I'm one of those friends who have different opinions with you. I've never had one problem with you, and the one time I disagreed strongly, I said it to your face and even then, nicely. <3333
I heart you to bits and pieces, and yes, it makes me sick that this fandom is full of bullies. It's especially weird to me because Adam represents all kinds of things that could get someone bullied, but he himself does his best to change that. His positive attitude and anti-bullying ideas should encourage people to spread love and acceptance.
But... The comm you're talking about handles things in a way that I had to leave. Screening people, cutting people off without even checking anything. Anyone who disagrees with something gets silenced... And concentrating on the negative and nothing positive... Not my place. It was fun when it was all about silly tinhatting and crazies theories and scenarios, but towards the end, it was just negativity.
And what comes to Sauli... I really don't care what people think about him as long as they don't concentrate on bashing him. Spreading negativity is never nice. But if people dislike him, and sometimes discuss about why, I don't mind at all. And like I said in my own journal entry if Adam is happy with him I'm happy for him. If he isn't I'm not unhappy if they break up. Pressure can rise high. It can make people do crazy things, so I'm not quick to judge people, but I have to agree that this surprised me completely. Neither of them seems violent in any way so it was hurtful to see it happen. But it's his life, and I'll let him do his own mistakes. If this isn't one for him I won't be sad if they stay together.
And yeah, Adam/Tommy is my OTP, and it has nothing to do with real life. It's fanfiction for a reason. Fiction. Fun fiction. :P
I hope this year is good to everyone, and they all find their balance. I wish happiness to all of us. <3333 Everyone in this fandom, including the crazy ones and the bullies and all the people who feel like they've been treated badly. I wish uniting things for this fandom. *hugs* Love you. <33333
Different opinions are fine and I totally respect yours! I respect opinions that are stated rationally and thoughtfully, even if they are not the same as mine. You left the comm you didn't like, and that's the right thing for you to have done.
You did tell me off once to my face, and that was acceptable. <3 You didn't hide, you didn't scoff... you explained it nicely. I did go overboard that time and apologized for that. But nothing I've said since then, even when I thought it was private, is something I wouldn't back up. I'm responsible for my own words, and only my own. I also understand that the person who doesn't like to speculate and gossip is a rare human being. We are full of foibles. The locked comm is not the one that is spreading negativity - it's the one that is keeping it contained. Let it stay there. The nanny comm, OTOH, is freeing it for all to see - even Adam, even Sauli, if they like to trawl the internet for information about themselves. Oh, not to mention Tommy if he'd like to see some extra hate directed at him for no good reason at all.
I agree that Adam is a positive person and is against bullying and for acceptance, although he's done some things that I've definitely looked askance at. He means well, I feel that is certain, but he's made some boo-boos.
I wish I were half as nice as you or Adam, but I was born a curmudgeon. I love you for your sweetness and positivity and lovingness, but me, I'm a snarkster and that will never not be true.
I never hide. I can't hide. I love and respect people too much to do that.
I've once logged off and written to FYE because I didn't want to identify myself as part of that group, but I had to defend Sauli of all people. :P I just can't stand it when people think that just because you've been in Big Brother you're an asshole who has no brains. He was the sweetest thing that has ever set his foot in that house, and he sang, danced, and made friends through his whole stay. He didn't win because he manipulated people. He won because he showed he cared, because he created genuine relationships there, and because people loved him there. I don't watch the show, I didn't even watch his season, but I watched all the clips on youtube because I was fascinated by the fact that he and Niko seemed like they fell in love there, and Niko is straight, so it was extra-fascinating to me. I love human nature. And that was long before he even met Adam. So yeah, I'm kind of upset that people create horrible ideas of him based on the fact that he does things that are considered terribly tasteless and stupid. Like Big Brother and celebrity blogging and that net video thingy.
