Do you mind if I ask for a spot of advice on number nine? I'm horribly wary of too much exposition, as it used to be my problem when I first started writing, so I'm having issues looking at my current situation objectively.
I have one character, B, who knows a lot about a little-known magic. Character C wants to know more about this magic, as it deeply affects him, but he didn't even know what it really was before he met B. B's willing to explain it all to him, and answer any questions he has.
This magic is the basic magic my story (about novel length) deals with. How much exposition should I show in my conversation between B and C? I've tried to write the scene three times now, sometimes with more exposition, sometimes with less, and I can't decide.
So, as a critical reader - how much exposition would be good? Should I summarize a lot, or go into detail? I figure the best would be to strike a balance between them, but should I lean towards one more than the other?
Completely unrelated, point 8, the missing objects, shows up waaaay too much in published fantasy. I can't even count the number spontaneously reappearing items and disappearing characters I've encountered. It makes me want to throw the book or something when that happens. What lazy *editing*, much less writing.
Speaking for myself, I can say that when it comes to magic systems, I love to know all the technical nitty gritty. It's a problem my writing suffers from too. I'm obsessed with explaining how everything works, but terrified I'm boring everyone else to death.
Thanks for your thoughts! I still don't know exactly how much I'll be adding, but I'll keep in mind that lots of people enjoy reading about the system. I do to, which is part of my problem - I want to share it with other people. :)
If I may, I'd like to give my own opinion too. I think a character should only explain what is relevant. Since character C knows little about the magic, it'd be best for character B to give the fundamental basics. If he prattled off on the great history and symbolism of the magic and heaps of little details, it's too much information too soon. Maybe he could constantly give character C little 'lessons' through the story, moving more indepth.
Basically, this holds true to any two characters where one explains. The information depends on what the other character knows, wants to know, and their personality. One character might love hearing about symbolism, while another would only care about more practical things.
That's essentially my take on it, but I'd state it a little differently:
What do we need to know?
We, the readers, don't need the whole explanation - the history, the symbolism, etc. - unless it's important to understanding the story. Be parsimonious with your dialogue; tell the readers exactly as much as they need to know (which may be nothing), and handwave the rest:
[B] talked to [C] long into the night about the intricacy and mystery of magic. [A] wasn't really paying attention, although she thought "you can't do magic if you don't have a holly leaf glued to your forehead with your own saliva" might be valuable information someday. [B] and [C] seemed to be enjoying their conversation, though, so she contented herself with stalking the outside of the camp, watching the shapes in the forest shift and slip in the light of the campfire.
C is getting the information, B is giving it willingly, but the only thing the readers have had to learn is that magic is intricate, has mysteries, and requires holly leaves and salivation.
True, but don't forget that an infodump basically is telling the reader all this information, using the conversation as a medium. So somehow you've gotta find a middle ground.
But besides, using a conversation of telling a newbie also helps in educating the reader at the same time. I've seen a few cases where the story has someone who's a newbie at something, so it can be explained to them/the reader. Works rather well.
Yeah, I never intended for B to go on about the history or anything, but there are a few complex aspects of magic that are going to be important later. The biggest problem is that B and C are going to split up soon after they discuss the magic, so I don't have a lot of time for B to explain. I might just change some of the later plot and have C blunder around a bit more.
Thanks also for pointing out it's character-dependent, how much and what type of information will be shared. I think I lost sight of that in my confusion.
Unfortunately, I probably can't do that, because the problem isn't that I need to tell the *readers* exactly what's happening - it's more that the *character* will want a lot of details. His life is greatly affected by this magic, and it explains a lot for him, and he's going to want to know as much as possible. I'm just not sure how much I can get away with summarizing versus telling.
Some of the best ways for getting around the infodump:
-Include interruptions. Some of them- like gestures and facial expressions and so on- are necessary to let us know that the characters aren't talking heads. Some- like the thoughts of the viewpoint character, impertinent questions, and so on- will give more of the semblance of a real conversation. Some- like the narrator pausing to take a breath or take a drink of wine- will break up the infodump.
