TOWJWAGABI, The REAL Part 6

[myrna1_2_3]

Oh my GOD, I'm an idiot! I neglected to include a whole final part to this entry!

The additional part starts after Brian strolls out of the coffee shop.

DOH!

Comments

[nightsister]

I guess I'm just old and I see this WAY differently than other people, but is Dan's suppression of his PDA for Justin worse than Brian's overt maneuvers? Because really, it feels that Brian only kissed Justin in public to get a rise out of Dan, not because he actually wanted to display his feelings for his Sunshine, right?

And yes, yes, yes -- Justin's need to find safer routes to independence is perfectly understandable. It's a very young and idealistic view to want to be a starving artiste, isn't it? Maybe I'm coming at this from a different perspective because I know a lot of artists who went to Cal-Arts and SVA and Pratt, and they're doing their life's work, but they're struggling and sometimes they're miserable and barely making their rent each month. Being an artist, especially in animation, sucks eggs. The most talented people in the industry (young AND old) are usually treated like so much expendable dirt. It's appalling. My friend won a freakin' EMMY, for god's sake, but he was let go a year later, because of "budget restraints." And yet Michael Eisner gets a bonus every year. Hm...

And anyway, when your life is literally cut out from under you, what the fuck are you supposed to do? I hope he stays at C-MU, even if he moves out of Dan's place. And I hope he tells Brian to fuck off once and for all. Why does Brian still feel like the villain to me? :(

Sorry for being so cranky, but I really can't see this Brian winning Justin back without feeling that Justin was "settling." I know people think he's settling for Dan, but I dunno, it seems like Justin reacts to things here because of what Brian says, or does. I really want Justin to become his own man, and yet decide that he wants is to be with Dan.

[nightsister]

He was in that murky age range-somewhere in his 30's, mid- to late" (Myrna's description...hardly the old man that Brian constantly refers to in a nasty tone...actually only a couple of years older than Brian himself).

Yep, most of the "old man" cracks are made by Brian, who really isn't *that* much older, lol. And I can hardly see where Debbie can comment, given how much older Dr. Dave was to Michael...

Hm. Dave ultimately wasn't good for Michael. It took Deb a while to realize that Ben was good for Michael. Ben is older than Michael, and thus older than Brian, and so Ben's probably only a year or two younger than Dan...

It's great when you have to really think about different characters and their POVs, and whether those POVs are reliable or not. Even if I don't agree with the character's assessment of a situation, this is amazing writing.

Brian, as written, seems to be a pretty shallow fellow, driven to get Justin back in the fold because of petty jealousy.

I think it's worse: Brian is envious. He not only wants what Dan has, he doesn't want Dan to have it. One of the 7 deadly sins, and all that. :)

And yeah, maybe Brian brings out the fire in Justin, but I spent three years in an awesomely passionate, gut-wrenching relationship with a man who swore he'd love me more that anyone else ever could. Thank GOD I didn't stay with that loser. It took a while, but I grew up.

Someone in another fandom wrote a wonderful fanfic and said something to the effect that love lies in the silences. This is Dan to me, not Brian...

Not yet anyway. I'm confident that Myrna won't let me down.

No pressure, Myrna! ;D

[myrna1_2_3]

I think it's worse: Brian is envious.

Exactly. Brian bitches about those things he thinks he has over Dan--he's younger, less inhibitied, more out--but it's the things that Dan has over him that he can't tolerate--Dan's kindness, his gentle affection for Justin, his easy acceptance of how he feels about Justin...

[nightsister]

it's the things that Dan has over him that he can't tolerate--Dan's kindness, his gentle affection for Justin, his easy acceptance of how he feels about Justin...

So it's time for Brian to take a long, hard look at *himself* and figure out what has to change, is that it?

Myrna, I think I love you. :)

[myrna1_2_3]

So it's time for Brian to take a long, hard look at *himself* and figure out what has to change, is that it?

EXACTLY! Of course, In MyrnaWorld, it's always time for Brian to take along, hard look at himself!

[myrna1_2_3]

More great feedback--thanks!

Brian, as written, seems to be a pretty shallow fellow, driven to get Justin back in the fold because of petty jealousy.

Before running into Justin, Brian realized that catapulting Justin out of his life hadn't worked out the way he wanted to. He had started seeking him out.

I don't see Brian as trying to get Justin back out of jealousy so much as him recognizing clearly, for once, that he does want to be with Justin. He's not acquiescing to Justin's pushing or going with the flow of the moment, he actively wants to be back with Justin.

It is selfish and self-centered of him to think that time has stood still for Justin in the time that they are apart, but I think he was so appalled at the news that Jennifer had died and realizing that Justin endured all of that without any of their support that at first he was simply intent of giving Justin his "family" back.