I really don't mind that people don't find him interesting or pretty or anything much. Why should they? But I do mind if people hate him based on ideas they have of things. I have a hard time understanding hating people you don't know at all. I understand dislike. I understand indifference. But hatred goes beyond me, and then, I will speak up. Hating on anyone, any human being who's living their own life, not hurting anyone, is completely beyond me. And just like glitterwriter said, Adam is a big boy. He can handle his own life. Nobody can protect him but his close ones and he himself. Fans only create distress to him if they try to MAKE HIM SEE WHAT HE'S SUPPOSED TO DO!!! We don't do that to our friends and family members, why should we do that to someone we don't even know?
And yeah, you have no idea how many times I've wanted to defend people I love on FYE. People don't know anything about the people they bash. One of my dearest friends deleted her twitter because her words, her heartfelt words got torn to shreds. She's a sweetheart. She's a sweetie. One of those kinder souls, and these people don't care one bit. So yeah, I don't go there. Not my place. Not where I want to make a home.
I save my hatred for people like George W. Bush. And even then I don't hate because that's giving him power. I DESPISE W.
Sauli I merely dislike. I know zilch about BB here in US or in Finland. I do think Sauli is involved in stupid shit, but that's his right. Adam is still dealing with fallout from becoming famous via a reality show, but to my mind at least that one is (supposedly) about talent. :D
People at the locked comm - to my knowledge - are not attempting to tell Adam what to do. That way lies madness. I can't even make my own family do what I think they should do hahaha. Well, actually sometimes I can. I've saved a few butts here and there in the fam.
I know you have wanted to defend your friends. Same here.
Oh, I was talking about it on a larger scale when I said that people try to tell Adam what he should do. All those people who send him tweets: "these and these people are being horrible, make them stop." Or all those people who try to make him see that he should either be with Tommy (or reveal his secret relationship with Tommy) or break up with Sauli or not wear a stupid hat or grow a beard or whatever people want to tell him... that's when people go overboard. If they talk among themselves, and they have similar mindsets and they are not tweeting these things to anyone else, and especially if they talk in a locked comm, then they should have their right to talk there, in private, about what the heck ever they want. But making it Adam's business in anyway, tweeting him about fandomly things, taking his life too personally, trying to own his life and the right to his life, getting angry at other people for not agreeing with how Adam should live his life... Anything that hurts your own life or hurts someone who could be close to you or hurts any of the people you're talking about because you force them to hear you then it goes overboard.
That's what I meant by it. People become miserable if they want Adam Lambert to fulfill their dreams. That's not going to happen. He's fulfilling his own dreams. He's living his own life. And it's never going to be a perfect fairytale. It's always going to be a nasty real experience with its lawsuits, and wrong spouses, and ugly clothes, and stupid mistakes, because he's a person. He tries. He's very good at trying. But he will disappoint people if they want him to be awesome, when he's just a person.
I have no idea why anyone would want to feel miserable about his boyfriend. Sauli is his boyfriend and his problem. It's none of our business in any way. This is why I don't understand the intense hatred. Just like I don't understand the intense hatred towards Tommy. They are all just people. Tommy isn't perfect either. He says stupid things, and he can be inconsiderate. But he's also a good person. Nobody has to like him either, but to hate him for some of his stupid fans? Or because he gets to be where those haters would like to be? What? I don't even know.
So yeah, I don't understand overprotectiveness. I don't understand claiming a right to Adam's life: He should do this or he totally sucks. I don't understand the need to control any part of his reality. I do understand discussion about things, and thinking that some of his life choices are stupid, or that the beard really looks horrible on him. But I don't understand hating on anyone, fans or friends or Adam himself. I don't get intense and fierce love that turns into obsession and the need to have the only exactly right opinion that matters.
None of us know who they really are. They all deserve that from us: I don't know you, but I respect you as a person.
I have no idea if this makes any sense. I'm soooo tired I'm falling on my face. :) *hugs* <3333333333333
That makes total sense and I'm in agreement with everything you are saying here. I think there is less obsession and less hatred than some might think. But there is SOME for certain. Getting obsessed with the life of someone we don't know simply is not helpful. We have our own lives to lead, as you say. Nothing is more important to each of us than that.
