I'll take the opposite viewpoint, just for shits and giggles.
A) "Jews for one do not believe that homosexuality is wrong; they also don't believe that premarital sex is wrong either." It's not that cut and dried. Judaism spilts over exactly where they stand on homosexual activity. Reform Judaism is fighting to argue that homosexuality is based on attraction, but Orthodox and Conservative Jews still contend that homosexuality is sinful, to the point of not appointing gay rabbis.
This split is seen exactly in Christian sects as well, with Lutheran, Presbyterianism and Unitarian Universalism pushing for a more refined look with acceptance of homosexuals. More stodgy Christian sects will hang on to old morals, but not all of Christianity (which is a massive body) can be blamed for this.
B) "Also, in America, we have this great thing called 'Separation of Church and State,' which ties in quite closely to the Freedom of Religion thing mentioned earlier." O rly? It's impossible to have a complete seperation of church and state in the United States. 'In GOD we trust.' Every session of Congress is opened with a prayer. Civil religion is entangled in everything we do in the US, and you can't seperate those two things.
C) "There has been scientific proof that gay men react to male pheromones (those nifty chemicals that make your brain react to someone else in an "attraction" sort of way) the same way straight men react to female pheromones. Scientific proof. Undisputed. Tried and true, tested and retested." Most scientists consider people to fall on the Kinsey scale of sexuality, with only a tiny (like 3% of the entire population) amount of people to be decidedly solely homosexual. Pheromones are still a debatable point of attraction. You can't just write off the entire argument on one experiment. I could just as easily point to this article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/325979.stm as UNDENIABLE proof that gay genetics is all bullshit.
D) "Hear that? That's the sound of the gay gene switching over." I also hear animals eating their young in regards to population control and during times of famine. If we want to compare humans to animals, cool. But one does not justify the other.
Also, if I'm to believe that homosexuality is okay in regards to population control, abortion is okay, too, right?
E) "Argument 3: Oh wait…are there anymore arguments?" How about the line in the sand argument? If one is to legalize gay marriage (two people of legal age who knowingly wish to be with one another), what is going to stop a challenge of that law with say, polygamy? Again, we have legal, consenting adults who wish to marry. We can exclude marrying children/animals/household objects/etc from this argument because they lack the ability to legally consent, but polygamy is something to consider. It's a slippery slope, yes, but one that can easily be followed with this line of logic.
F) "This is completely different from pedophiles or bestiality. Those people are not in their right mind." You're right. Gay people AREN'T pedophiles or have sex with animals. But, the same line of logic you've used to clear homosexuals (they can't CHOOSE to be gay) is true for both people who engage in pedophilia or bestiality. One could easily read this argument and decide that homosexuality (with the knowledge of knowing that it's all genetics) is just a freak genetic defect, just like Downs Syndrome or Klinefelter's syndrome.
G) "Please come up with valid, hard hitting points to prove your case, not Bible verses." (This is your argument, by the way)--->If gay people are genetically different from the majority of heterosexuals, and this was detectable pre-birth, it would be okay to abort that child solely based on that because I don't believe in Christianity, which condemns abortion. I want to spare a genetically crippled child from eating up resources.
A)I realize that I did not clarify that when I used "christian" arguments, I should have clarified "conservative". Lutherans are NOT pushing for a more accepted view of homosexuality, by the way. The ELCA might be...but that's about it.
B) It is damn near impossible to separate church and state, but I maintain that people should vote on what is logically good and equal for others, not what their particular religious doctrine tells them to.
F)I never stated that homosexuality was a genetic defect I just said that there have been studies to support that it's a born in trait and therefore genetically different, like hair color and eye color, it's not acquired through choices. This is kinda like the alcoholism debate...for as many articles to support it, there are just as many that don't.
G)Would it also be OK to abort a blonde child based on the stigma that blondes are dumb? I for one, don't want a dumb child
E) I don't have a problem with polygamy...we (as people) used to practice polygamy before anyway, and many cultures still do, and it works fine for them. If some people all wanna marry each other...fine.
