Yet more ponderings about NCIS
Although these in part aren't mine, they are J's.
As some of you know J also watched and enjoys NCIS - yay - and what's more we talk about pretty much as I do with my fannish friends. The exception being anything to do with slash, we don't go there - in fact I honestly do not know if he knows I ship Gibbs/Ducky. I assume, given my wallpaper on my computer and bits and pieces around he knows, he knows they are my favourite characters, but other than that I honestly don't know. (He does know I slash various pairings, so I would guess he does, after all I have a Gibbs/Ducky wallpaper on my computers, so . . .).
So once I'd 'persuaded' him to let me tell him about 'the end of season news' we have been speculating - and even more so this week.
Spoilers for the rest of the season will be found behind the cut.
Let me first say these are J's views (unless otherwise stated). He doesn't ship pairings (although he does think Abby/McGee belong together), and he enjoys the show as a whole and tends to like all the characters (he even likes Jenny!). And he's not going to say things just to please me because he knows I like/dislike particular characters - again with the 'he likes Jenny' (we've had some intense discussions about her *g*). So . . .
Firstly (putting aside the twist and repercussions comments made by Ausiello) I asked him who he thought would be the easiest characters to replace.
1. Jenny - because she's the director and not involved in day-to-day matters, etc.
2. Ziva - because he's not sure what else can be done with the character. She has developed considerably since arriving; she's a full team player now; she knows there are other ways of extracting information, etc. than just by 'terror'.
3. DiNozzo - because again he's not sure what else can be done with his character and he doesn't have a specific secondary skill.
Then I asked him whom he thought would be the hardest characters to replace.
1. Gibbs - because NCIS is Gibbs.
2. Ducky - because the close friendship between Gibbs and Ducky is one of the pivotal parts of the show and it gives Gibbs someone who is in the same age group to talk to, and another perspective rather than just the field team. He feels that if Ducky weren't there, we'd need to have more Tobias or bring in someone else from Gibbs's past with whom he used to work, etc.
3. Abby - because again their father-daughter relationship and how different it is from the field team is very important. And also because of her character, she's a one-off and really adds to the show. Yes, you could get another Forensic expert, but that person is not going to be an Abby.
He felt McGee was pretty much in the middle. He does have multi-skills being a geek, highly intelligent and a good field agent, and is a good foil for Abby, etc. But TPTB could probably find someone who could do the duel roles he does. But J feels he'd be harder to replace than DiNozzo.
Then J came up with a couple of scenarios to fulfil the 'character death'. Let's ignored the word 'murder' for now as I think that has only been used by Ausiello. Shane Brennan has only confirmed that 'someone is leaving'. He also says 'literally we have someone in peril either physically, medically or administratively, in almost every episode.' And 'I think viewers will be quite shocked by the finale'.
1. Jenny is the one to leave. It turns out her father is still alive and she discovers that La Grenouille was correct, Jasper Shepard was taking bribes, and not just the one; in fact he was involved in a lot of things. Jenny knows that if her father returns to the US she'll have to hand him over and she can't do that and so she blows them both up (he decided to use the word 'explosive' literally *g*) on a boat. And then the 'repercussions into next season will be the team having to try to sort out things that Jasper Shepard did. And if we assume that TPBT have 'messed up' over the gender of the person's blood being tested and it was Jenny's, then if she's dying anyway, why not die at her own hand and in effect 'protect' her father from imprisonment - or worse?
I went one step further and suggested that maybe Jenny had known about her father's involvement for some time and has been covering it up. I know that ever since she appeared there has been speculation as to whether she was a double-agent, or not entirely trustworthy, etc. (I've written her that way a few times). And this is not without evidence.
In a flashback in 'Probie' we see her shoot a man in Paris (that was never resolved).
In 'Model Behavior' we have the scene where she asks Gibbs if he trusts her. We get a flashback from his POV of him being arrested and her standing across the street and smiling. I have always taken that to mean he doesn't entirely trust her - because of the flashback coming after she asked the question. Again it was never resolved.
In 'Jeopardy' we learn about the Senator she was meeting twice a week for coffee - was this maybe not as straight forward as it seems.