But if he EVER shaves his head again like he had it in the EMAs... look out, Adam. Ugh, that was a horrible look. *shudders* Still I would never tell him that. :)
But... The comm you're talking about handles things in a way that I had to leave. Screening people, cutting people off without even checking anything. Anyone who disagrees with something gets silenced... And concentrating on the negative and nothing positive...
Yeah, and the ONE TIME I actually laughed at something I found to be both funny and ridiculous, I got gut, unfollowed and unfriended, and you know what? I'M GLAD. Because say what you want about the "bully comm"...and really, are we not seeing the glaring similarities here?...but at least the shit they say is unlocked and anyone can see it. The anon commenting? Whatever. As I've said, I don't have the time or inclination to log off and anon comment, and besides, if I say it, I'm sticking my name on it. But as far as the locked comm goes, it's not about shipping or tinhatting. That 'ship' sailed a long time ago. It's bile. When you go from dislike to hate to accusing people YOU DON'T KNOW OF ABUSE...sorry, but that's a problem. Saying someone's stupid, crazy, delusional is one thing. Actually accusing someone of abuse is something else altogether.
There it is. Like it or not. Not defending anyone, even if it seems that way. Just the way I see it. And if this gets me unfriended by more people, so be it. It's mine and I own it.
I'm not in the abusive-relationship camp, but I am in the this-is-fucked-up-probably-beyond-repair camp. At the same time, I'd have to re-read everything to see for sure (and don't have the inclination to do that), but I can't recall that anyone is doing any accusing, as such. Maybe I'm being pollyanna-ish but to me it's speculation. Something we all do about all sorts of people we know and don't know.
It's the bully comm that fails to see the similarities between themselves and the people they are shrieking themselves silly over. Yes, both comms can be negative, and I accept people for being at times mean-spirited in their humor. God knows I can be. You should hear me talk about the Rethug candidates. I am a curmudgeon but I am not the kind of curmudgeon who attacks ordinary people for their opinions after I dragged them out in the open. Regardless of whether you believe it's shipping, tinhatting, or whatever, why not just let people be?
You most certainly will not be unfriended by me. I like hearing your take on things. Thanks! <3
Ihad this comment all written out, then my husband snatched the cord outta my laptop while vacuuming, so it shut down and I lost all of it. So, here's the short version.
This guy I dated years ago and I got into a screaming drunken argument outside a club. He punched a tree. Guess what? Bad behavior? Yep. Guess what else? I've been married to him for over 25 years, and we've been through a lot. So...fucked up relationship? I suppose people could say that about me. The difference is, mine didn't/doesn't play out in the press. The whole incident at the club comes down to one thing: a game of Telephone. Several people were there, everyone had a different take on what happened. End of story. We don't know what actually happened, and probably never will. But after the grief that Adam went through with Brad, I really don't think he's gonna stay in an unhealthy relationship. You think he really cares what we'd say or think if he broke up with Sauli? I don't. It was said that Adam sounded sad, looking for validation. Well, wouldn't you if something you did was smeared all over the place and people were sending you vile tweets and spreading lies? Something to think about.
As for this: It's the bully comm that fails to see the similarities between themselves and the people they are shrieking themselves silly over That's just it. THEY DO GET IT. They make fun of it! And that's what I didn't get the first time I was there. They don't take themselves or much of anything else seriously. People read a snippet of a thread and flip out. They don't care or bother to read all that goes before it. I think they might be surprised. Actually, I saw more pearl-clutching there during the bar thing than I saw anywhere else. I also saw a shitload of people going WE DON'T KNOW ANYTHING YET, CALM DOWN. Everywhere else? Abuse, liar, manipulator, GTFO...you see what I'm saying? The other thing I saw there and on my Twitter feed but nowhere else was concern for ADAM. Some were too busy looking for someone to blame, and we both know who got that dumped on them, and not enough time wondering how this was going to affect Adam personally and professionally.
Fucking vacuuming! I mean it, it's second only to ironing in horribleness. Well, and mopping floors.
