I’m not really sure why I tend to respond to you with an outline, but I’m going to do it again:
1. If the big bad boss is still using Cas as a vessel, sending them the trenchcoat would have been a good move tactically. A. It would falsely lead everyone to think Cas is dead B. They would spend their time looking through all of the other henchmen trying to find the leader C. It was a blow to their morale.
2. And this is so going to bite me in the ass later in the season - Cas was already brought back, but for some reason has been taken out of the game for now - I have tried so hard not to let myself think this, because this will make it hurt so much later. A. Look at 05x01 Cas was brought back, but it either didn’t happen instantaneously or he was sent somewhere B. Look at the state of the coat before he goes into the water - There is blood fresh and not so fresh. There is the black goo. He goes into the water and the things kind of explode free, but the coat has no stains, no rips, and basically no marks at all when Dean picks it up. If Cas was dead, who fixed the coat? I might cry.
I so enjoy discussing theories with you :D I really have to think on my feet.
Not only is there the question of who fixed the coat, but just how did the coat and only the coat float up so conveniently at Dean's feet. If Castiel dissolved, then the coat would still have had the shirt and possibly even the tie attached to it. But since it was just the coat they found, then someone had to take the coat off - it wouldn't just float off a drifting body, for example. And I find it hard to believe it would float so well, especially as to reach land.
Of course, maybe this is all a mute point and the authors just thought it would be sad and dramatic and visually devastating, which, congrats, it was.
I hold fast to my hope that Cas will eventually show up again. At least we still have Crowley around, right? *bites nails*
Good, because they help me keep track of what I’m trying to say :)
The trenchcoat floating empty was the perfect most heart wrenching visual. I had to attempt to watch that scene like five times before I could get through the emotions and actually see it.
It could be a fake coat sent by the Leviathan - They had control of Cas for periods of time, but that just seems to convoluted. Although, I believe they had way more control of him. In 07x01 when God!Leviathan!Whatever!Cas went to force Crowley into work for him, he said specifically that it was because he needed a threat to hold over his enemies and “we need to keep Michael in Lucifer’s cage.” What if the “we” isn’t Cas and Crowley, but the Leviathans? In the Talmud, it says that the archangels Michael and Gabriel will be the ones who slay the Leviathan. -What if Cas was brought back and sent to Gabriel (also resurrected) to plan how to free Michael!Adam and save the world!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
It could have been Cas in a last ditch attempt to let Dean know he’s still in there. Which leads me to more of my theories - I kind of think that the end may be a mirror kind of to 05x22 - With all the Cas is like a brother to them / he’s still one of them sentiments. Also, if Cas is still in there, it could be why Sam and Dean (probably Bobby too) were singled out for annihilation. Cas cares so much for them that he would do anything…because they’re family. It would explain why Cas was brought back in 07x01 - only an angel that had such a strong emotional bond would be able to overcome the big bad and such. *Rambles*
I NEED CROWLEY! PLEASE DON’T LET THEM TAKE HIM! *Begs*
I really hope they go the Talmud and archangel way and deal with Adam, Michael and Gabriel. Adam and Michael have been mentioned (baaaarely) this and last season and that has to be resolved.
Hmm, Leviathon!Godstiel (damnit, it's so hard keeping track of who's running Jimmy's ship!) using "we" regarding Michael could very well be "we the Leviathon folk", although my initial reading was simply "you and me, Crowley". (This is why I keep thinking English needs two "we" versions: "us but not you" and an "us including you"). I do remember a line Castiel said in "The Man Who Would Be King" about how if his and Crowley's plan didn't work, they'd die "over and over" or something like that... Can't remember the wording exactly, but it sounded like there was more to their partnership that just getting power. (Of course, he may have just been referring to Raphael making them toast and not the apocalypse or other things...)
...has anyone ever checked Cas' coatpockets?
Also, if Cas is still in there, it could be why Sam and Dean (probably Bobby too) were singled out for annihilation. Cas cares so much for them that he would do anything - Oh, yes. I didn't believe the Leviathon for a second when it said Cas was dead. He's not running the ship, sure, but not "poof, wing-explosion" dead. My bet's on a "love with save the day" recovery of Castiel, like with Sam and Lucifer.