-Build up anticipation first, so that by the time the conversation rolls around, the reader is really interested in hearing what's going on.
-Write it as clearly as possible. Infodumps often get tangled in new and intricate names, passive voice, and obscure verbiage.
-Scatter bits. If some information can possibly be saved, save it.
Thanks a lot! I already have a lot of breaks, but I think I'll have to see about building the anticipation. I'll also have to take a closer look to see if I used the passive voice - I don't *think* I did, but my memory is never perfect. I think I do most of the rest of the stuff (lack of names or verbiage, and leaving as much as I think I can out), but I'll carefully look that over, too.
I have one character, B, who knows a lot about a little-known magic. Character C wants to know more about this magic, as it deeply affects him, but he didn't even know what it really was before he met B. B's willing to explain it all to him, and answer any questions he has.
This magic is the basic magic my story (about novel length) deals with. How much exposition should I show in my conversation between B and C? I've tried to write the scene three times now, sometimes with more exposition, sometimes with less, and I can't decide.
So, as a critical reader - how much exposition would be good? Should I summarize a lot, or go into detail? I figure the best would be to strike a balance between them, but should I lean towards one more than the other?
Completely unrelated, point 8, the missing objects, shows up waaaay too much in published fantasy. I can't even count the number spontaneously reappearing items and disappearing characters I've encountered. It makes me want to throw the book or something when that happens. What lazy *editing*, much less writing.
Great rant, as always. :)
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Basically, this holds true to any two characters where one explains. The information depends on what the other character knows, wants to know, and their personality. One character might love hearing about symbolism, while another would only care about more practical things.
So yeah. Shutting up now. *flee*
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What do we need to know?
We, the readers, don't need the whole explanation - the history, the symbolism, etc. - unless it's important to understanding the story. Be parsimonious with your dialogue; tell the readers exactly as much as they need to know (which may be nothing), and handwave the rest:
[B] talked to [C] long into the night about the intricacy and mystery of magic. [A] wasn't really paying attention, although she thought "you can't do magic if you don't have a holly leaf glued to your forehead with your own saliva" might be valuable information someday. [B] and [C] seemed to be enjoying their conversation, though, so she contented herself with stalking the outside of the camp, watching the shapes in the forest shift and slip in the light of the campfire.
C is getting the information, B is giving it willingly, but the only thing the readers have had to learn is that magic is intricate, has mysteries, and requires holly leaves and salivation.
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But besides, using a conversation of telling a newbie also helps in educating the reader at the same time. I've seen a few cases where the story has someone who's a newbie at something, so it can be explained to them/the reader. Works rather well.
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Yeah, I never intended for B to go on about the history or anything, but there are a few complex aspects of magic that are going to be important later. The biggest problem is that B and C are going to split up soon after they discuss the magic, so I don't have a lot of time for B to explain. I might just change some of the later plot and have C blunder around a bit more.
Thanks also for pointing out it's character-dependent, how much and what type of information will be shared. I think I lost sight of that in my confusion.
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Unfortunately, I probably can't do that, because the problem isn't that I need to tell the *readers* exactly what's happening - it's more that the *character* will want a lot of details. His life is greatly affected by this magic, and it explains a lot for him, and he's going to want to know as much as possible. I'm just not sure how much I can get away with summarizing versus telling.
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-Include interruptions. Some of them- like gestures and facial expressions and so on- are necessary to let us know that the characters aren't talking heads. Some- like the thoughts of the viewpoint character, impertinent questions, and so on- will give more of the semblance of a real conversation. Some- like the narrator pausing to take a breath or take a drink of wine- will break up the infodump.
-Build up anticipation first, so that by the time the conversation rolls around, the reader is really interested in hearing what's going on.
-Write it as clearly as possible. Infodumps often get tangled in new and intricate names, passive voice, and obscure verbiage.
-Scatter bits. If some information can possibly be saved, save it.
Hope this helps!
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This should help a lot, thanks. :)
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