Sounds like YMMV in your relationship. :D I know a buttload of gay people (well, straight too) who've been together for decades and not one has ever had anything like that happen. Doesn't mean it can't, of course, and I do have friends who drink and have been in jail - even family members! Everyone's different and vive la difference.
I do think Adam's looking for validation. He went from nobody to somebody - to massive adulation, to screaming fans and sold-out concerts for a year and then... crickets. He badly needs to get back on tour. It's his dream, and he's a performer, and performing is what he wants to do. So yeah, that's my opinion.
I really do not think the bullies get it. That is, many people hang out there, lurk there, comment there, etc. and they are of all types. Some just want news. Plenty of decent fans go there. But the ones who c/p someone specific and then bully? - no, I think they are bitter, nasty, and do not get it. We'll just have to disagree on that.
Perhaps you'd be surprised to learn how much concern for Adam there is in the locked comm. There is a LOT. Many of us wanted to give him a hug after learning he was crying, or just thinking of him in jail, or even when there's something as silly as a bad review on his single.
25 years is a milestone! Congrats to you for that. :D
I heart you to bits and pieces, and yes, it makes me sick that this fandom is full of bullies. It's especially weird to me because Adam represents all kinds of things that could get someone bullied, but he himself does his best to change that. His positive attitude and anti-bullying ideas should encourage people to spread love and acceptance.
But... The comm you're talking about handles things in a way that I had to leave. Screening people, cutting people off without even checking anything. Anyone who disagrees with something gets silenced... And concentrating on the negative and nothing positive... Not my place. It was fun when it was all about silly tinhatting and crazies theories and scenarios, but towards the end, it was just negativity.
And what comes to Sauli... I really don't care what people think about him as long as they don't concentrate on bashing him. Spreading negativity is never nice. But if people dislike him, and sometimes discuss about why, I don't mind at all. And like I said in my own journal entry if Adam is happy with him I'm happy for him. If he isn't I'm not unhappy if they break up. Pressure can rise high. It can make people do crazy things, so I'm not quick to judge people, but I have to agree that this surprised me completely. Neither of them seems violent in any way so it was hurtful to see it happen. But it's his life, and I'll let him do his own mistakes. If this isn't one for him I won't be sad if they stay together.
And yeah, Adam/Tommy is my OTP, and it has nothing to do with real life. It's fanfiction for a reason. Fiction. Fun fiction. :P
I hope this year is good to everyone, and they all find their balance. I wish happiness to all of us. <3333 Everyone in this fandom, including the crazy ones and the bullies and all the people who feel like they've been treated badly. I wish uniting things for this fandom. *hugs* Love you. <33333
Reply
You did tell me off once to my face, and that was acceptable. <3 You didn't hide, you didn't scoff... you explained it nicely. I did go overboard that time and apologized for that. But nothing I've said since then, even when I thought it was private, is something I wouldn't back up. I'm responsible for my own words, and only my own. I also understand that the person who doesn't like to speculate and gossip is a rare human being. We are full of foibles. The locked comm is not the one that is spreading negativity - it's the one that is keeping it contained. Let it stay there. The nanny comm, OTOH, is freeing it for all to see - even Adam, even Sauli, if they like to trawl the internet for information about themselves. Oh, not to mention Tommy if he'd like to see some extra hate directed at him for no good reason at all.
I agree that Adam is a positive person and is against bullying and for acceptance, although he's done some things that I've definitely looked askance at. He means well, I feel that is certain, but he's made some boo-boos.
I wish I were half as nice as you or Adam, but I was born a curmudgeon. I love you for your sweetness and positivity and lovingness, but me, I'm a snarkster and that will never not be true.
<333 Thank you for speaking out.