I NEED CROWLEY! PLEASE DON’T LET THEM TAKE HIM! - My sentiments exactly :)
It always bothers me that they KNOW that Adam is locked in the cage and they KNOW what is happening to him, but they don’t do ANYTHING about it. Where is all that family crap when it comes to Adam?!?
At some point, I am going to do a season six rewatch so I can piece more stuff together. (In my Cas related depression, I have watched Changing Channels far more times than is healthy!)
I really don’t think they have…I now have a burning desire to know what lurks in the recesses of those pockets!?! Have they ever been used? I can’t remember. His sword mostly just kind of appears or it is in his waistband. I really don’t remember seeing him put his phone away or get it out. What the frak is in those pockets? What if Cas hid a message for Dean in the coat before he set it adrift? *Is Dying From Curiosity*
I am really hoping that love saves the day! It would be the perfect complement to the show’s overall message of family not ending with blood. I’ve gotten a bit flailish! Please, let love save the world. Let us all weep tears of joy.
It always bothers me that they KNOW that Adam is locked in the cage and they KNOW what is happening to him, but they don’t do ANYTHING about it. - I'm especially annoyed at Dean not saying a peep about Adam after Death said he couldn't get both Adam and Sam out of hell. Not even a "gee, I wish we could've gotten him out too"?! I hope Sam's hallucinations bring it up (although so far it's been heavy on the "it's just Lucifer and Sam in the cage" angle).
At some point, I am going to do a season six rewatch so I can piece more stuff together. (In my Cas related depression, I have watched Changing Channels far more times than is healthy!) - Oooh, S6 rewatch sounds like it'll help :D I'll theorize alongside you. (And sure, Changing Channels is great as an anti-Castiel-depression measure, but how does it cure the Gabriel-is-dead depression, I ask you?)
My wishlist for S7 finale: 1) love saves the day and 2) everything is shades of grey (in terms of certain villains who help the heroes, and the heroes who are a bit frustrating at times).
It is basically like Adam never existed. It’s so aggravating.
I hope Sam's hallucinations bring it up (although so far it's been heavy on the "it's just Lucifer and Sam in the cage" angle). Seriously, this just sent my mind into overdrive with all kinds of crazy “what ifs.”
I just rewatched The Third Man and I have to do Weekend At Bobby’s this week for my Deanism. Oh the delicious Crowley snark! (Changing Channels is just one of my happy places. I have to believe that our dearest Gabriel will be back…with Cas and Michael!Adam.)
1. If the big bad boss is still using Cas as a vessel, sending them the trenchcoat would have been a good move tactically.
A. It would falsely lead everyone to think Cas is dead
B. They would spend their time looking through all of the other henchmen trying to find the leader
C. It was a blow to their morale.
2. And this is so going to bite me in the ass later in the season - Cas was already brought back, but for some reason has been taken out of the game for now - I have tried so hard not to let myself think this, because this will make it hurt so much later.
A. Look at 05x01 Cas was brought back, but it either didn’t happen instantaneously or he was sent somewhere
B. Look at the state of the coat before he goes into the water - There is blood fresh and not so fresh. There is the black goo. He goes into the water and the things kind of explode free, but the coat has no stains, no rips, and basically no marks at all when Dean picks it up. If Cas was dead, who fixed the coat? I might cry.
I so enjoy discussing theories with you :D I really have to think on my feet.
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Not only is there the question of who fixed the coat, but just how did the coat and only the coat float up so conveniently at Dean's feet. If Castiel dissolved, then the coat would still have had the shirt and possibly even the tie attached to it. But since it was just the coat they found, then someone had to take the coat off - it wouldn't just float off a drifting body, for example. And I find it hard to believe it would float so well, especially as to reach land.
Of course, maybe this is all a mute point and the authors just thought it would be sad and dramatic and visually devastating, which, congrats, it was.
I hold fast to my hope that Cas will eventually show up again. At least we still have Crowley around, right? *bites nails*
Reply
The trenchcoat floating empty was the perfect most heart wrenching visual. I had to attempt to watch that scene like five times before I could get through the emotions and actually see it.