D) Some people should have eaten their young. Abortion is currently practiced as population control. It hides under the "I can't support a child/I'm too young/I'm not mentally equipped" arguments, but it's basically just population control.
A) "Jews for one do not believe that homosexuality is wrong; they also don't believe that premarital sex is wrong either." It's not that cut and dried. Judaism spilts over exactly where they stand on homosexual activity. Reform Judaism is fighting to argue that homosexuality is based on attraction, but Orthodox and Conservative Jews still contend that homosexuality is sinful, to the point of not appointing gay rabbis.
This split is seen exactly in Christian sects as well, with Lutheran, Presbyterianism and Unitarian Universalism pushing for a more refined look with acceptance of homosexuals. More stodgy Christian sects will hang on to old morals, but not all of Christianity (which is a massive body) can be blamed for this.
B) "Also, in America, we have this great thing called 'Separation of Church and State,' which ties in quite closely to the Freedom of Religion thing mentioned earlier." O rly? It's impossible to have a complete seperation of church and state in the United States. 'In GOD we trust.' Every session of Congress is opened with a prayer. Civil religion is entangled in everything we do in the US, and you can't seperate those two things.
C) "There has been scientific proof that gay men react to male pheromones (those nifty chemicals that make your brain react to someone else in an "attraction" sort of way) the same way straight men react to female pheromones. Scientific proof. Undisputed. Tried and true, tested and retested." Most scientists consider people to fall on the Kinsey scale of sexuality, with only a tiny (like 3% of the entire population) amount of people to be decidedly solely homosexual. Pheromones are still a debatable point of attraction. You can't just write off the entire argument on one experiment. I could just as easily point to this article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/325979.stm as UNDENIABLE proof that gay genetics is all bullshit.
D) "Hear that? That's the sound of the gay gene switching over." I also hear animals eating their young in regards to population control and during times of famine. If we want to compare humans to animals, cool. But one does not justify the other.
Also, if I'm to believe that homosexuality is okay in regards to population control, abortion is okay, too, right?
E) "Argument 3: Oh wait…are there anymore arguments?" How about the line in the sand argument? If one is to legalize gay marriage (two people of legal age who knowingly wish to be with one another), what is going to stop a challenge of that law with say, polygamy? Again, we have legal, consenting adults who wish to marry. We can exclude marrying children/animals/household objects/etc from this argument because they lack the ability to legally consent, but polygamy is something to consider. It's a slippery slope, yes, but one that can easily be followed with this line of logic.
F) "This is completely different from pedophiles or bestiality. Those people are not in their right mind." You're right. Gay people AREN'T pedophiles or have sex with animals. But, the same line of logic you've used to clear homosexuals (they can't CHOOSE to be gay) is true for both people who engage in pedophilia or bestiality. One could easily read this argument and decide that homosexuality (with the knowledge of knowing that it's all genetics) is just a freak genetic defect, just like Downs Syndrome or Klinefelter's syndrome.
G) "Please come up with valid, hard hitting points to prove your case, not Bible verses." (This is your argument, by the way)--->If gay people are genetically different from the majority of heterosexuals, and this was detectable pre-birth, it would be okay to abort that child solely based on that because I don't believe in Christianity, which condemns abortion. I want to spare a genetically crippled child from eating up resources.
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B) It is damn near impossible to separate church and state, but I maintain that people should vote on what is logically good and equal for others, not what their particular religious doctrine tells them to.
F)I never stated that homosexuality was a genetic defect I just said that there have been studies to support that it's a born in trait and therefore genetically different, like hair color and eye color, it's not acquired through choices. This is kinda like the alcoholism debate...for as many articles to support it, there are just as many that don't.
G)Would it also be OK to abort a blonde child based on the stigma that blondes are dumb? I for one, don't want a dumb child
E) I don't have a problem with polygamy...we (as people) used to practice polygamy before anyway, and many cultures still do, and it works fine for them. If some people all wanna marry each other...fine.
D) Some people should have eaten their young. Abortion is currently practiced as population control. It hides under the "I can't support a child/I'm too young/I'm not mentally equipped" arguments, but it's basically just population control.
Well done Andrew.
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