Reply
I've once logged off and written to FYE because I didn't want to identify myself as part of that group, but I had to defend Sauli of all people. :P I just can't stand it when people think that just because you've been in Big Brother you're an asshole who has no brains. He was the sweetest thing that has ever set his foot in that house, and he sang, danced, and made friends through his whole stay. He didn't win because he manipulated people. He won because he showed he cared, because he created genuine relationships there, and because people loved him there. I don't watch the show, I didn't even watch his season, but I watched all the clips on youtube because I was fascinated by the fact that he and Niko seemed like they fell in love there, and Niko is straight, so it was extra-fascinating to me. I love human nature. And that was long before he even met Adam. So yeah, I'm kind of upset that people create horrible ideas of him based on the fact that he does things that are considered terribly tasteless and stupid. Like Big Brother and celebrity blogging and that net video thingy.
I really don't mind that people don't find him interesting or pretty or anything much. Why should they? But I do mind if people hate him based on ideas they have of things. I have a hard time understanding hating people you don't know at all. I understand dislike. I understand indifference. But hatred goes beyond me, and then, I will speak up. Hating on anyone, any human being who's living their own life, not hurting anyone, is completely beyond me. And just like glitterwriter said, Adam is a big boy. He can handle his own life. Nobody can protect him but his close ones and he himself. Fans only create distress to him if they try to MAKE HIM SEE WHAT HE'S SUPPOSED TO DO!!! We don't do that to our friends and family members, why should we do that to someone we don't even know?
And yeah, you have no idea how many times I've wanted to defend people I love on FYE. People don't know anything about the people they bash. One of my dearest friends deleted her twitter because her words, her heartfelt words got torn to shreds. She's a sweetheart. She's a sweetie. One of those kinder souls, and these people don't care one bit. So yeah, I don't go there. Not my place. Not where I want to make a home.
Reply
Sauli I merely dislike. I know zilch about BB here in US or in Finland. I do think Sauli is involved in stupid shit, but that's his right. Adam is still dealing with fallout from becoming famous via a reality show, but to my mind at least that one is (supposedly) about talent. :D
People at the locked comm - to my knowledge - are not attempting to tell Adam what to do. That way lies madness. I can't even make my own family do what I think they should do hahaha. Well, actually sometimes I can. I've saved a few butts here and there in the fam.
I know you have wanted to defend your friends. Same here.
Reply
That's what I meant by it. People become miserable if they want Adam Lambert to fulfill their dreams. That's not going to happen. He's fulfilling his own dreams. He's living his own life. And it's never going to be a perfect fairytale. It's always going to be a nasty real experience with its lawsuits, and wrong spouses, and ugly clothes, and stupid mistakes, because he's a person. He tries. He's very good at trying. But he will disappoint people if they want him to be awesome, when he's just a person.
I have no idea why anyone would want to feel miserable about his boyfriend. Sauli is his boyfriend and his problem. It's none of our business in any way. This is why I don't understand the intense hatred. Just like I don't understand the intense hatred towards Tommy. They are all just people. Tommy isn't perfect either. He says stupid things, and he can be inconsiderate. But he's also a good person. Nobody has to like him either, but to hate him for some of his stupid fans? Or because he gets to be where those haters would like to be? What? I don't even know.
So yeah, I don't understand overprotectiveness. I don't understand claiming a right to Adam's life: He should do this or he totally sucks. I don't understand the need to control any part of his reality. I do understand discussion about things, and thinking that some of his life choices are stupid, or that the beard really looks horrible on him. But I don't understand hating on anyone, fans or friends or Adam himself. I don't get intense and fierce love that turns into obsession and the need to have the only exactly right opinion that matters.
None of us know who they really are. They all deserve that from us: I don't know you, but I respect you as a person.
