Out of Character

Aug 23, 2008 22:33

I wasn't going to get involved, but I hate to see the kind of misogynistic madness that some women are coming out with. Is it some special fun-day for feminists? They all seem to be even stranger than usual today. A lot of people who usually seem quite sane are getting their knickers in a twist about abortion. Apparently, some evil new law ( Read more... )

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laura_holt_pi August 24 2008, 08:06:53 UTC
I don't know of any person who believes it is wrong to sterilise a woman who wants the procedure, but I would prefer a doctor not to give women those medications, because the Pill, for example, has been implicated in the sudden deaths of a lot of women in their thirties and some doctors hand them out like sweets.

The Pill is not just birth control. It works by causing an early abortion. It allows conception, but prevents implantation. For that reason, it's not acceptable to people who believe children have a right to life.

As a treatment for menstrual problems, it's irresponsible. It's not intended for that and doesn't solve the underlying problems. Incidentally, one of the most serious problems, that causes agony to women, is endometriosis, which is often caused by a previous abortion. All medication does for period problems is mask the symptoms. Frankly, women would be better off drinking yarrow and meadowsweet.

Most women seem woefully unaware of their bodies. Going to a gynaecologist on a regular basis is nowhere near as good as monitoring your own body and learning to deal with any problems. Women are too eager to give up responsibility to a doctor (often a man, who doesn't even have the same equipment!) Filling a woman's body full of poisonous substances to interrupt her normal cycle is a very silly idea. Far better to work out why things are going wrong and put them right.

We should not ask doctors to kill. In Britain, we do, we insist upon it. Not long ago, a doctor in Britain killed a lot of his elderly patients partly for money from their wills, but partly because he liked the power. It's very dangerous to create a situation where we ensure that the only doctors who can practice are the ones who are willing to take human lives.

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agreeing on a lot of points, but with a few nits... sidewinder August 24 2008, 14:22:27 UTC
the Pill, for example, has been implicated in the sudden deaths of a lot of women in their thirties and some doctors hand them out like sweets.

I totally agree that there are a lot of problems with the Pill (and hormonal treatments in general) which modern medicine - and modern women - choose to ignore. It's given out as a "quick fix" which, as you say, masks the symptoms without really treating the causes. As someone who's been working the last few months to fix my own hormonal imbalances naturally, I've done a lot of research on this and just don't understand how or why the Pill has often been prescribed for things like, for an example, ovarian cysts, when evidence points to them actually CAUSING cysts, or making cysts bigger in the long run even if they short term make them smaller. And that's just one example. Now it's being marketed as a way to allow women to avoid the "nastiness" of a monthly period, which I just find wholly bizarre and potentially a minefield of potential complications that just don't make sense to me.

I've never been on HBC and will refuse to go on it if ever suggested by a doctor. Diet--including avoiding hormonally-"enhanced" foods and products containing xenoestrogens, getting more exercise, and using natural herbs--can abate a lot of the problems we've caused our bodies in this modern world, and I do wish more women were aware of these things. I wish it hadn't taken me until my mid-30s and a health crisis of my own to figure this out.

One nit:
one of the most serious problems, that causes agony to women, is endometriosis, which is often caused by a previous abortion.

It is true abortions can be a factor, but so can any gynecological surgery - from removing a benign or malignant cyst (a procedure I must face myself next month, as no amount of natural treatment is going to make the type I have go away), c-section, etc, which are often medically necessary without getting into the ethics of abortion (as someone who would've been born dead if not for an emergency c-section delivery, I'll leave out the debatable issue of "elective" c-sections which are popular today with some women). Endo can also be genetic or from hormonal issues, which is why a lot of young women can develop it before ever being sexually active, let alone having had an abortion.

I am torn, personally, on the issue of abortion and would have a problem if I were a physician who had to perform it. Just as one of the reasons I never wanted to be a vet, as much as I love and have empathy for animals, is because I could not deal with being asked to put asleep animals just becaue their "owners" could not deal with health or behavioral issues, or doing procedures such as declawing that I find inhumane and unethical. Yet as much as I am personally morally opposed to abortion, I do believe in it as something a woman has a right to, because I cannot put myself in the circumstances of another (rape, abuse, abusive family, a high-risk pregnancy or a pregnancy where the child would have no chance of even short-term survival or quality of life...I've known people who have had to face each of these situations and make decisions about it, and I do not envy them.) I wish more was done to encourage adoption and safe practices, but I know that can't cover every circumstance that might come along.

But what should an individual doctor's ability to chose be? And should it be governmentally dictated? That is the question, and it's a tough one, I find, to answer.

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Re: agreeing on a lot of points, but with a few nits... laura_holt_pi August 24 2008, 14:48:51 UTC
I know abortion is not the only cause of endometriosis, but it does cause it often enough to make it clear that abortion can be a very bad thing for women.

I am also here because of a caesarean, although my mother knew she would have to have one. She had three altogether and, although I am not sure the first was needed, the other two probably were.

I gave up on doctors in the 80s. There were several reasons, from deep distrust of modern medicine to anger at the glee a doctor showed when stabbing me in the leg with an injection. A major factor supporting my avoidance of doctors is that I can't entrust my life to someone that I know would willingly kill a baby. If the smallest and weakest of us aren't safe, who is?

I decided that I will depend on herbs, and have done so for over 20 years. I hope that the next time a doctor sees me will be at the autopsy.

I'll never believe a woman has the right to kill another person, however closely related that person is. The rape argument is ridiculous, because women have been shown to recover better from rape if they continue with a pregnancy than if they end it. One woman who did have an abortion said it was like being raped again, but worse. A woman who had a son as a result of rape said he was the reason she went on living and managed to rebuild her life. Besides, we don't have the death penalty for the children of murderers, why should there be one for the children of rapists?

Quality of life is impossible to predict. My mother worked for many years with severely disabled children, including one so badly disabled that the doctors at her birth advised her mother to leave her there and forget she'd had a child. That girl became a truly happy adult who makes everyone who knows her adore her. One day, in a cafe, a woman at a nearby table said loudly, "I don't think people like that should be allowed to be born." and she stuck two fingers up at the stupid woman.

In any case, according to Planned Parenthood's own figures, rape and malformation and maternal risk combined make up less than 1% of all abortions.

A child that lives only an hour after birth can at least know an hour of love and can give his or her parents something precious. Between my brother's birth and mine, my mother lost a child in an early miscarriage. She still considers every moment she had as the mother of that child precious.

Her final child was conceived after doctors told her she would not survive another c-section. They said there was every chance a baby would die too. When she found out she was pregnant again, she was advised to abort. As a loving mother, who had already lost one child, she said she could never do that. She had a near-death experience on the operating table, but she and my sister both survived. Whenever anyone promotes abortion, I think of the world without my sister, who is undoubtedly the best of us. Had my mother listened to medical advice, she would have killed my sister. And I would not have grown up with the strong relationship I have with my mother if I knew she had killed one of us. As it is, I grew up knowing that she risked her own life to give my sister a chance, which made it pretty clear that we mattered to her.

A woman's right extends to refusing sex or choosing whether or not to use contraception. A woman's right can never overrule the basic human right her child has to life.

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