't have paid anywhere near £9k/term for university - he probably paid nothing at all. His mum also probably would not have paid to attend Central. The UK didn't have tuition fees for university at all until 1998. Almost all universities cost £9k/term now but none of them did then, so it's kind of a moot point saying that's what it costs right now as if we're supposed to take that to mean he's rich - that's the standard price for any university, not a special place for rich people. Our universities' prices are essentially set nationally with 95% of them charging the exact same amount (what a coincidence it's the legal maximum), and anyone who wants to go will be given a loan for the full tuition amount.

Basically, you can tell Cumberbatch and his mum (especially his mum as this applies particularly strongly the further back you go) were rich because they went to university, because at the time you were much more likely to go if you were rich. If you weren't rich, and you hadn't gone to a good school, you wouldn't be encouraged to go to university. But you didn't have to pay when you got there - the barriers to less wealthy people going were all before you actually got there.

He's also correct that he's not upper class, and neither are anyone else in this post - they're not titled or owners of hereditary estates as far as I know.
"Is it possible that she considers, like Bendydick Cucumberpatch, royalty status to be the only privileged class of Britain?"
I don't think they're naive enough to think royalty are the *only* privileged class, but titled people are in a different social class (the upper class) and you can't climb into it by getting richer in the UK. The UK's class system is old and not based on how much money you actually have. It is very different to the US definition of upper class. Many upper-middle class people in the UK are actually richer than the upper class.

[xellabelle]

Exactly. This is what I’ve been trying to say in another comment about how Kate Middleton’s family are definitely not upper class. You can’t buy your way into upper class in the UK. It’s the opposite of the Great American Dream.

There are also plenty of aristocracy who are struggling financially but they’re still upper class.

[dandelion]

Exactly, her family is still upper-middle, and Kate's upper only because she's married into it.

I don't really blame Americans for thinking it's based on money, because it looks like it superficially, but in reality there is a lot of old, historical snobbery that hasn't gone away yet. Social mobility in the UK in general is not good.

And definitely re: the struggling...I think that's how the National Trust got a large chunk of its historical buildings, people inheriting them and not being able to afford giant inheritance tax bills, or maintain giant crumbling estates with patchy roofs. There was a really interesting TV show where people with fancy estates and castles and things were admitting how perilous their finances were, and needing to open up tours, gift shops, on-site cafes/breweries/pony trekking - anything to keep the places going.

[xellabelle]

Yeah, in the UK your class is forever judged your accent (and by consequence your education). So your class is set in stone when you were growing up. No amount of money can change it. It’s a phenomenon only the UK has.

And like people scoff at Kate being called a commoner because they think it means she is “common”, but she is literally a commoner because she is not from royalty or aristocracy. And they think there’s not much difference between Kate and William’s class in that they are both loaded I guess (?) but there’s just so much, she’s the first commoner to be Queen. Her and Diana had incredibly different upbringings.

That’s interesting about National Trust, I guess the most known example would be Highclere Castle aka Downton Abbey!

[loveumbrella]

excellent points!

[jdnightghobhadi]

I do appreciate this constructive criticism and another user here enlightened me on the differences between wealth vs. class vs. blood vs. inheritance. These are some strong points so thank you for bringing my attention to it.

The UK didn't have tuition fees for university at all until 1998.

Welp, I'm stupid lol. I guess I was thinking strictly of audition fees and posh direct grant grammar schools before the grant system went away. I guess those numbers can still present how ridiculous education is and that people, notably kids now going into uni below Cumberbatch's status just cannot reasonably obtain that. Obviously, I wasn't saying that's what HE paid if at all (especially bc values would have been different then).

Anyway, I'm saving your comment for future reference, like CALL ME OUT, SIS!

[jdnightghobhadi]

Also, want to say I love your icon. It's... so mesmerizing.

You literally should be a fact checker, girl. I just didn't even think to double check that! Why did I think unis suddenly had fees after Cumberbatch was born (like ca. 1978-80?) NOPE, I was wrong! 1998, boo! Thanks again for picking that apart.

[dandelion]

Hey, thank you for taking my comment in the spirit it was meant, I still really appreciate the ton of work you put into this post! I know about the tuition fees thing cos one of my boss' favourite hobbies is to reply to us complaining about loans with "you guys had to pay for uni? In my day [the dark ages of like 1995] they paid us to go!" I think your bit on Emma Watson was particularly good :)

[jdnightghobhadi]

In my day [the dark ages of like 1995]

LOL OMG!

Yes, absolutely! The only way I can grow as a person and writer is if I know when I'm wrong and can own up to my shit and change lol. (And sorry this is late, my dog unfortunately and very unexpectedly was sick yesterday. I hope she's going to be okay, but alas.)

Aw, thanks! I really love your whole comment (it's A+++) and I can't BELIEVE it took until the last page for someone to notice I have errors in my argument, haha. Stupid, American me! I have family from the UK and Ireland, but of course I don't know everything (as I don't live there).

Thanks again, bb! <3

[dandelion]

Oooh, I hope your dog is okay - sending good thoughts!

[jdnightghobhadi]

Aw, thank you! You're sweet. <3 She's an old girl. She's on meds now, but I really hope she pulls through!