It could be a fake coat sent by the Leviathan - They had control of Cas for periods of time, but that just seems to convoluted. Although, I believe they had way more control of him. In 07x01 when God!Leviathan!Whatever!Cas went to force Crowley into work for him, he said specifically that it was because he needed a threat to hold over his enemies and “we need to keep Michael in Lucifer’s cage.” What if the “we” isn’t Cas and Crowley, but the Leviathans? In the Talmud, it says that the archangels Michael and Gabriel will be the ones who slay the Leviathan. -What if Cas was brought back and sent to Gabriel (also resurrected) to plan how to free Michael!Adam and save the world!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?
It could have been Cas in a last ditch attempt to let Dean know he’s still in there. Which leads me to more of my theories - I kind of think that the end may be a mirror kind of to 05x22 - With all the Cas is like a brother to them / he’s still one of them sentiments. Also, if Cas is still in there, it could be why Sam and Dean (probably Bobby too) were singled out for annihilation. Cas cares so much for them that he would do anything…because they’re family. It would explain why Cas was brought back in 07x01 - only an angel that had such a strong emotional bond would be able to overcome the big bad and such. *Rambles*
I NEED CROWLEY! PLEASE DON’T LET THEM TAKE HIM! *Begs*
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Hmm, Leviathon!Godstiel (damnit, it's so hard keeping track of who's running Jimmy's ship!) using "we" regarding Michael could very well be "we the Leviathon folk", although my initial reading was simply "you and me, Crowley". (This is why I keep thinking English needs two "we" versions: "us but not you" and an "us including you"). I do remember a line Castiel said in "The Man Who Would Be King" about how if his and Crowley's plan didn't work, they'd die "over and over" or something like that... Can't remember the wording exactly, but it sounded like there was more to their partnership that just getting power. (Of course, he may have just been referring to Raphael making them toast and not the apocalypse or other things...)
...has anyone ever checked Cas' coatpockets?
Also, if Cas is still in there, it could be why Sam and Dean (probably Bobby too) were singled out for annihilation. Cas cares so much for them that he would do anything - Oh, yes. I didn't believe the Leviathon for a second when it said Cas was dead. He's not running the ship, sure, but not "poof, wing-explosion" dead. My bet's on a "love with save the day" recovery of Castiel, like with Sam and Lucifer.
I NEED CROWLEY! PLEASE DON’T LET THEM TAKE HIM! - My sentiments exactly :)
...I got a bit wordy there, sorry.
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At some point, I am going to do a season six rewatch so I can piece more stuff together. (In my Cas related depression, I have watched Changing Channels far more times than is healthy!)
I really don’t think they have…I now have a burning desire to know what lurks in the recesses of those pockets!?! Have they ever been used? I can’t remember. His sword mostly just kind of appears or it is in his waistband. I really don’t remember seeing him put his phone away or get it out. What the frak is in those pockets? What if Cas hid a message for Dean in the coat before he set it adrift? *Is Dying From Curiosity*
I am really hoping that love saves the day! It would be the perfect complement to the show’s overall message of family not ending with blood. I’ve gotten a bit flailish! Please, let love save the world. Let us all weep tears of joy.
I like wordy :D
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At some point, I am going to do a season six rewatch so I can piece more stuff together. (In my Cas related depression, I have watched Changing Channels far more times than is healthy!) - Oooh, S6 rewatch sounds like it'll help :D I'll theorize alongside you. (And sure, Changing Channels is great as an anti-Castiel-depression measure, but how does it cure the Gabriel-is-dead depression, I ask you?)
My wishlist for S7 finale: 1) love saves the day and 2) everything is shades of grey (in terms of certain villains who help the heroes, and the heroes who are a bit frustrating at times).
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I hope Sam's hallucinations bring it up (although so far it's been heavy on the "it's just Lucifer and Sam in the cage" angle). Seriously, this just sent my mind into overdrive with all kinds of crazy “what ifs.”
I just rewatched The Third Man and I have to do Weekend At Bobby’s this week for my Deanism. Oh the delicious Crowley snark! (Changing Channels is just one of my happy places. I have to believe that our dearest Gabriel will be back…with Cas and Michael!Adam.)
I second your S7 wishlist!
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