Reboots Are Us

Dec 29, 2012 19:50

Watching The Amazing Spider-man.

God, it's so slow - and I can't believe Garfield as the bullied and unpopular kid. Not the way he looks. On the other hand, the lady who plays Gwen has made her interesting for the first time in comic book history ( Read more... )

comic book, movie, film

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fatpie42 December 29 2012, 23:17:56 UTC
Confused. Peter becomes a vigilante BECAUSE of Uncle Ben. He's upset about Uncle Ben for the entire movie. He's even listening to that voicemail message (on his mobile phone you'll notice) after everything else has happened.

Whereas his main upset about Gwen's dad is that he promised her dad that he'd stop seeing Gwen. It's not really on the same scale at all.

I quite like how this Peter Parker feels more like a real person rather than a whiny geek stereotype. This and Chronicle are the only superhero movies to be released this year to contain something akin to real people.

But that's just my two cents.

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lil_shepherd December 30 2012, 05:40:03 UTC
If Peter is supposed to be upset about Ben (and what about May? Where is her grief?) then it is a big acting failure.

In fact, I agree with the critic who said this was meant to appeal to the Twilight crowd. It might possibly be effective as a teen romance - it is not effective as either an adventure or a superhero movie. Selling it as either of the latter is false pretenses.

Whatever it was, it sure wasn't Spider-man.

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fatpie42 December 30 2012, 13:30:55 UTC
I don't even remotely understand why you think Peter wasn't grieving. It's probably more likely the directing choice than Andrew Garfield's acting.

I'll admit that the romance was one of the better elements of this movie, but Raimi's films had always been trying to be romance films too. They were just no damn good at it.

I think the main reason why this isn't really Spider-Man yet is because it's taking its time over his origins. He's making all those mistakes that he felt so guilty about in the comics. When he's wrestling over his morality in the comics, it's always because of his past. This character will actually have the dark past which makes emotionally wrestling over every issue rather more sensible (and as we both know, he hasn't made all his early mistakes yet - though actually I'd rather they DIDN'T kill off Gwen - she was great).

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lil_shepherd December 30 2012, 15:49:43 UTC
It didn't engage. It was incredibly slow. And that allowed me to see all the errors of plot and characterisation while it was actually running. That is a big problem. Normally, if you don't see the plot holes until later, you can forgive the writer.

Peter here is acting out of revenge, not out of guilt. It destroys what was one of the best aspects of the character from the very first appearance back in Amazing Fantasy #15 - his agonised choice to use his powers against criminals instead to make money. Here, that choice isn't made. And he doesn't even get revenge.

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fatpie42 December 30 2012, 16:53:22 UTC
Peter here is acting out of revenge, not out of guilt.

Yes. He's not using his powers responsibly. That's what he always beats himself up about later, because he has to make these mistakes in order to learn from them. So the guilt comes later.

Naturally this isn't following the exact same pattern as the early comics. Even flashbacks of those comics don't always match up exactly with what actually happened. Comics have come a long way since those days and the whole wrestling thing doesn't really make a lot of sense. It's like with "X-Men". The earliest comic isn't really about being accepted in society in spite of differences, it's just about people with special powers. You immediately get the totally-evil Magneto maniacally announcing how he's the most powerful mutant in the world right from the word go. Storytelling in the movies needed to be a bit more refined than that.

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lil_shepherd December 30 2012, 17:19:12 UTC
Refined?

Simplistic, more like. (There are far more revenge-themed movies out there than guilt themed.) And anything more simplistic that original Lee scripts would be hard to find, but somehow they have managed it.

Admittedly, what Marvel are doing with Spider-man at the moment is a lot worse...

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fatpie42 December 30 2012, 17:33:27 UTC
I used to enjoy the Spider-Man comics a lot during the 90s, but it was a lot darker than I think a lot of fans of the Raimi films would really be keen on. This (image below) was a pretty iconic (if anything during that era of the comics can be called "iconic") image from that era. (For the record, Green Goblin appeared to be properly dead at this stage in the timeline. This is a "gotcha" from beyond the grave.)

If the movies ever bring us anything as cool as this, I'm pretty sure all your current annoyance will have been worth it. :)


... )

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lil_shepherd December 30 2012, 17:42:22 UTC
Oh, God... Okay. On your own head be it. Though you could look it up for yourself I suppose....

SPOILERS

Peter is dead in both the 616 and Ultimate universes. (In the latter, Spider-man is now a fourteen year old kid called Miles Morales, who has an enormous number of fans, including the 616 Peter Parker who got sent there in Bendis's Spider-men mini series.)

In 616, as I understand it, Doc Ock has taken on the identities of both Peter Parker (deceased) and Spider-man and no one notices, not even MJ when he tries to seduce her...

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fatpie42 December 30 2012, 18:07:23 UTC
Sorry, hang on. I mean, I'd heard about Miles Morales being a new Spider-Man and I suppose it makes sense that Peter Parker would die first. But.... Dr. Octopus has taken on Peter Parker's identity? How the hell does that work???

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lil_shepherd December 30 2012, 19:03:58 UTC
Don't ask me. I'm already getting this second hand...

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