Participate in the Blogger Challenge & Help Students and Schools

Sep 28, 2007 13:54

One of the best kept secrets about the LiveJournal community is how incredibly generous you all are. It's not just the fact that so many of you volunteer to help LJ out, or are such active participants in communities online. It's what you do to support communities offline that makes us so proud of what LJ is. (A recent example was the way you all ( Read more... )

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Bait & switch is against the law. elfwreck September 30 2007, 22:15:47 UTC
They are breaking laws if they promise a certain set of rules, and then follow another... it's fraud to convince people to give you money and then change the rules they expect to follow.

If the rules are "no advocating activities that harm children," but in practice it's "no advocating sexuality in a context that makes people think of children, but advocating stuff that actually causes physical harm is okay," then they've deceived their users--they've convinced people that LJ is safe for children in a way that it's not.

I sincerely hope some family member of a member of pro_anorexia sues them for not following their own TOS after numerous notifications. Hopefully, for the full set of medical bills, plus pain & suffering.

Changing the terms of service without notifying the membership is a crime. And that includes changing the actual conduct expected from the customers, not just changing the words on the TOS page... no court is going to accept "the TOS says we can do anything we want and therefore we never broke our side of the bargain." That logic's been found faulty in court before--you can't have a contract that says, "You pay us for service, which will be anything we decide it is, and we can change or shut it off at any time, and you have to agree to anything else we think is required."

If that were legal, 6A could change the TOS to say "all Free members must give blowjobs to the staff on request." Or they could say, "we own full copyrights of everything posted on LJ, and can republish any of it we want in any venue.

A contract has to have terms, for both sides, and "we can change them to whatever we want, whenever we want" is not legally acceptable.

(I'm in the process of leaving. I've set up at IJ. I bought a perm account there. Before this happened, I'd been planning to buy one here. I've dropped my account from Paid to Basic, and shut off v-gifts; no money to LJ from me.)

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Re: Bait & switch is against the law. laren September 30 2007, 22:52:28 UTC
Your response has logic! I thank you for telling me something that makes sense in a mature and rational way. <3

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Re: Bait & switch is against the law. elfwreck September 30 2007, 23:12:24 UTC
Thank you for listening.

I know there's a lot of wank going on (and I'm slinging some of it; I love wankfests), but at the core, there's a real sense of being violated--of having the rules yanked out from under us, and being fed a line of hype that's supposed to be soothing.

We could tolerate "no sexual content on LJ." We'd bitch like hell, because that's not what the rule was a year ago, but we'd deal. But this idea of "the rules are whatever we say they are today, and tomorrow we can change them, and we'll say who is and is not breaking them and not tell you why," followed by "it's all to PROTECT THE CHILDREN!!!" is not sitting well with people.

There's a lot of nit-picky demanding of details, because we can't sort out what the standards are. "No harm to children," but it's okay to call a group pro-anorexia, and allow minors to join?! WTF?

Combine that with the multiple promises to get back to people about their questions (including the "we'll post updates on our progress" in the August 13 LJ-Biz post), and the increasing number of advertisements being inflicted even on paid users... and we no longer trust LJ/6A; we look for attempts to lie or cheat the customers in every post, 'cos we're firmly convinced they've no longer got any dedication to the original goal of providing a place to speak freely.

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Re: Bait & switch is against the law. laren September 30 2007, 23:29:51 UTC
I definitely hear what you're saying and I agree that it's worth being concerned about. As someone who has never posted that kind of content, none of this affects me personally and therefore it is easy for me to not care all that much about what's going on. That's not to say that I don't care at all, because I do agree that LJ/6A have been making some bad moves. However, it has not affected me in such a way that I feel like I should leave.

If all the people who were commenting on this were calm, rational, and had some basis for their claims (like you do), I don't think people would be "bitching about the bitching" nearly as much. I believe that most of the people on LiveJournal value diversity and freedom of speech as much as anyone. The problem is that a lot of the commenters are really just aggravating the situation by not expressing themselves in a mature and rational way that would make the observer say "hey, this person is worth acknowledging!".

People who are so angry at LJ but maintain paid/plus accounts and continue to use the service aren't really doing anything to create change, you know?

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Re: Bait & switch is against the law. averysmallthing October 3 2007, 01:28:12 UTC
If all the people who were commenting on this were calm, rational, and had some basis for their claims

A lot of people started out calm and rational, and as we continued to receive no response, and as lj staff and abuse members said one thing and then did another thing entirely, people slowly lost their cool. People have lost their tempers, and it's really hard to give the benefit of he doubt at this point.

It's really easy to assume the worst, however.

I've been here for years, I'm a part of this community, and just like you and everyone else with an LJ account, I am allowed to speak up and speak out on what I think 6A needs to do to make the community better. Even if you don't like what I have to say.

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Re: Bait & switch is against the law. laren October 3 2007, 02:59:37 UTC
I've never said that anyone couldn't speak out. In case you haven't been reading my previous comments, I'm all for free speech. However, I am also allowed to call people idiots for losing their cool on a LiveJournal comments page. :)

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Re: Bait & switch is against the law. averysmallthing October 3 2007, 03:48:13 UTC
It would be silly if you had. You don't have any control over who comments about what. But you did say that instead of sticking it out and waiting for the response we were promised and attempting to improve the LJ community, we should ditch and move to another service.

Because that's what community is all about.

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Re: Bait & switch is against the law. laren October 4 2007, 05:32:08 UTC
If people want to stick around on a basic account and not support any user or community with a plus account (which has ads which increase LJ/6A revenue), that's their choice. But a lot of the people who piss and moan are using a plus account, which really isn't putting their money where their mouth is at all.

I also think it's kind of a hopeless situation, but then that's just me.

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