(Untitled)

[lldj_x]

I think everybody should stop being so anti-pill..

They do not create happiness...they enhance it with added euphoria.

Its not like there gona kill you...or will they..?

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No Boyment intended...but when I see something like this..I have to share it.

I have 1

Comments

[pleasantperson]

Slave labour (meaning people don't get paid anything) and sweatshop labour (meaning people get paid hardly anything) are different things, but in my view and the view of most people with empathy and semi-human morals think that it's wrong to make money from other peoples misery.
Corporations that exploit are supported by capitalist governments in order to make maximum profit from people that don't know any better, and that don't live but hardly survive. Western society lives off these these people, we owe them at least 10p more than they get.
It's unjust.

All humans are equal.

xo-

[lldj_x]

i understand where ur coming from.

but people in slave labour do get paid. a very small amount but they get something.

and they do live...they just don't have the luck that we had.

All humans ARE equal...its just I don't understand what worrying about them will do.

If you really care that much go out there n give em all ur money.

I'd rather live my life without having someone I know absolutely nothing about on my conscience.

xXx

[pleasantperson]

Ignorance is bliss, but I can't ignore facts. I really wish I could sometimes, though, so I understand what you mean by your last sentence.
I worry a lot, but I act as much as I can, like writing things for Amnesty International, and through that I put pressure on corrupt governments.
I don't have anything bad on my conscience, hardly.

Love natacha xo

[expensive_habit]

yeh but are you really prepared to start paying probably triple if not more for your clothes/coffee/etc simply so someone you will never meet will be able to live decently thus completly fucking our whole capitalist system and economy which relies on there always being someone poorer to do the job for us and therefore causing a significant drop in your standard of living? Its bad enough India and China will overtake us as global powers soon...of course no one wants people to be poor and exploited but i'd rather them than me.
if u get lucky through birth and circumstance (earning over 28k puts you in the top 1% highest paid in the world) then u might as well enjoy it

"we owe them at least 10p more than they get." - lol how generous.

[lldj_x]

YES

10p...hehe..ill give them a pound if they need it that badly.

[pleasantperson]

I wouldn't have to pay triple for anything if the corporation didn't charge me 3 times more, and it wouldn't have to if it didn't take ridiculous profit.
I don't care about capitalism, I hate our country, I'm for socialism ideally, which means the abolition of the elite owning the means of production, meaning we all own more or less equal pay, with no profit to be made.
Stalinism is not socialism. I know that socialism in practice doesn't work, but in theory does. Taking small tips from socialism in trade would free sweatshop workers.

(key words were AT LEAST, and 10p is a lot more in India).

x

[expensive_habit]

are you a social democratic or a democratic socialist?

[pleasantperson]

Social Democratic, I don't think that a revolution is the way, gradual changes are more stable.
I like talking about this sort of stuff, nobody ever asks things like that.

xo-

[expensive_habit]

lol i don't think LJ is very much the hotspot of political and ideological debate but still..it would be more interesting than some of the stuff people post x

[saidso]

if you hate my country. leave. elitism is what makes us great. "pick the best and forget the rest".

And with slave labour. you go talk to someone in a sweatshop. they don't care whatsoever about the conditions, they love western countries, without whom they'd have no life. Those in the sweatshops are deeemed the lucky ones, wealth and a good lifestyle is all comparative so it makes no sense to compare us to the third world.

[pleasantperson]

Have you ever talked to someone in a sweatshop, Guy?
Ok, thanks.

We depend on them, yes, they depend on us, but it doesn't mean we should pay them so poorly.
The reason we pay them so poorly is because we know that without us they would have no money, so we get away with it, and if that is your reasoning you are disgusting.

I don't want to fight on this one, but I put my opinion up to be challenged because I think mine is the most moral.

xo

[saidso]

my sister is in thailand at the moment working in an orphanage with kids who work in sweatshops. they don't think they are paid poorly.

but i don't think you are being that moral to be honest. why should some people have to feel guilty just because they are born in a certain place with parents of a certain wealth. i have 20quid in my pocket, but id much rather spend it on beer or food than feel guilty that im not giving a poorer kid false hope.

[pleasantperson]

Why do you think they are called sweatshops, they are paid poorly, and a lot of them cannot join trade-unions. Children to start with shouldn't work. We would not be having this conversation if we both didn't know that they weren't being paid fairly.

As long as you feel empathy for people who work for nothing you are okay, I'm not saying give all your money away. I don't think you're stupid guy, I believe you feel at least a little sympathy for them.
My opinions all tend to be normative-ethical, which is a branch of morals that I stand by, trying to believe in the greater good of humans.

I'm stopping now.
x

[frownymoo]

normative ethics is very broad.. it covers many theories.. virtue ethics, situation ethics etc. etc. and.. utilitarianism which means an action is good if it leaves the largest amount of people with pleasure.
i'm not sure what side i will reside to but if everything thaddeus said, perhaps this would mean the situation of sweatshops is a good thing. Also things are constantly in the process of improving conditions. and as for them being underpaid, comparatively, there prices there are much cheaper, perhaps it is not as clear cut as it being immoral to run sweatshops..

x x

[pleasantperson]

Utilitarianism is my favourite, I'm not sure about act or rule utilitarianism though, I'm not sure of the difference properly.
If everything Thaddeus said is true then we are putting our own wealth first over the welfare of others.
I think that is probably the natural thing to think, but I don't think that. I think we can still be wealthy and pay them better.

I've written here more than anyone else, I feel a bit bad, so I'm stopping.

x

[expensive_habit]

I mean, I'm sure that it is possible to pay higher wages but then if you think of the amount of people these companies employ.. its quite a lot. So companies are unprepared to raise the price to pay for higher wages because it exposes them to competition, and are unprepared to foot the bill itself because it will damage profits/shares etc.. ultimately i guess that its not really in any corporation's interests to pay people higher wages in poor countries that lack workers rights and they can therefore get away with.

Morally, I'd say its wrong because it is theoretically possible to pay these people higher and there is a massive difference in between what we earn and what they earn for doing effectively similar jobs