The whole final flashback scene in 'Internal Affairs' when we see her 'seeing' La Grenouille taking the gun and in Gibbs's flashback, he puts it back on the desk. Plus, as sharpiesgal said, there was 'something' about the way he said 'long live the queen'. Whether she pulled the trigger or not, if Gibbs's flashback is correct, then La Grenouille didn't take the gun but it was the gun that killed him, so Jenny has to be in some way involved.
I wondered whether or not Fornell had shown Gibbs the file he had on Jenny, and in fact whether Fornell had ever thought DiNozzo murdered La Grenouille, but it was a way to maybe try to get Jenny to show her hand a bit more. I know we had Kort 'confessing' but really from the CIA's point of view closing the file and ceasing investigations into La Grenouille, etc. was a good thing. Thus, I could see them 'confessing' to taking him out, even though they didn't.
We know that the relationship Jenny and Gibbs had Paris is going to play a big part in the season finale as Shane Brennan says 'the secret past will come back to haunt them'. This is where I got my 'Jenny had a child by Gibbs and has been hiding it from him' fear came. But now I'm wondering (hoping) if it's not all just tied in with the man she killed and Gibbs being arrested.
Did Gibbs 'know' (but knew he couldn't prove it) that she killed the man in Paris deliberately? Was that man linked to La Grenouille? Or even in some way to Jenny's father? Did Gibbs not push matters because of their 'affair'? Is he now working with Fornell to try to get more on her for that murder and La Grenouille's and maybe even more stuff. In fact has she always been under suspicion, right back from when she was on Gibbs's team. Is this why 'Paris' happened?
That would be explosive, would give us a twist, would involve Paris and would certainly lead to major repercussions into next season (and possibly beyond). (And I like it so much more than the kid option).
J pretty much agreed with this addition. I hadn't mentioned that Paris was going to 'come back and haunt' them, but even before I mentioned Paris he'd said that we were going to go back there and resolved some issues. He said that he's always thought Paris was going to be a long term plot piece. He doesn't think Jenny is quite so 'bad' as I do, but he certainly feels Paris and La Grenouille are tied in together.
2. J's second 'idea' was far less detailed and was out and out cruel, IMO. He said if he was producing it, he'd actually have all the major players in the same place at the same time, have a large explosion and end on that note. Therefore we'd end S5 not knowing who walked away from the explosion and who died. As he said it would keep people guessing, the summer would be filled with a lot of speculation and people would certainly tune in to the first episode of S6 to see who had died!
Sometimes my husband can be really evil ;-)
There you go, plutos_revenge, you aren't the only one gnawing at this one like a dog with a bone ;-)
As some of you know J also watched and enjoys NCIS - yay - and what's more we talk about pretty much as I do with my fannish friends. The exception being anything to do with slash, we don't go there - in fact I honestly do not know if he knows I ship Gibbs/Ducky. I assume, given my wallpaper on my computer and bits and pieces around he knows, he knows they are my favourite characters, but other than that I honestly don't know. (He does know I slash various pairings, so I would guess he does, after all I have a Gibbs/Ducky wallpaper on my computers, so . . .).
So once I'd 'persuaded' him to let me tell him about 'the end of season news' we have been speculating - and even more so this week.
Spoilers for the rest of the season will be found behind the cut.
Let me first say these are J's views (unless otherwise stated). He doesn't ship pairings (although he does think Abby/McGee belong together), and he enjoys the show as a whole and tends to like all the characters (he even likes Jenny!). And he's not going to say things just to please me because he knows I like/dislike particular characters - again with the 'he likes Jenny' (we've had some intense discussions about her *g*). So . . .
Firstly (putting aside the twist and repercussions comments made by Ausiello) I asked him who he thought would be the easiest characters to replace.
1. Jenny - because she's the director and not involved in day-to-day matters, etc.
2. Ziva - because he's not sure what else can be done with the character. She has developed considerably since arriving; she's a full team player now; she knows there are other ways of extracting information, etc. than just by 'terror'.
3. DiNozzo - because again he's not sure what else can be done with his character and he doesn't have a specific secondary skill.
Then I asked him whom he thought would be the hardest characters to replace.