I have no idea if this makes any sense. I'm soooo tired I'm falling on my face. :) *hugs* <3333333333333
Reply
But if he EVER shaves his head again like he had it in the EMAs... look out, Adam. Ugh, that was a horrible look. *shudders* Still I would never tell him that. :)
ILU <333333
Reply
*hugs* ILU so much! <3333333333333333
Reply
Reply
Yeah, and the ONE TIME I actually laughed at something I found to be both funny and ridiculous, I got gut, unfollowed and unfriended, and you know what? I'M GLAD. Because say what you want about the "bully comm"...and really, are we not seeing the glaring similarities here?...but at least the shit they say is unlocked and anyone can see it. The anon commenting? Whatever. As I've said, I don't have the time or inclination to log off and anon comment, and besides, if I say it, I'm sticking my name on it. But as far as the locked comm goes, it's not about shipping or tinhatting. That 'ship' sailed a long time ago. It's bile. When you go from dislike to hate to accusing people YOU DON'T KNOW OF ABUSE...sorry, but that's a problem. Saying someone's stupid, crazy, delusional is one thing. Actually accusing someone of abuse is something else altogether.
There it is. Like it or not. Not defending anyone, even if it seems that way. Just the way I see it. And if this gets me unfriended by more people, so be it. It's mine and I own it.
Reply
It's the bully comm that fails to see the similarities between themselves and the people they are shrieking themselves silly over. Yes, both comms can be negative, and I accept people for being at times mean-spirited in their humor. God knows I can be. You should hear me talk about the Rethug candidates. I am a curmudgeon but I am not the kind of curmudgeon who attacks ordinary people for their opinions after I dragged them out in the open. Regardless of whether you believe it's shipping, tinhatting, or whatever, why not just let people be?
You most certainly will not be unfriended by me. I like hearing your take on things. Thanks! <3
Reply
This guy I dated years ago and I got into a screaming drunken argument outside a club. He punched a tree. Guess what? Bad behavior? Yep. Guess what else? I've been married to him for over 25 years, and we've been through a lot. So...fucked up relationship? I suppose people could say that about me. The difference is, mine didn't/doesn't play out in the press. The whole incident at the club comes down to one thing: a game of Telephone. Several people were there, everyone had a different take on what happened. End of story. We don't know what actually happened, and probably never will. But after the grief that Adam went through with Brad, I really don't think he's gonna stay in an unhealthy relationship. You think he really cares what we'd say or think if he broke up with Sauli? I don't. It was said that Adam sounded sad, looking for validation. Well, wouldn't you if something you did was smeared all over the place and people were sending you vile tweets and spreading lies? Something to think about.
As for this: It's the bully comm that fails to see the similarities between themselves and the people they are shrieking themselves silly over That's just it. THEY DO GET IT. They make fun of it! And that's what I didn't get the first time I was there. They don't take themselves or much of anything else seriously. People read a snippet of a thread and flip out. They don't care or bother to read all that goes before it. I think they might be surprised. Actually, I saw more pearl-clutching there during the bar thing than I saw anywhere else. I also saw a shitload of people going WE DON'T KNOW ANYTHING YET, CALM DOWN. Everywhere else? Abuse, liar, manipulator, GTFO...you see what I'm saying? The other thing I saw there and on my Twitter feed but nowhere else was concern for ADAM. Some were too busy looking for someone to blame, and we both know who got that dumped on them, and not enough time wondering how this was going to affect Adam personally and professionally.
Reply
Sounds like YMMV in your relationship. :D I know a buttload of gay people (well, straight too) who've been together for decades and not one has ever had anything like that happen. Doesn't mean it can't, of course, and I do have friends who drink and have been in jail - even family members! Everyone's different and vive la difference.
I do think Adam's looking for validation. He went from nobody to somebody - to massive adulation, to screaming fans and sold-out concerts for a year and then... crickets. He badly needs to get back on tour. It's his dream, and he's a performer, and performing is what he wants to do. So yeah, that's my opinion.
I really do not think the bullies get it. That is, many people hang out there, lurk there, comment there, etc. and they are of all types. Some just want news. Plenty of decent fans go there. But the ones who c/p someone specific and then bully? - no, I think they are bitter, nasty, and do not get it. We'll just have to disagree on that.
Perhaps you'd be surprised to learn how much concern for Adam there is in the locked comm. There is a LOT. Many of us wanted to give him a hug after learning he was crying, or just thinking of him in jail, or even when there's something as silly as a bad review on his single.
25 years is a milestone! Congrats to you for that. :D
Reply
Leave a comment