Democracy and fascism
In the wake of the appalling news that I now have a fascist thug representing me in the European Parliament, I had an interesting conversation with ms_lilith and teadaemon about democracy and human rights and stuff.
It was late at night and I was a bit incoherent, so I thought I'd come back to it here and see what people had to say.
It seems to me just fundamentally wrong that we allow a fascist party to be part of our democratic system. It doesn't seem right that black and Asian taxpayers are now being forced to give money to disgusting racists whose ultimate goal is to deny them their rights and kick them out of the country.
Would it not be possible to have a bill of rights or constitution, some kind of foundational document for a society, which guarantees all citizens certain basic rights, and makes it very difficult for any official political party to propose policies that violate those rights? How does this work with the US constitution? Any political scientists out there who can help me out with this?
Or could the BNP weasel around even something like that, by talking in their official manifesto about 'voluntary repatriation' rather than concentration camps and deportations? Do we have to risk oppression and abuse slipping in by the back door like that?
I appreciate the argument that freedom of speech and association means we have to tolerate extreme views. But do we have to allow those views to be expressed in mainstream politics, and potentially enacted at the cost of other people's rights and even lives? Isn't that elevating fascists' freedom of speech above the basic rights of other citizens? Surely our rights always have to be accommodated and balanced with those of other members of our society.
This might be less of an issue if we had a genuinely democratic system. But we have an electoral system that means many people's votes are simply irrelevant, and mainstream parties that offer voters no significant choice.
People say we should just use our own freedom of speech to challenge the BNP and point out their inadequacies and stupidities. I get that, and I'll do it to the best of my abilities. But again, our media happily print lies and distortions about immigration and asylum which play into the hands of the BNP. And our mainstream political parties pander to those lies to gain votes. I don't believe our current systems allow a proper rational debate to take place, or all voices to be heard, and that's terrifying.
A simple fact is that wherever the BNP are elected, there is a rise in racist violence. People may die because we've allowed these thugs to gain power. I'm not sure what the answer is, but I just don't think that's how democracy should work.
Well, that's probably still very incoherent, but I'd like to hear what people think, and maybe make some sense of all this.
It was late at night and I was a bit incoherent, so I thought I'd come back to it here and see what people had to say.
It seems to me just fundamentally wrong that we allow a fascist party to be part of our democratic system. It doesn't seem right that black and Asian taxpayers are now being forced to give money to disgusting racists whose ultimate goal is to deny them their rights and kick them out of the country.
Would it not be possible to have a bill of rights or constitution, some kind of foundational document for a society, which guarantees all citizens certain basic rights, and makes it very difficult for any official political party to propose policies that violate those rights? How does this work with the US constitution? Any political scientists out there who can help me out with this?
Or could the BNP weasel around even something like that, by talking in their official manifesto about 'voluntary repatriation' rather than concentration camps and deportations? Do we have to risk oppression and abuse slipping in by the back door like that?
I appreciate the argument that freedom of speech and association means we have to tolerate extreme views. But do we have to allow those views to be expressed in mainstream politics, and potentially enacted at the cost of other people's rights and even lives? Isn't that elevating fascists' freedom of speech above the basic rights of other citizens? Surely our rights always have to be accommodated and balanced with those of other members of our society.
This might be less of an issue if we had a genuinely democratic system. But we have an electoral system that means many people's votes are simply irrelevant, and mainstream parties that offer voters no significant choice.
People say we should just use our own freedom of speech to challenge the BNP and point out their inadequacies and stupidities. I get that, and I'll do it to the best of my abilities. But again, our media happily print lies and distortions about immigration and asylum which play into the hands of the BNP. And our mainstream political parties pander to those lies to gain votes. I don't believe our current systems allow a proper rational debate to take place, or all voices to be heard, and that's terrifying.
A simple fact is that wherever the BNP are elected, there is a rise in racist violence. People may die because we've allowed these thugs to gain power. I'm not sure what the answer is, but I just don't think that's how democracy should work.
Well, that's probably still very incoherent, but I'd like to hear what people think, and maybe make some sense of all this.