1. Gibbs - because NCIS is Gibbs.
2. Ducky - because the close friendship between Gibbs and Ducky is one of the pivotal parts of the show and it gives Gibbs someone who is in the same age group to talk to, and another perspective rather than just the field team. He feels that if Ducky weren't there, we'd need to have more Tobias or bring in someone else from Gibbs's past with whom he used to work, etc.
3. Abby - because again their father-daughter relationship and how different it is from the field team is very important. And also because of her character, she's a one-off and really adds to the show. Yes, you could get another Forensic expert, but that person is not going to be an Abby.
He felt McGee was pretty much in the middle. He does have multi-skills being a geek, highly intelligent and a good field agent, and is a good foil for Abby, etc. But TPTB could probably find someone who could do the duel roles he does. But J feels he'd be harder to replace than DiNozzo.
Then J came up with a couple of scenarios to fulfil the 'character death'. Let's ignored the word 'murder' for now as I think that has only been used by Ausiello. Shane Brennan has only confirmed that 'someone is leaving'. He also says 'literally we have someone in peril either physically, medically or administratively, in almost every episode.' And 'I think viewers will be quite shocked by the finale'.
1. Jenny is the one to leave. It turns out her father is still alive and she discovers that La Grenouille was correct, Jasper Shepard was taking bribes, and not just the one; in fact he was involved in a lot of things. Jenny knows that if her father returns to the US she'll have to hand him over and she can't do that and so she blows them both up (he decided to use the word 'explosive' literally *g*) on a boat. And then the 'repercussions into next season will be the team having to try to sort out things that Jasper Shepard did. And if we assume that TPBT have 'messed up' over the gender of the person's blood being tested and it was Jenny's, then if she's dying anyway, why not die at her own hand and in effect 'protect' her father from imprisonment - or worse?
I went one step further and suggested that maybe Jenny had known about her father's involvement for some time and has been covering it up. I know that ever since she appeared there has been speculation as to whether she was a double-agent, or not entirely trustworthy, etc. (I've written her that way a few times). And this is not without evidence.
I wondered whether or not Fornell had shown Gibbs the file he had on Jenny, and in fact whether Fornell had ever thought DiNozzo murdered La Grenouille, but it was a way to maybe try to get Jenny to show her hand a bit more. I know we had Kort 'confessing' but really from the CIA's point of view closing the file and ceasing investigations into La Grenouille, etc. was a good thing. Thus, I could see them 'confessing' to taking him out, even though they didn't.
We know that the relationship Jenny and Gibbs had Paris is going to play a big part in the season finale as Shane Brennan says 'the secret past will come back to haunt them'. This is where I got my 'Jenny had a child by Gibbs and has been hiding it from him' fear came. But now I'm wondering (hoping) if it's not all just tied in with the man she killed and Gibbs being arrested.
Did Gibbs 'know' (but knew he couldn't prove it) that she killed the man in Paris deliberately? Was that man linked to La Grenouille? Or even in some way to Jenny's father? Did Gibbs not push matters because of their 'affair'? Is he now working with Fornell to try to get more on her for that murder and La Grenouille's and maybe even more stuff. In fact has she always been under suspicion, right back from when she was on Gibbs's team. Is this why 'Paris' happened?
That would be explosive, would give us a twist, would involve Paris and would certainly lead to major repercussions into next season (and possibly beyond). (And I like it so much more than the kid option).
J pretty much agreed with this addition. I hadn't mentioned that Paris was going to 'come back and haunt' them, but even before I mentioned Paris he'd said that we were going to go back there and resolved some issues. He said that he's always thought Paris was going to be a long term plot piece. He doesn't think Jenny is quite so 'bad' as I do, but he certainly feels Paris and La Grenouille are tied in together.
2. J's second 'idea' was far less detailed and was out and out cruel, IMO. He said if he was producing it, he'd actually have all the major players in the same place at the same time, have a large explosion and end on that note. Therefore we'd end S5 not knowing who walked away from the explosion and who died. As he said it would keep people guessing, the summer would be filled with a lot of speculation and people would certainly tune in to the first episode of S6 to see who had died!
Sometimes my husband can be really evil ;-)
There you go, plutos_revenge, you aren't the only one gnawing at this one like a dog with a bone ;-)