Justin's been thrown away by everyone (including Brian) at one time or another, at least Dan doesn't seem so inclined.

Dan respects Justin. Even when he misreads Justin, even when he isn't the perfect man for Justin he still respects him.

[nightsister]

He's not acquiescing to Justin's pushing or going with the flow of the moment, he actively wants to be back with Justin.

But he can't stop being the fuckup that he is sometimes, either, which is sort of endearing in a twisted kind of way. That scene where Justin thought Brian blamed Jennifer's death on him is a perfect example of Brian's "foot in mouth" disease. :)

I think when I stop to think of Brian as this all-powerful manipulator and start seeing him as a normal, albeit severely flawed, human being is when I can see him with Justin again...

[myrna1_2_3]

That scene where Justin thought Brian blamed Jennifer's death on him is a perfect example of Brian's "foot in mouth" disease

I still think that was Justin projecting his guilt onto Brian. Brian meant that if Justin had followed Brian's script, he would still be pursuing his career as an artiste as opposed to following some ordinary career path.

[nightsister]

I still think that was Justin projecting his guilt onto Brian.

Well, I'm not going to argue with the *author* of the scene, but Brian knew exactly how Justin misread the comment a split second after he'd said it, so I was thinking that Brian also knew that he could've worded it a wee bit differently. :)

[ladooshka]

God! I just have found the whole story to read and I have to say that I like to read reviews afterwords. And I totally agree with your comments, mai_ling134!! Totally!! You just wrote my exact thought about this story line, which I have to admit is so interesting.
Brian is fucked up prick in here. And If Myrna as every others asked her to bring Justin back to Brian's life, I can't feel anything garanteed that Brian will not kick him out after when he will get bored of domesticity again!
Thanks a lot for your comments!. I know I have to thank Myrna for her story first, but I just have to say something to you too:-)

Take care,
~Lada

[myrna1_2_3]

Brian made his arrangements for Justin to go to New York so that he could dump him without feeling guilty about it. He told Justin to GET LOST.

Exactly. I purposefully resisted Brian's actions having any nobility behind them.

If Justin forgives Brian for this, it won't be because Justin suddenly realizes Brian did it for Justin's own good, it will be because Justin is able to say, "Yeah, you fucked up, but you're sorry and I accept that."

Wonderful Thread

[smartwomn1]

AND that he, Justin, chooses Brian.

Thank all of you for conducting this conversation about what's positive about the Justin/Dan relationship.

I say this all the time to women in my life who wonder if they settled. "Remember all those guys with whom you had window-rattling sex with kisses that turned you to mush and the screaming orgasms that brought you to tears? Where are those guys? They're gone. And the guy you're with now is loving, supportive, nurturing, and sexy as hell in a grown-up way for the long term."

While I LOVE Brian as Myrna manages to smooth him out and mature him -- Dan is the grown up here. There are clearly issues (Dan and his friends and family dominating the relationship) that can be worked on. But the guy willing to commit and work on that commitment is the doc.

Myrna you may not know where you're exactly going with this story, but your ability to bring us these characters with such trueness (even when you're "cheating" them to the mature side) allows me to care - a lot - about their journey.

LeAnn

[myrna1_2_3]

Thanks so much for the comments!

but is Dan's suppression of his PDA for Justin worse than Brian's overt maneuvers?

I don't even think Dan's suppression of PDA is a negative thing. Brian thinks it is to be sure, and knowing Justin is more loudly out than he is, Dan's self-conscious of it now as well. A lot of people aren't demonstrative in public. That's a personal preference more than a character flaw in my book!

Justin's need to find safer routes to independence is perfectly understandable.

Plus I think that if Justin had stability in all other parts of his life, he wouldn't fixate on financial stability, but at least if he has money in the bank, whatever happens personally won't put him out on the street.

I really want Justin to become his own man, and yet decide that he wants is to be with Dan.

I'm starting to think I should have completely (and concretely) plotted out this dumb story before I started writing it, because I facilate paragraph to paragraph about it! I get an inspiration to send it a certain way, but I've written myself into a corner that prevents a reasonable travail down that path!

[nightsister]

That's a personal preference more than a character flaw in my book!

Yes, exactly. We're reading into *Brian's* opinion, and some people are making it their own. That's quite a testament to your writing.

Plus I think that if Justin had stability in all other parts of his life, he wouldn't fixate on financial stability, but at least if he has money in the bank, whatever happens personally won't put him out on the street.

Is this a big ol' foreshadow, here? ;-)

I get an inspiration to send it a certain way, but I've written myself into a corner that prevents a reasonable travail down that path!

Well, if anyone can write herself out of a corner, it's you. I can't wait to see the next part.